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Branding Shimano 600ax aero bikes.

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Branding Shimano 600ax aero bikes.

Old 03-05-20, 10:21 AM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes View Post
You have to understand, my reality is, well, different.
I was actually just showing the brakes, that's all.
You know what they say, reality is for people who canít handle drugs. 🤪😁😉 I like the brakes, too. 👍
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Old 12-06-20, 01:56 AM
  #27  
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National Aero III 1982

Originally Posted by Hubertus View Post


600 ax groepset


Aero cover!


Shimano 600ax and Tange aero frame

I own a nameless early aero bike with a special Tange frame and a Shimano 600 ax group on it. I have seen these being branded as: Jan Janssen, Norta, Diamant and Plum.
No doubt there are many more.
Show me yours ! Do they qualify for Eroica events as the year is 1982?

I also have a similar bike, NATIONAL Aero III (3) wi










with ADAMAS AX groupset. Seems to be a MATSU****A made bike as the serial number matches the Panasonic style. (serial 2B15629) so another 1982 February build.
I am assuming this could be called a National Panasonic (maybe).
All original from the 1st owner except the seat.
Still has 27" Panasonic gumwalls on it.
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Old 12-06-20, 08:07 AM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by weeredok View Post
I also have a similar bike, NATIONAL Aero III (3) wi










with ADAMAS AX groupset. Seems to be a MATSU****A made bike as the serial number matches the Panasonic style. (serial 2B15629) so another 1982 February build.
I am assuming this could be called a National Panasonic (maybe).
All original from the 1st owner except the seat.
Still has 27" Panasonic gumwalls on it.
National was the brand name used for M-a-t-s-u-s-h-i-t-a (hyphens added to circumvent auto-censor) products in Japan, while Panasonic was a brand name created in the 1950 for products marketed outside Japan. National and M-a-t-s-u-s-hi-t-a were both phased out in the early 21 century, in favour of the more globally recognized Panasonic name, early in the 21st century.

M-a-t-s-u-s-h-i-t-a established a division called the National Bicycle Tire Co. to manufacture bicycle tires and created the Panaracer name for them. The Japanese market tires were produced with the National branding, so I'm a bit surprised to see Panasonic on a bicycle branded as National. The National name was still being used on tires for the Japanese market at this time.

Regardless, it's definitely a National (Panasonic) bicycle.
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Old 12-06-20, 08:22 AM
  #29  
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National Aero III 1982

Originally Posted by T-Mar View Post
National was the brand name used for M-a-t-s-u-s-h-i-t-a (hyphens added to circumvent auto-censor) products in Japan, while Panasonic was a brand name created in the 1950 for products marketed outside Japan. National and M-a-t-s-u-s-hi-t-a were both phased out in the early 21 century, in favour of the more globally recognized Panasonic name, early in the 21st century.

M-a-t-s-u-s-h-i-t-a established a division called the National Bicycle Tire Co. to manufacture bicycle tires and created the Panaracer name for them. The Japanese market tires were produced with the National branding, so I'm a bit surprised to see Panasonic on a bicycle branded as National. The National name was still being used on tires for the Japanese market at this time.

Regardless, it's definitely a National (Panasonic) bicycle.
Thankyou for the additional information and appreciate the confirmation as to the brand.
Just a few more images to round out the information.

Cheers






Last edited by weeredok; 12-06-20 at 08:24 AM. Reason: forgot the images
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Old 12-06-20, 09:22 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by weeredok View Post
Thankyou for the additional information and appreciate the confirmation as to the brand.

Just a few more images to round out the information.


Cheers




FYI, I believe the little 'lightning bolts' in the trademark are homage to the company's origin in the electrical industry. Their first products were electric light sockets and their first bicycle related product was a battery operated lamp.
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Old 12-06-20, 03:01 PM
  #31  
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I just picked up an unkn model Miyata,
Grand Compe calipers and levers.
Shimano AX crankset, pedals (required), stem, seat post, RD. Has a DA AX FD.
Hubs are grimy, but share a logo with the RD, so I’m hopeful.
My stash has 600AX calipers that look neat but stop? Not. They’ll do.
Managed to find a DA AX crankset in my stash, and pedals.

The dilemma: build it that way and ride it twice a year, or toss on stuff I’ll use?
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Old 12-06-20, 04:20 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes View Post
I just picked up an unkn model Miyata,
Grand Compe calipers and levers.
Shimano AX crankset, pedals (required), stem, seat post, RD. Has a DA AX FD.
Hubs are grimy, but share a logo with the RD, so I’m hopeful.
My stash has 600AX calipers that look neat but stop? Not. They’ll do.
Managed to find a DA AX crankset in my stash, and pedals.

The dilemma: build it that way and ride it twice a year, or toss on stuff I’ll use?
If it has aero tubing, then it's a 1981-1983 Aero Miyata.

