Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Road Cycling
Reload this Page >

Tubeless Tires on Road bike. Yuck!

Notices
Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Tubeless Tires on Road bike. Yuck!

Old 06-09-21, 02:41 PM
  #51  
DangerousDanR
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Fargo ND
Posts: 282

Bikes: Lynskey R350, Ritchey Breakaway, Ritchey Double Switchback, Lynskey Ridgeline, ICAN Fatbike

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 120 Post(s)
Liked 122 Times in 67 Posts
I use a AZUNO Bike Tire Inflator with Pressure Gauge. It claims to fit both Presta and Schrader valves. I didn't like the head so I replaced it with one from a pump with a failed gauge. I can tell you that the AZUNO gauge agreed with all 4 TPMS sensors on my car.

I have used it to seat everything from 25mm road tires to 4.8" Fat bike tires. If you have a compressor, it seems like a good tool to have. If you don't have a compressor, maybe consider getting one. My pancake compressor came from Homer a few years ago for around $100.
DangerousDanR is offline  
Old 06-09-21, 06:11 PM
  #52  
GBK233
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Syracuse NY
Posts: 180

Bikes: ‘20 Giant Defy Advanced 2, Marin Lucas Valley flat bar

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 138 Post(s)
Liked 59 Times in 24 Posts
Originally Posted by DangerousDanR View Post
I use a AZUNO Bike Tire Inflator with Pressure Gauge. It claims to fit both Presta and Schrader valves. I didn't like the head so I replaced it with one from a pump with a failed gauge. I can tell you that the AZUNO gauge agreed with all 4 TPMS sensors on my car.

I have used it to seat everything from 25mm road tires to 4.8" Fat bike tires. If you have a compressor, it seems like a good tool to have. If you don't have a compressor, maybe consider getting one. My pancake compressor came from Homer a few years ago for around $100.
I bought an Air Shot tire booster. Hopefully it’ll come in handy the next time I have to seat the tires
GBK233 is offline  
Old 06-10-21, 03:03 AM
  #53  
Lazyass
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Minas Ithil
Posts: 8,790
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2212 Post(s)
Liked 326 Times in 199 Posts
After my experience with tubeless conversion on my MTB I'd never consider it for the road.

Just run latex tubes with removable valve cores and squirt in some Stan's. The tubes only weigh like 50g.
Lazyass is offline  
Old 06-10-21, 06:13 AM
  #54  
WhyFi
Senior Member
 
WhyFi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: TC, MN
Posts: 34,752

Bikes: R3 Disc, Haanjo

Mentioned: 344 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16835 Post(s)
Liked 5,544 Times in 2,875 Posts
Yesterday, on mile 24 of 107, I took a puncture on my front tire. Must have been a fairly big one, I coasted and watched it bubble for about 5 tire revolutions, then it stopped, I put it out of mind and carried on. I'd say that this is pretty typical of my experience, but it's not - I usually don't even notice the punctures.
WhyFi is offline  
Old 06-10-21, 06:21 AM
  #55  
eduskator
Senior Member
 
eduskator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Québec, Canada
Posts: 1,014

Bikes: TCR Pro 0 / Revolt 2

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 446 Post(s)
Liked 259 Times in 196 Posts
Originally Posted by GBK233 View Post
I bought an Air Shot tire booster. Hopefully it’ll come in handy the next time I have to seat the tires
It will be for sure! Next time you're out for a new pump, buy one with a built-in compressor. Even better!
eduskator is offline  
Old 06-10-21, 06:24 AM
  #56  
Trsnrtr
Super Moderator
 
Trsnrtr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 19,954

Bikes: Giant Propel, Colnago V3, Co-Motion Supremo, ICE VTX, ICE VTX WC

Mentioned: 103 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8352 Post(s)
Liked 1,865 Times in 908 Posts
Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
- I usually don't even notice the punctures.
I found two orange “spots” on a tire last week. No idea when they happened.
__________________
Dennis T

Where there is a will, there's a way. Where there is no will, there's an excuse.





Trsnrtr is offline  
Old 06-10-21, 06:31 AM
  #57  
Trsnrtr
Super Moderator
 
Trsnrtr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 19,954

Bikes: Giant Propel, Colnago V3, Co-Motion Supremo, ICE VTX, ICE VTX WC

Mentioned: 103 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8352 Post(s)
Liked 1,865 Times in 908 Posts
Here’s a TL story: I changed out a tire about 6 weeks ago and seated it with an air compressor. I was doing five tires at the time and I let them sit for a couple hours before removing the valve and putting the seal in with a syringe, replacing the valve and airing up again.

