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Answer a Moral Dilemma: To Render Aid or Not

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Answer a Moral Dilemma: To Render Aid or Not

Old 02-27-22, 11:30 AM
  #51  
soyabean
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Originally Posted by Juan Foote
There were two young ladies with a flat standing around fretting about it and a friend and I got out and got their tire changed for them. Not one WORD was said the whole time about anyone else being on the way. Right as we are getting finished up, the BF of one of them gets there and had the audacity to get out and act like an ******* because "some guys" were (apparently) trying to get in their pants by doing something nice. Even worse was that not only did the ladies not try and defend our action, tell him that we hadn't been forward in any manner of way, but didn't bother to say thank you either. No good deed.
Consider how else this could have turned out.

The two women could have called the police on you guys, make accusations of assault, and now you are cuffed and enjoy a nice overnite stay in a cell.

Don't believe it could happen? Are you willing to bet money against it?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...pologises.html

Sorry but #metoo has messed things up for the rest of the ladies that deserve male chivalry. I prefer to invest my time in me and my family instead of playing female games.

Last edited by soyabean; 02-27-22 at 11:33 AM.
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Old 02-27-22, 11:32 AM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by soyabean
Consider how else this could have turned out.

The two women could have called the police on you guys, make accusations of assault, and now you are cuffed and enjoy a nice overnite stay in a cell.

Don't believe it could happen? Are you willing to bet money against it?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...pologises.html
You keep citing this news item. You do realize, I hope, that it was newsworthy precisely because it is so unusual?
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Old 02-27-22, 11:33 AM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by soyabean
Consider how else this could have turned out.

The two women could have called the police on you guys, make accusations of assault, and now you are cuffed and enjoy a nice overnite stay in a cell.

Don't believe it could happen? Are you willing to bet money against it?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...pologises.html

Oh, of no doubt things like this happen every day. We felt fairly confident being in a very busy parking lot with loads of people around but just the same, could have been bad. To be fair, any human interaction can go bad very quickly whether intentions are good or not.

edit- Would mention here that the other day my wife took our truck to the store for groceries, backed out of the parking spot and something inside the steering column broke in relation to the shifter linkage or cable. Truck fell into neutral and would not move. She is in the middle of the isle on a Saturday, people waiting for spots. Had to be at least 6 young strong physically capable men available who sat/stood by and watched my wife push our truck out of the way while jerks beeped horns at her. Your idea of chivalry is long dead and bloated.

Last edited by Juan Foote; 02-27-22 at 11:37 AM.
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Old 02-27-22, 11:37 AM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by Juan Foote
Oh, of no doubt things like this happen every day. We felt fairly confident being in a very busy parking lot with loads of people around but just the same, could have been bad.
You just proved my point.

What did you have to gain, vs. what you can actually stand to lose?

If I saw two women in a shopping mall carpark as you did, I would just ignore them, drive home, grab out my bike and start cycling and enjoy it.
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Old 02-27-22, 11:37 AM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by soyabean
Consider how else this could have turned out.

The two women could have called the police on you guys, make accusations of assault, and now you are cuffed and enjoy a nice overnite stay in a cell.

Don't believe it could happen? Are you willing to bet money against it?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...pologises.html

Sorry but #metoo has messed things up for the rest of theladies that deserve male chivalry. I prefer to invest my time in me and my family instead of playing female games.
This statement explains a lot.
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Old 02-27-22, 11:39 AM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by Koyote
This statement explains a lot.
Yesh, the follow up was just as cringey.

The single biggest reason I don't offer to help people now has much more to do with my own physical issues than the desire to take a chance and be helpful to a stranger.
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Old 02-27-22, 11:42 AM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by ArneDarvin
I've been burned in the past by offering aid
Originally Posted by Koyote
This statement explains a lot.
Exactly.

I've luckily never had in an incident in my lifetime offering help, and because of what I now hear from others, I have stopped.

My family is my priority, not games from strangers.
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Old 02-27-22, 11:42 AM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by Juan Foote
Yesh, the follow up was just as cringey.

The single biggest reason I don't offer to help people now has much more to do with my own physical issues than the desire to take a chance and be helpful to a stranger.
"Cringey" is an apt description.

Funny how the poster managed, with just one sentence, to both complain about AND justify women's increasing refusal to put up with boorish (and worse) behavior from men.
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Old 02-27-22, 11:46 AM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by Juan Foote
Had to be at least 6 young strong physically capable men available who sat/stood by and watched my wife push our truck out of the way while jerks beeped horns at her. Your idea of chivalry is long dead and bloated.
My point exactly. You confirmed it is dead and no longer exists.

Those poor 6 young strong physically capable men don't want to end up in jail.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:06 PM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by Juan Foote
There were two young ladies with a flat standing around fretting about it and a friend and I got out and got their tire changed for them. Not one WORD was said the whole time about anyone else being on the way. Right as we are getting finished up, the BF of one of them gets there and had the audacity to get out and act like an ******* because "some guys" were (apparently) trying to get in their pants by doing something nice. Even worse was that not only did the ladies not try and defend our action, tell him that we hadn't been forward in any manner of way, but didn't bother to say thank you either.
Those two young ladies already called their boyfriends for help and were waiting for him to come and change their flat tire...You and your friend had no business getting involved...The boyfriend had a right to be pissed off.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:13 PM
  #61  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Those two young ladies already called their boyfriends for help and were waiting for him to come and change their flat tire...You and your friend had no business getting involved...The boyfriend had a right to be pissed off.
This conveys more about you than about common decency.