Dura-Ace AX and 600AX were really good components, with the exception of the brakes, though they are exquisite pieces of jewelry and the levers established the aero cable routing trend of later years. The rear derailleur indexes and shifts well, arguably on par with SunTour of the era. The crankset is super stiff for the era. The pedals are incredibly stable and the easiest cup and cone design to overhaul. The hubset uses a freehub and seven cogs, at a time when the latter was rare. The stem and post set the styling standard for those who followed. The headset, with exception of the clear plastic fairing/cover, is the same as used on the early Ironman models.

The bottom line is that there's little reason not to use AX, if it's the Dura-Ace or 600 version. Don't succumb to the myths surrounding these groups. Install it, ride it and make your own judgement. You may be pleasantly surprised when you compare it to other offerings of the era.
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Old 02-01-21, 12:11 PM
  #33  
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Newbie here/first post. I have a bike with the Shimano 600ax components as well as the aero frame. It's 90% original with the exception of the bar wrap, and the rat trap straps. It appears to be identical to Huberus' bike down to the color. I know every detail about the originality of the bike because I'm the original owner.
I bought it new in Amsterdam in the summer of 1982 or 1983. It was on display at Altra, one of the largest bicycle shops in Netherlands at the time. Altra was marketing it as their 'custom build' and featured it next to a prestigious brand (Italian, IIRC) that was equipped with the same components. It was an effective display in that the Altra, being virtually the same bike, was nearly half the price. So effective that I bought one. I had to fork up all of my money that I had budgeted for Eurorail travel, food and lodging that summer. I'll never forget the experience of hitch hiking through Europe on $7/day

The bike was/is badged and branded as Altra. I'm curious as to others that came from the same builder, but may have been branded elsewhere. This thread is a wealth of info.
Huberus, I tried to shoot you a PM but I'm restricted from doing so until at least 10 posts . Anyway, it would be interesting to compare bikes, components and serial numbers.
JP
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Old 06-16-21, 11:26 PM
  #34  
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Also a newbie here, so also in photo and message jail, so I can't share anything. But I would like to know if anyone has pictures of the AX trade show bikes. I think I have one here, a yellow and white frame with an oval top tube, lug to lug, a seat tube that is oval at the seat clamp and round at the BB lug and a downtube that is teardrop at the head lug and round at the BB lug. Full 600 AX group with bottle and cage and the parts seem way higher quality than the frame.
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Old 06-17-21, 01:35 AM
  #35  
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@Charles Jalguna's Album:
https://www.bikeforums.net/g/user/540913
https://www.bikeforums.net/g/album/21659828


I see a burgundy Trek, but it doesn't seem to relate to your post above. Perhaps more photos will come soon.
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Old 06-17-21, 06:08 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by Charles Jalguna View Post
Also a newbie here, so also in photo and message jail, so I can't share anything. But I would like to know if anyone has pictures of the AX trade show bikes. I think I have one here, a yellow and white frame with an oval top tube, lug to lug, a seat tube that is oval at the seat clamp and round at the BB lug and a downtube that is teardrop at the head lug and round at the BB lug. Full 600 AX group with bottle and cage and the parts seem way higher quality than the frame.
Typically, the trade show bicycles used by Shimano to display their Dura-Ace AX and 600AX groups were full aero frames. You might see a quasi aero frame at one of the bicycle manufacturers booths but typically not at a Shimano booth. Serial number?.
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Old 06-17-21, 06:56 AM
  #37  
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Just to add my Lotus Super Pro Aero to this thread about Shimano AX. Mine is full Dura Ace AX with the exception of the crankset (DA 7400 IIRC), which the original owner replaced in order to accommodate his modern pedals.

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Old 06-18-21, 01:10 AM
  #38  
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Thanks Clifford, that helps a lot. I also have some questions about the Trek and tried to create my first post here all about that, but again, I'm a newbie here and can't post photos. Looks like my intended post was put in or converted to an album. I'll try to get the aero bike in there.

Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
@Charles Jalguna's Album:


I see a burgundy Trek, but it doesn't seem to relate to your post above. Perhaps more photos will come soon.
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Old 06-18-21, 02:47 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Charles Jalguna View Post
Thanks Clifford, that helps a lot. I also have some questions about the Trek and tried to create my first post here all about that, but again, I'm a newbie here and can't post photos. Looks like my intended post was put in or converted to an album. I'll try to get the aero bike in there.
Yeah, they changed policies a couple of years ago so attached photos go to your album, where you can easily refer back to them. I'm not sure if there is an official way to find other people's albums, but there is a way to point the address there. To get to your own, select "Gallery" at the top of most pages, then "My Pictures".

Click on pictures until you can't click anymore, then get the filename and use [img]filename[/img] to attach files from the album (once you get to 10+ posts).

But, unfortunately the photos come back as hyperlinks... and you know the rest.

Newbies often get orphaned photos lost in their album so I'll sometimes look, especially if you already know about posting woes.