One of the tires had a slow leak and I kept having to pump 20# or so daily to bring it up to proper pressure. Finally, I decided to remove the tire and re-tape the rim, figuring I had a poor tape job. I unseated one side and found that I had never put sealant in and had been riding it that way for 6 weeks. Of course, all is well now that I finished the job.
__________________
Dennis T

Where there is a will, there's a way. Where there is no will, there's an excuse.






Last edited by Trsnrtr; 06-11-21 at 11:56 AM.
Trsnrtr is offline  
Likes For Trsnrtr:
Old 06-10-21, 07:39 PM
  #58  
GBK233
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Syracuse NY
Posts: 180

Bikes: ‘20 Giant Defy Advanced 2, Marin Lucas Valley flat bar

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 138 Post(s)
Liked 59 Times in 24 Posts
Update: was feeling brave today. Unscrewed presta valve slowly and let air out. Added sealant with a syringe…and of course the tire popped of the bead all by itself. Used the “air shot” 3 times and finally got the bead to seat….only to have it unseat before I could get the presta vlalve screwed back in the stem. Tried it one more time and pumped the air shot up to 145lbs and my Lezyne floor pump let go.😡. The pump now pushes air on the downstroke and the pressure shows on the gauge but on the upstroke the pressure immediately goes to zero. It’s like I’m pulling the pressure out of the pump on the upstroke(hard to explain), don’t know if it’s fixable or I’ve just ruined a $75 pump.

Next question. Tire is currently partially unseated from the bead. Will the sealant go bad overnight? Going to bring it to my shop in the morning and reseat the bead.
GBK233 is offline  
Old 06-10-21, 08:59 PM
  #59  
WhyFi
Senior Member
 
WhyFi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: TC, MN
Posts: 34,752

Bikes: R3 Disc, Haanjo

Mentioned: 344 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16835 Post(s)
Liked 5,544 Times in 2,875 Posts
Originally Posted by GBK233 View Post
Next question. Tire is currently partially unseated from the bead. Will the sealant go bad overnight? Going to bring it to my shop in the morning and reseat the bead.
It probably won't dry out, but why not just remove it and put it back in the bottle so that it doesn't make a mess in transport?

Also, if these tires are completely seated (witness line visible all the way around) and are unseating with low/no pressure, and if you're intent on keeping these tires (I wouldn't, but you do you), I'd recommend some MilKit valves - they'll allow you to keep some pressure in the tires (aim for 15-20psi) which should keep them seated while checking/adding/removing sealant.
WhyFi is offline  
Likes For WhyFi:
Old 06-11-21, 05:19 AM
  #60  
GBK233
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Syracuse NY
Posts: 180

Bikes: ‘20 Giant Defy Advanced 2, Marin Lucas Valley flat bar

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 138 Post(s)
Liked 59 Times in 24 Posts
Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
It probably won't dry out, but why not just remove it and put it back in the bottle so that it doesn't make a mess in transport?

Also, if these tires are completely seated (witness line visible all the way around) and are unseating with low/no pressure, and if you're intent on keeping these tires (I wouldn't, but you do you), I'd recommend some MilKit valves - they'll allow you to keep some pressure in the tires (aim for 15-20psi) which should keep them seated while checking/adding/removing sealant.
Yup…def going to keep running these tires for a bit. They only have maybe 500 miles on them with no signs of wear. I got the sealant in and beads seated this morning. Will def upgrade tires at some point, but as long as these don’t get cut/damaged beyond repair….no sense in replacing perfectly good tires(aside from the annoying bead seating issue).

Although there is a good case to be made for buying new tires and using these as emergency backup tires.

I’m open to new tire suggestions. Fire away
GBK233 is offline  
Old 06-11-21, 05:31 AM
  #61  
Sy Reene
Advocatus Diaboli
 
Sy Reene's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Wherever I am
Posts: 7,146

Bikes: Merlin Cyrene, Nashbar steel CX

Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3774 Post(s)
Liked 888 Times in 596 Posts
Originally Posted by GBK233 View Post
Although there is a good case to be made for buying new tires and using these as emergency backup tires.
Exactly this.. look at them as backups and as consumables that have a fixed lifespan anyway. It's not like you'd throw them in the trash can if you opted for other (better) tires.
Sy Reene is offline  
Likes For Sy Reene:
Old 06-11-21, 06:02 AM
  #62  
chaadster
Thread Killer
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 10,464

Bikes: '15 Kinesis Racelight 4S, '76 Motebecane Gran Jubilée, '17 Dedacciai Gladiatore2, '12 Breezer Venturi, '09 Dahon Mariner, '12 Mercier Nano, '95 DeKerf Team SL, '19 Tern Rally, ‘21 Breezer Doppler Cafe+, ‘19 T Lab X3

Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1545 Post(s)
Liked 606 Times in 371 Posts
GBK233 it’s too bad you did not take the early suggestion and inflate with the cores in place.

