tomato coupe

That legend dates back many decades, when Wisconsin roads were some of the best in the country. Now, they are among the the worst (ranked 49th) in the country. It would be prudent to ride a gravel bike on the paved roads in Wisconsin.

tomato coupe

Not a math person, are you? If your number was true, and every person on the planet bought a gravel bike, only one would be riding that trail.

rosefarts

Geez, I was planning to say the same thing.

Branko D

Yes, let's look at them. Those look like 23mm tires, so I guess the typical modern road bike has wider tires (it also has better brakes, easier gearing, more functional gearing with STIs, wider handlebars and so on - even clutched derailleurs). Wherever you took one of those road bikes, you could take a modern road bike unless you're afraid of CF spontaneously exploding (which it won't) or modern wheels falling apart (which, if you're anywhere near normal cyclist weight, they won't, either - modern wheels are no weaker than the old wheels you're seeing there).

I'm just not seeing how old road bikes were better adapted to offroading and hence more versatile then modern ones, unless you go way back to the interwar era, which was, well, far before our time. Once asphalt became common, you got 700c wheels with narrow tires, just like you'd ride today. Sure, if most of your rides feature light offroading, then obviously a gravel bike is optimized for that, but that's not because road bikes became more specialized for pavement only than they used to be.

HTupolev

Prior to the mid-1980s, outside of some "racing" models, it was very normal for road bikes to take tire widths comparable to what most "endurance" road bikes handle today. 28mm-32mm was pretty normal for stock tire sizes, and even 32mm sometimes left very generous clearances. Here's my '79 Fuji, handling 27mm tires under wide full-length fenders just fine:



This particular bike also came stock with a 110BCD crankset and a rear derailleur with around 35 teeth of wrap that can handle cogs of at least 32T. Originally the bike had a 36-30 low gear, on my current setup it's a very similar 34-28, both of which pretty normal by modern road standards. Granted, this bike is an exception: most old road bikes do have very narrow gearing range (frustratingly, for no apparent real technical reason).

I do agree that, on the whole, most current road bikes are more reasonable for graveling than what Jobst Brandt rode. That the article that's being referenced explicitly says that Brandt was repeatedly snapping his frameset makes it fairly questionable to use as proof that those bikes were well-suited to the task at hand.

unterhausen

When I rode in Wisconsin 2 years ago, I was riding 32mm tires and I really wish I was riding bigger. Those roads are rougher than any I have ridden on gravel. I thought I was going to have pinch flats in Green Bay. The bike trails are nice, if you are going that direction.

Grotug

Your post starts out nice and intelligent until you start saying gravel riding is slow and boring. There aren’t any rules for gravel riding. Sometimes they are fast, sometimes slow and sometimes technical: flying down steep, twisty dirt roads at the absolute limit is a total blast! Riding up really rough, steep gravel roads when gravel exploring can be *super* challenging and exhilarating and a *helluva* workout. I love that I can basically go mountain biking on my gravel bike and then haul ass on the road during a mixed ride. The speed of my gravel bike (Origin8) allows me to explore much farther than if I just took my mountain bike and the challenge of pushing the bike over very diverse and disparate terrain is very fun and satisfying in the name of spontaneity and throwing caution to the wind.

Gravel riding is so much fun! Especially when the gravel turns to an old, forgotten foot path or a steep, rugged mountain. It’s all about exploration and adventure for me.

Finally, have you not seen the excellent Tyler Pierce film featuring Jeremiah Bishop? It’s probably my favorite film about cycling and I strongly urge all cyclists to watch it, even if Tyler’s “bro” persona can be a little bit much at times.

The Impossible Route:

You Tube

Reflector Guy

I'm fairly indifferent. I live in DuPage County IL so there really aren't any gravel roads, unless I load up my bike on the car and drive to them. Kane County, Dekalb County, Ogle County..... Lots of them there though. They're slightly more hilly and scenic too. Can't do that on short notice though so I ride on the rail-trails close to home which are hardpacked limestone screenings so I get the same kind of dust as a gravel road but they're usually smooth as silk unless they're in bad repair.

Sometimes I load up the car and go down to Will County and ride the Old Plank Road Trail which is asphalt but it is far bumpier than the limestone trails close to home. Expansion joints, or roots, or something.... Bone jarring bumps. That trail cries out for a fatter and more compliant tire than the limestone trails ever will.

Rides4Beer

If gravel riding is slow and boring, then that's your fault. I've felt more exhilaration (and fear! lol) on gravel then I ever have on the road.

Milton Keynes

Here's why I do it: Firstly, I live in a small town in a rural area. Aside from the highway running through town (which my wife doesn't like for me to ride on due to the high traffic speeds) there are only a couple of paved roads in & out of town. Secondly, there are a lot of interesting places to see that can only be reached via gravel. For instance, one thing I've always been fascinated by since I was a kid is old bridges. Most of them are on gravel roads way out in the middle of nowhere. The only way to reach them by bike is by riding gravel. And lastly, not being limited to the two paved roads and highway means I can ride in numerous directions and go various places via a network of gravel roads which intersect about every mile, so I don't have to settle for route boredom by riding the same few paved roads all the time. I can expand my horizons and see a lot more of the countryside than I could on a skinny tire road bike.

Oh, and also to add, I have a lot of friends who like to ride on gravel, so when we do group rides on gravel I can join them on my gravel bike.