I didn't see the Trek post, so it probably got deleted in frustration.
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Old 06-19-21, 01:40 AM
  #40  
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Not deleted, just never appeared because I didn't have the critical 10 posts. This is post 6, I might do a one more tonight, and early next week I'll try the Trek post again, and then add pictures to this thread. As awkward as this whole thing is, it is forcing me to become more familiar with and use the forum, a medium I assumed was dying but seems relevant and active here. Y'all will be seeing and hearing more from me in the future, like it or not.
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Old 06-19-21, 06:51 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by Charles Jalguna View Post
Also a newbie here, so also in photo and message jail, so I can't share anything. But I would like to know if anyone has pictures of the AX trade show bikes. I think I have one here, a yellow and white frame with an oval top tube, lug to lug, a seat tube that is oval at the seat clamp and round at the BB lug and a downtube that is teardrop at the head lug and round at the BB lug. Full 600 AX group with bottle and cage and the parts seem way higher quality than the frame.
Charles, where is there info on the trade show bikes? I'd like compare.
JP
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Old 06-19-21, 10:59 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by Charles Jalguna View Post
Not deleted, just never appeared because I didn't have the critical 10 posts. This is post 6, I might do a one more tonight, and early next week I'll try the Trek post again, and then add pictures to this thread. As awkward as this whole thing is, it is forcing me to become more familiar with and use the forum, a medium I assumed was dying but seems relevant and active here. Y'all will be seeing and hearing more from me in the future, like it or not.
The uploads are working, as there are pictures of a burgundy Trek in your album. Just upload the photos of the aero bicycle.
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Old 06-19-21, 11:01 AM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by Charles Jalguna View Post
Not deleted, just never appeared because I didn't have the critical 10 posts. This is post 6, I might do a one more tonight, and early next week I'll try the Trek post again, and then add pictures to this thread. As awkward as this whole thing is, it is forcing me to become more familiar with and use the forum, a medium I assumed was dying but seems relevant and active here. Y'all will be seeing and hearing more from me in the future, like it or not.
The uploads are working, as there are pictures of a burgundy Trek in your album. Just upload the photos of the aero bicycle.

Edit: link to your Trek album: https://www.bikeforums.net/g/user/540913
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Old 06-19-21, 11:38 PM
  #44  
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Thanks T-Mar, that helps. I just created a new album, Shimano 600 AX Bike
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Old 06-20-21, 12:01 AM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by JPTL View Post
Charles, where is there info on the trade show bikes? I'd like compare.
JP
I don't have much information on them, but I recall from attending Interbike and BIO trade shows in the 80's and 90's that Shimano would often have some nameless frame or frames in their booth built up with that year's new component group or groups. I think I recall some of the frames being branded Shimano but I think they generally had no decals or identifying stamps or castings. T-Mar references such bikes earlier in this thread, over two years ago. He probably knows more about them than I do. But I do have a bike here with a complete 600 AX group, and no identifying marks or decals on the frame, other than a serial number, and it came to me with the story that it was a built up as a trade show display. I am trying to verify that.
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Old 06-20-21, 12:14 AM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by t-mar View Post
typically, the trade show bicycles used by shimano to display their dura-ace ax and 600ax groups were full aero frames. You might see a quasi aero frame at one of the bicycle manufacturers booths but typically not at a shimano booth. Serial number?.
m2d11334
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Old 06-20-21, 05:36 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by Charles Jalguna View Post
Thanks T-Mar, that helps. I just created a new album, Shimano 600 AX Bike
Picture assist.

Interesting they didn't build the bike with the 600 AX aero brake levers.
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Old 06-20-21, 12:18 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by Charles Jalguna View Post
m2d11334
That's exactly what I was expecting. It's a 1982 model manufactured by Miki of Japan. Their quasi-aero frames are distinctive due the aero down and seat tubes being round at the BB end. They also attached the brake cable tunnels under the top tube. I've always considered Miki's quasi-aero approach to be quite intelligent. It allows for a standard, clamp style front derailleur and BB shell, both which save costs. The air flow is very disturbed around the BB shell, so the aerodynamics are not as importnat in this area.

Miki was a contract manufacturer and built for several companies. I've seen this exact frame under a few different brand names, so it's appears to be a stock Miki offering. Here's an SR Semi-Pro owned by member Cliffordk with the same frame characteristics. It's perhaps the most popular brand that used these Miki frames, so it would be my leading candidate. The non-drive side photo better shows the transition of the down and seat tubes form aero profile to round as they approach the BB shell.
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Old 06-21-21, 03:31 AM
  #49  
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This is just great T-Mar. And based on it being a Miki frame, along with the decades old story I have from the seller saying it was built up as a trade show display bike, how likely do you think his story is, and do you think paint and parts have been changed since it's origin?
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Old 06-21-21, 03:39 AM
  #50  
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