Lezyne sell replacement gauges which are relatively inexpensive and east to install, making the repair worth trying.
chaadster is online now  
Old 06-11-21, 06:13 AM
  #63  
GBK233
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Syracuse NY
Posts: 180

Bikes: ‘20 Giant Defy Advanced 2, Marin Lucas Valley flat bar

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 138 Post(s)
Liked 59 Times in 24 Posts
Originally Posted by chaadster View Post
GBK233 it’s too bad you did not take the early suggestion and inflate with the cores in place.

Lezyne sell replacement gauges which are relatively inexpensive and east to install, making the repair worth trying.
I tried multiple times last night to inflate with cores in. Didn’t work. I was able to seat the beads with the core out….but the beads would separate before I could get the core back in. Only took 10mins this morning to get it sorted using a compressor.

im returning the air shock(Amazon)….and getting myself a small compressor for future inflation needs.
GBK233 is offline  
Old 06-11-21, 06:57 AM
  #64  
WhyFi
Senior Member
 
WhyFi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: TC, MN
Posts: 34,752

Bikes: R3 Disc, Haanjo

Mentioned: 344 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16835 Post(s)
Liked 5,544 Times in 2,875 Posts
Originally Posted by GBK233 View Post
Yup…def going to keep running these tires for a bit. They only have maybe 500 miles on them with no signs of wear. I got the sealant in and beads seated this morning. Will def upgrade tires at some point, but as long as these don’t get cut/damaged beyond repair….no sense in replacing perfectly good tires(aside from the annoying bead seating issue).

Although there is a good case to be made for buying new tires and using these as emergency backup tires.

I’m open to new tire suggestions. Fire away
If you don't get better tires, ones that stay seated when deflated, just know that you're willingly taking on additional frustration - all aspects of maintenance are much easier with tires that'll lock in place and a syringe for adding/removing sealant via the valve stem - and that the majority of rim/tire combinations don't do this. Tires that don't stay in place just aren't worth the hassle, even if you love the tire, otherwise (IMO). Also, that you're having trouble seating them and that they don't stay in place are undoubtedly related.

As far as tire recommendations, peruse this thread - https://www.bikeforums.net/road-cycl...ess-tires.html
WhyFi is offline  
Old 06-11-21, 06:57 AM
  #65  
DaveSSS 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Loveland, CO
Posts: 6,441

Bikes: TWO Cinelli superstar disc with SRAM Force AXS

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 684 Post(s)
Liked 316 Times in 254 Posts
Consider michelin power road tubeless. If those don't stay seated, your rims are crap too. I carry CO2 and a tube for a road repair. I won't mess with bacon strips or darts. I've let the air out of mine and found it takes some effort to unseat the bead, but it's doable on the road.
DaveSSS is offline  
Old 06-11-21, 06:58 AM
  #66  
Zaskar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 567
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 338 Post(s)
Liked 131 Times in 83 Posts
I always remove the cores.

- Mount the tire
- Slather bead with Schwalbe mounting fluid (soapy sponge works too)
- Use injector or just the small white bottle to put the Stans/fluid in the tire
- Use a blowgun or airshot pump to seat the tire
- Holding finger over valve stem, quickly replace core
- Air back up with floor pump

I don't remember ever having an issue with the tire unseating.
Zaskar is offline  
Old 06-11-21, 07:09 AM
  #67  
GBK233
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Syracuse NY
Posts: 180

Bikes: ‘20 Giant Defy Advanced 2, Marin Lucas Valley flat bar

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 138 Post(s)
Liked 59 Times in 24 Posts
Originally Posted by Zaskar View Post
I always remove the cores.

- Mount the tire
- Slather bead with Schwalbe mounting fluid (soapy sponge works too)
- Use injector or just the small white bottle to put the Stans/fluid in the tire
- Use a blowgun or airshot pump to seat the tire
- Holding finger over valve stem, quickly replace core
- Air back up with floor pump

I don't remember ever having an issue with the tire unseating.
ive done a ton of reading on the subject(including MANY YouTube vids). Some wheel/tires combos are a dream to seat….others are not. According to what I’ve read…it has to do with the fact that wheel and tire manufacturers seem to be on a different page. Wheel makers make wheels a touch big and tire manufacturers make their tires a touch small.
Mavic explained this in one of their videos online.