Milton Keynes

I agree. Gravel to me is a somewhat leisurely ride to interesting local places I can't easily reach on my skinny-tire road bike. It's about getting out and enjoying the day and slowing down to see parts of the country I don't always get to see and riding routes I don't normally get to ride.

vespasianus

Why Gravel? Because of Tomac silly.

u235

I did not read the entire thread so this may have been mentioned.
I actively seek the path less traveled, dirt, gravel, off road, the trail etc. I will ALWAYS turn off the paved road when given the chance. I am exclusively a solo rider. I would never purposely do a century of just road unless I was going for the destination, not the ride. I've done many mixed terrain with less than 5 miles of a road in the mix.
Why? When I am on the road with head down pedaling away it is nothing more than a 100% physical challenge and activity. Me riding the bike is secondary and basically just sub conscience autopilot as a platform for my legs to spin. The only challenge is managing my endurance as I get from point A to point B. Pedal and pace yourself, stay close to the road edge and hum along, make a left turn at the intersection and rinse, repeat. There is no mental effort or stimulation with that other than pure raw physical and the mental part to keep the physical going. As roads change they are just different physical challenges, I am on the bike to keep it upright.
Riding off road is total different, you have the same physical demands and endurance management but with an added mental component. You could argue some crushed limestone railtrails are boring though. Your mind is involved, it is constantly changing, you are riding the bike and controlling it for valid reasons, not just pedaling it. There is more to the experience than putting your head down and doing a physical challenge. That mental piece is much welcomed. May or may not be related but I absolutely can't ride a bike on a trainer, I just can't do it. Same with a treadmill. Oddly I like the Elliptical, maybe I have nothing outdoors to compare it to

As for the proper bike, marketing and what you can and can't do on any given bike made 100 years compared to now.. That's a minefield.
If you want to venture off road with your 23-28 tires, have at it and no need for you to buy anything else if it works.

Aladin

Exactly.

SELDOM.. does one read words of wisdom in this neck of the 'gravel'.

Milton Keynes

Uh, no. I want to see you handle some of the gravel around here on 700x25c skinny tires. It can be hairy, to say the least. Even on my MTB with 26x1.95 tires there are places it's a bit scary to ride because of the loose gravel.

mstateglfr 

Because the cyclists find value in it. That value could be enjoyment, exercise, exploration, challenge, safety, or any number of other reasons.
Regardless, its done because there is value derived from it.

Why do people do things?...value.

tomato coupe

I'm trying to reconcile your statement with why this thread was started, and I'm coming up empty.

mstateglfr 

Your hot takes on topics are a hoot. I really do enjoy them. And you dont mind or are unaware of all the gaping holes in your comments that others run right thru, so its quite entertaining to read.


1- Gravel bikes arent a marketing concept. the activity existed before bike brands started designing and marketing for it.
2- Rocks hitting a frame isnt much of a concern for me. Paint stops most rocks and if it chips, then touch it up. Or leave it. Either way, it isnt a big deal.
3- Dirt getting in gears is the reality of a lot of cycling- CX and MTB are kinda dirty too. Dirt in gears is not a valid reason for many to not buy nice bikes. Perhaps everyone with nice gravel, cx, and mtb frames are out of their minds, as you suggest.
4- I havent found my riding to be boring. If I did, I wouldnt do it.
5- My gravel rides are not short and they are not slow. They are as long as I choose and as fast as I am able to ride. Your claim is absurd.
6- I cant imagine spending $10000 on a bike either, but that is because I dont find value in it. Regardless of what someone spends on a bike, if they enjoy it, then what harm is there and what does it matter to you? Also, the speed at which they ride their expensive bike has no bearing on if its a good purchase or if riding on gravel is fun.
7- The fad may fade. Or it may transform. Or the popularity may lessen, but it continue. MTB was a boom a few decades ago and while that has since dropped, MTB is still very much around. Apply that to gravel.


Seriously, please dont stop with your comments as they are entertaining for many.

mstateglfr 

Haha, touche.

There is value in learning(doubt that is being done though). There is value in seeing what comes of a thread you start from an entertainment perspective, I guess.

mstateglfr 

You make multiple references to how unfortunate it is that higher level cycling is dipping its toe into gravel events. What is so bad about it?
Higher level cycling participating doesnt mean it gravel will be off limits to you and others.

tomato coupe

That's just trolling.

Aladin

Or... peddling 'gravy' bikes. Lots .. and lots.. of industry wags around. High profit those flavors. MOST.. all of the bike industry today is
mostly male cow dung.. selling far east junk whereas what is called bike companies--->now marketing concerns make the coin. That is
our 21st century.

Some dudes and dud-ettes like to bling.. bikes.. why not. If it be a new graveler.. what the hey. $$ moving locally.. that works.

Kapusta

This comparison of modern road bikes vs older road bikes really beside the point.

The issue here is how modern gravel bikes compare to modern road bike.

Yes, modern road bikes have a lot of advantages over older ride bikes which could possibly make them perform better on many surfaces perhaps even including gravel (though I am a little doubtful)

But modern gravel bikes have those same advantages plus bigger tires and more relaxed geometry than most modern road (pavement) bikes.

tomato coupe

Just another short, slow, boring gravel ride ...

tomato coupe

Coherent, complete sentences are your friend.