rodscot

I am trying to overhaul my wife's old Townshend bike. It has a 3 ring crankset and a set of old Shimano shifters. The left shifter had become really pretty knackered and was proving almost impossible to shift onto the big ring. So...... I decided to try to upgrade the shifters to indexed ones. The right shifter has not been a problem, but the left is refusing to go up to the big ring. I have made adjustments to the derailleur and I can get it to move to the large ring by pulling on the cable, but the shifter refused to go to that point on the shifter and, therefore, drops back to the middle ring.

Is it possible to to upgrade friction shifters with indexed ones or have I made a faux pas here by trying this in the first place. If so, what is the best way to remedy this? Is a derailleur upgrade likely to be the answer or should I go back to the friction shifter?

I have attached a couple of pics to help

Original friction shifter


The replacement Shimano SL-TX50 left indexed shifter.

SkyDog75

It depends on whether the particular derailleurs are index-compatible; that is, whether the cable pull ratio is correct and the derailleur moves one cog over per one click on the shifter.

Sounds like you might just need to reposition the shift cable at the front derailleur. Loosen the cable clamp, pull a little more cable through, and retighten.

le mans

you could try servicing the derailleur, a good clean with crc or wd-40 and give all the moving joints a lube
also check the cables, actually..i'd check the cables first, unhook it from the derailluer..to see how freely the housing slide.

the shifter can be cleaned and lubed too

i tend to prefer friction shifters at the front, or the types that click... which could be considered if the shifter needs replacement

rodscot

I was beginning to wonder this myself. One click does seem only to move the derailleur over one cog from small to middle rings, however, I cant be clear if the cage has moved slightly too far.

I have tried moving the cable quite a bit. but will get back to some more adjusting in the morning to see if I can make this thing work.

rodscot

Thanks. I have done a lot of cleaning on the derailleur. And the shifters and cables are new. I was a bit surprised that the new cables seemed 'stickier' than the old ones and it seems that they have some grease inside them rather than simply oil.

Can you get sifters that click but are not indexed? I thought that this went together.

Bill Kapaun

Are you sure the cable is adjusted correctly?
Sounds like there is too much slack.
Start from step ONE.
Park Tool Co. » ParkTool Blog » Front Derailleur Adjustments

Some friction shifters have kind of a "ratchet" action that will have more clicks than shifts.

bikeman715

Make sure the cable is on the correct side of the bolt on the derailleur , if not it can throw off the derailleur when shifting .

rodscot

I have tried a few attempts at adjusting the cable and little improvement. Tomorrow I will have a fresh head and new start on it. I will see what happens then.

rodscot

I am pretty sure that it is in the right position now. It was not but, I have since moved it to the head side of the bolt and not the nut side.

Al1943

I tend to agree. Friction shifting is as good or better than indexed for the crankset.

Most road bikes with index shifting do not index with one click for each chainring. Most Shimano triple front shifters have four or five index positions for three chainrings. My Campy shifters have 6 equally spaced positions for 2 chainrings, and I only use 3 of those.

Pro-tour riders often use friction shifting in the front to reduce total weight.

Wilfred Laurier

That is not the mistake normally made that causes poor shifting and requires extremely high cable tension to `move the derailleur. Most older derailleurs have a washer with a little tab and the cable must run over the tab, not under it, although running the cable under the tab seems to make sense.

Wilfred Laurier

Wha?

Al1943

Good catch. I can't believe I typed that. Must be the Alzheimer's.
Fixed

Wilfred Laurier

Maybe proof reading is the cure for Alzheimer's.

D1andonlyDman

I also prefer friction shifting for the front - especially when using a triple crank.

SkyDog75

I don't think so. I forget I wrote the stuff and end up complaining about other peoples' spelling. ;-)

rodscot

Hmm, this rings a bell. The derailleur catch does have a tab - not on a washer - and I did run it under that tab. I will try to run it over the tab and see what happens. When I get a chance, I will take a pic of the derailleur and it may make things easier to imagine.

le mans

it must be the right cable if it fits in the shifter, even if the housing is thicker which might be meant for the brakes...one would think it would slide even better
ok so you've got a handle on the servicng and could be just an adjustment problem

as far as that goes everybody gave the right advise
just make sure the stops are adjusted correctly, maybe the adjustment screw for the high gear [large ring] is screwed in too far..preventing the derailleur to reach the large ring properly

yes you can get front shifters that are inbetween friction and indexted

btw, grease is good for the cables

le mans

oh you said 'stickier' not thicker so disregard that

maybe put the old cables back on if there's nothing wrong with them

rodscot

Well, I started from scratch again and this time did run the cable over the tab at the back of the clamp. And with some adjustments and general tooing and froing I have got it working. Yay! So, I think the tab was pretty relevant and looking at it it would be pretty impossible to shift to the top ring with the cable at the angle it was with the cable in the wrong position. The more the derailleur swings across, the more the cable gets 'locked' between the clamp and the tab. So many thanks, Wilfred.

rodscot

A lot of adjustments were required. However, I think I got there in the end.

Now to get rid of that annoying brake squeal...............

Wilfred Laurier

Bah! Brakes only slow you down.

rodscot

Or in the case of this bike........ make you deaf!

Goodwillguy

I realize this is a very old thread, but I just wanted to thank you for this very correct piece of advice. Running the cable over the tab seems completely opposite of how it should work, but after hours of trying to get my derailleur to work with new shifters this is what finally solved the problem. Very thankful for this info! Thanks.

Wilfred Laurier

NP.

It's nice to know 16 years of toil in the dark back of bike shops had some value beyond my earning slightly more than minimum wage through my 20s. 👍