If someone changed a tire for my girlfriend (or wife), I would thank them profusely. Why would I be 'pissed off' at someone who was kind to my loved one?
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Old 02-27-22, 12:16 PM
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I carry extra parts and always asked if they would Like Help.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:21 PM
  #63  
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Originally Posted by Koyote
You keep citing this news item. You do realize, I hope, that it was newsworthy precisely because it is so unusual?
Not unusual at all. I am sure these type of situations happen all the time everyday...Unsolicited help and unsolicited advice can get you into serious trouble, you just don't know the other persons background and motives.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:21 PM
  #64  
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Originally Posted by 10 Wheels
I carry extra parts and always asked if they would Like Help.
Same here.

Bros help bros all the time. There are no games between bros. This includes gay men that are so totally cool when I help them on bike routes.

The problem is when you may run into fun-filled females that loves to game men.

No thanks.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:23 PM
  #65  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Those two young ladies already called their boyfriends for help and were waiting for him to come and change their flat tire...You and your friend had no business getting involved...The boyfriend had a right to be pissed off.
He explained that nothing was said about anyone else being on the way. The girls were ungrateful snots and the boyfriends were overcompensating for something to act that way.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:24 PM
  #66  
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Originally Posted by ArneDarvin
I've been burned in the past by offering aid
Originally Posted by wolfchild
Not unusual at all. I am sure these type of situations happen all the time everyday...Unsolicited help and unsolicited advice can get you into serious trouble, you just don't know the other persons background and motives.
Agreed.

I get it.

You get it.

The OP gets it.

The oppostion poster doesn't get it ... yet. It will happen to them too one day
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Old 02-27-22, 12:26 PM
  #67  
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Originally Posted by Chuck M
He explained that nothing was said about anyone else being on the way. The girls were ungrateful snots and the boyfriends were overcompensating for something to act that way.
Right.

And in the end: was the experience worth it? Much gained?

No thanks.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:30 PM
  #68  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Not unusual at all. I am sure these type of situations happen all the time everyday...Unsolicited help and unsolicited advice can get you into serious trouble, you just don't know the other persons background and motives.
Another completely unsubstantiated claim.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by soyabean

And in the end: was the experience worth it? Much gained?
It gave us cyclists something to argue about on internet forums and school one another on moral virtues.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by soyabean
My point exactly. You confirmed it is dead and no longer exists.

Those poor 6 young strong physically capable men don't want to end up in jail.
I would honestly hate to live with the mindset of fear that you apparently do. I hope you can get that worked out. Not everyone is out to get you. Most people don't care enough to put effort into it.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Koyote
Another completely unsubstantiated claim.
I'm not defending anyone in this. Just giving insight into the origins. I'm in my mid to later 30's now. My parents sat me down around the time boys start courting girls in school and gave me the "be careful talk". Basically telling me that if the daddy didn't care for me dating someone they could end me by making false claims and I'd be done for. This was in the late 90's early 2000's.

So, the sentiment of "caution" when a guy is around a girl is likely as old as time. Whether it makes any dang sense or not.

I've never not helped a person, but I usually knew the area well and there were passerby every few seconds anyway. Feel it out like "is this under a poorly lit sketchy bridge", or is this in broad daylight in a busy area? If someone is under the bridge, offer help but tell them it has to be in broad daylight on the corner where people or cars are passing.

Oddly enough, the only time it's been a male/female help situation with just two of us was me being the one needing help. I haven't carried a multitool since losing my favorite and having an expensive nice one totally fall apart on me. My bad. I had a chainring bolt backout on the cross bike and I caught it before it caused problems, but I couldn't get it in nor out without a tool. I'd preferred remove it and ride the few miles home to fix it. A seasoned gravel/mountainbiker lady stopped, tossed me their multitool and I was on my way in a minute.

Also in the day of GPS's you have proof of your whereabouts, and most folks have a HRM going to it also. So if you're chasing someone around doing illegal stuff it would show it. So your only real fear is "getting jumped" in a setup situation to rob people. But for that, know where you are. You can also always start recording on the your phone and leave it in your pocket if you're paranoid.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:59 PM
  #72  
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Originally Posted by wolfchild
Those two young ladies already called their boyfriends for help and were waiting for him to come and change their flat tire...You and your friend had no business getting involved...The boyfriend had a right to be pissed off.

I can see that POV, but would also mention that all they had to do was say something. Instead, they opened the trunk and let us do the job knowing what they knew. Jerky.
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Old 02-27-22, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Chuck M
He explained that nothing was said about anyone else being on the way. The girls were ungrateful snots and the boyfriends were overcompensating for something to act that way.

Thank you.
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Old 02-27-22, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by soyabean
Right.

And in the end: was the experience worth it? Much gained?

No thanks.
This thread began as a discussion about helping other cyclists. Somehow it was assumed that the situation in the OP was a domestic violence issue. Then it went into a whole thing about me too and it isn't worth it to be enough of a decent human being to even ask anyone if they need help. I'm sure if I thought long and hard about it, I can think of situations where I did not think it was needed for me to get involved and I may come across some of them in the future. But if I do come across those situations, I hope that I feel the need to not get involved is due to instinct, not anecdotal accounts on a message board or just being apathetic toward my fellow human beings.

When I was a kid, I could not see how what happened to Kitty Genovese happened. Now rapes get video recorded on cell phones.
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Old 02-27-22, 01:13 PM
  #75  
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Originally Posted by burnthesheep
If someone is under the bridge, offer help but tell them it has to be in broad daylight on the corner where people or cars are passing.
Unlike some others here, you got it and hit it right on the nose.
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