Carlton or Raleigh Build - Which Way To Go..?
08-08-21, 05:13 PM
#1
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Carlton or Raleigh Build - Which Way To Go..?
Normally, I would not even consider changing the livery or brand of a bicycle when repainting it. That said, I am faced with a dilemma of choice for the first time in my experience.
This 1968 Carlton Corsair started life as a 1968 Raleigh Grand Prix or visa versa. The paint is challenged as is the art work...
Were it not for the Raleigh head badge, there would be no choice presented. but the is a Raleigh head badge...
So, should I street restore a Carlton Capris or a Raleigh Grand Prix?
Also, the top tube near the head tube lug work is a wee bit squashed. The damage, if it is damage, is barely noticeable but it is there. You can also best see this in the first picture. The tube does not appear to be bent but some paint has flaked off. What the heck would cause this abnormality..?
This 1968 Carlton Corsair started life as a 1968 Raleigh Grand Prix or visa versa. The paint is challenged as is the art work...
Were it not for the Raleigh head badge, there would be no choice presented. but the is a Raleigh head badge...
So, should I street restore a Carlton Capris or a Raleigh Grand Prix?
Also, the top tube near the head tube lug work is a wee bit squashed. The damage, if it is damage, is barely noticeable but it is there. You can also best see this in the first picture. The tube does not appear to be bent but some paint has flaked off. What the heck would cause this abnormality..?
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08-08-21, 06:01 PM
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My uneducated guess is the top tube was deformed in a collision, Randy. You may be able to roll some of it out with a set of inexpensive frame blocks from Paragon Machine.
As far as the livery, Carlton has more panache, but it does have a Raleigh head badge. Did they label frames with both brands some years?
As far as the livery, Carlton has more panache, but it does have a Raleigh head badge. Did they label frames with both brands some years?
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08-08-21, 06:17 PM
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My uneducated guess is the top tube was deformed in a collision, Randy. You may be able to roll some of it out with a set of inexpensive frame blocks from Paragon Machine.
As far as the livery, Carlton has more panache, but it does have a Raleigh head badge. Did they label frames with both brands some years?
As far as the livery, Carlton has more panache, but it does have a Raleigh head badge. Did they label frames with both brands some years?
As for the non-round tube, my guess would be a collision of some kind, also. That said, the fork and front wheel show no damage indication such damage. To that add that, knowing many old Raleigh bikes, the apparent damage might well have originated at the factory during the building of the frame. My experience is that Raleighs, built back then, were not all that well made when craftsmanship was the issue.
Anyway, I foolishly sold my frame blocks years ago and intend to use this, found at the dump, vice to round out the top tube...
After which, I will rough build the bike and take it out for some test riding. If satisfied with the feel and performance, it will become my next build, brushed on paint job and all...
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08-08-21, 06:35 PM
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Well, the 1967 Raleigh catalog shows a “Raleigh Carlton” model:
08-08-21, 06:39 PM
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Carlton
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08-08-21, 07:22 PM
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Something fell on the tube? Attempted child seat?
Don't be a fool and caveman it with that vise, you'll only make it worse. Spend the $25 and get Paragon Machine Works' 1" frame blocks: https://www.paragonmachineworks.com/...be-blocks.html, put them in the stoutest vise you have, and roll it out with lots of grease. Do NOT expect the frame block screws to do the clamping job for you; they're not made for that.
-Kurt
Don't be a fool and caveman it with that vise, you'll only make it worse. Spend the $25 and get Paragon Machine Works' 1" frame blocks: https://www.paragonmachineworks.com/...be-blocks.html, put them in the stoutest vise you have, and roll it out with lots of grease. Do NOT expect the frame block screws to do the clamping job for you; they're not made for that.
-Kurt
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08-08-21, 08:02 PM
#7
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I'd do the restoration as a Carlton. I'm not aware of any year of Raleigh Grand Prix ever having chromed lugs like your bike.
As far as the cross-badging is concerned, you are not alone. I have a Super Course mixte frame and fork that has a Raleigh headbadge but Carlton decals on the downtube.
As far as the cross-badging is concerned, you are not alone. I have a Super Course mixte frame and fork that has a Raleigh headbadge but Carlton decals on the downtube.
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08-08-21, 09:32 PM
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Another vote for Carlton decals even with the Raleigh Headbadge. Like daka, I too have a 68 Super Course (67 serial number) with a Raleigh Anniversary badge and Carlton Decals, I couldn’t be happier about it. This happened in 1968 at Worksop, abnormal is completely normal in this era. Chrome lugs say Carlton and so do it’s present decals. I like it!
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08-09-21, 09:45 AM
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I may have been unclear. The Chrome Lugs and Carlton decals line you quoted was in Reference to the OPs bike. If you’re wondering about my Super Courses bottom bracket threading, I believe it was French threaded, but I haven’t serviced it in awhile so I could be mistaken.
08-09-21, 12:09 PM
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Carlton, of course. No bias on my part. 
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Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
"Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing." --Theodore Roosevelt
Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
08-09-21, 04:00 PM
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@oneclick has a good thought there. Measure the bottom bracket width - if it is 68mm wide, you know it was Carlton-built. A Nottingham built Raleigh is likely to have the wider Raleigh bottom bracket.