Def going to look for new tires. I also just found out that my presta valve is leaking….so I scrounged one from a spare tube I have.
GBK233 is offline  
Old 06-11-21, 07:14 AM
  #68  
WhyFi
Senior Member
 
WhyFi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: TC, MN
Posts: 34,752

Bikes: R3 Disc, Haanjo

Mentioned: 344 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16835 Post(s)
Liked 5,544 Times in 2,875 Posts
Originally Posted by GBK233 View Post
According to what I’ve read…it has to do with the fact that wheel and tire manufacturers seem to be on a different page. Wheel makers make wheels a touch big and tire manufacturers make their tires a touch small.
You're likely experiencing the opposite - tire beads that are slightly larger relative to the rim. This would explain the unseating at low/no pressure and a slightly loose fit would allow more air to escape under the bead when trying to seat them, making it more difficult to seat them without a quick shot of a large volume of air.
WhyFi is offline  
Likes For WhyFi:
Old 06-11-21, 07:17 AM
  #69  
Zaskar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 567
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 338 Post(s)
Liked 131 Times in 83 Posts
No doubt! The range of sizes in wheels and tires is surprisingly large and surprisingly frustrating. I have another thread going on the topic - but focused on the damn near impossible task of mounting and removing (we should henceforth call this dismounting) tight tires. My wheels are apparently "big" and or have a very shallow center well. There is no way I'm pulling off a road-side tube swap with these. If a plug (they're tubeless now) doesn't do it... I'm Ubering home.
Zaskar is offline  
Old 06-11-21, 07:17 AM
  #70  
GBK233
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Syracuse NY
Posts: 180

Bikes: ‘20 Giant Defy Advanced 2, Marin Lucas Valley flat bar

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 138 Post(s)
Liked 59 Times in 24 Posts
Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
You're likely experiencing the opposite - tire beads that are slightly larger relative to the rim. This would explain the unseating at low/no pressure and a slightly loose fit would allow more air to escape under the bead when trying to seat them, making it more difficult to seat them without a quick shot of a large volume of air.
Agreed. If tires were more snug…no way they’d separate from the bead simply because I let air out of the tire
GBK233 is offline  
Old 06-11-21, 07:22 AM
  #71  
Zaskar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 567
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 338 Post(s)
Liked 131 Times in 83 Posts
Originally Posted by GBK233 View Post
Agreed. If tires were more snug…no way they’d separate from the bead simply because I let air out of the tire
Exactly. This is the typical challenge seating mountain bike tires - they flop and slide... I've had to have another guy help - just to help keep the tire in contact with the rim. Super tight tires (like my problematic Cannondale Hollowgrams) are completely opposite - takes steel core tire levers to remove, a bead jack to reinstall... but seat and air up like they're tubed.
Zaskar is offline  
Old 06-11-21, 07:47 AM
  #72  
Chandne
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Denver area (Ken Caryl Valley)
Posts: 1,410

Bikes: 2014 BMC SLR01 DA Mech, 2020 Santa Cruz Stigmata, Yeti SB4.5, Pivot Shuttle

Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 315 Post(s)
Liked 40 Times in 25 Posts
None of my MTB tires separate from the rim when I let the air out...I do this often to add sealant. I am currently using Knight Composites trail rims (29x2.35) and some DT fatter rims on the other bike (27.5x3.0) but they are relatively newer rims. I can snap the tire bead off the rim bead with enough thumb pressure. Road is still developing BUT I took the plunge yesterday and ordered some Zipp 303 tubeless rim brake 303 Firecrest wheels. Since my bike can only fit 25-28 (real measurement) I did not want the hookless anyway, plus it is a rim-brake bike. Time to go back to road tubeless. I just need to see if I should run the IRCs or Contis and order some up, though I have plenty of tubed GP4000s to get my by this season.
Chandne is offline  
Old 06-12-21, 08:24 AM
  #73  
Racing Dan
Senior Member
 
Racing Dan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 1,839
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1072 Post(s)
Liked 153 Times in 113 Posts
Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
Yesterday, on mile 24 of 107, I took a puncture on my front tire. Must have been a fairly big one, I coasted and watched it bubble for about 5 tire revolutions, then it stopped, I put it out of mind and carried on. I'd say that this is pretty typical of my experience, but it's not - I usually don't even notice the punctures.
Just get a better tyre that wont puncture in the first place and you wont have to worry about the sealant plugging the hole or not. That's been My experience for the past two years or so. I believe you are venturing down a path of backwards logic. like - the more punctures you get, the better TL is, cos they (mostly) get plugged by the sealant.
Racing Dan is offline  
Old 06-12-21, 08:31 AM
  #74  
Racing Dan
Senior Member
 
Racing Dan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 1,839
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1072 Post(s)
Liked 153 Times in 113 Posts
Originally Posted by GBK233 View Post
Yup…def going to keep running these tires for a bit. They only have maybe 500 miles on them with no signs of wear. I got the sealant in and beads seated this morning. Will def upgrade tires at some point, but as long as these don’t get cut/damaged beyond repair….no sense in replacing perfectly good tires(aside from the annoying bead seating issue).

Although there is a good case to be made for buying new tires and using these as emergency backup tires.

I’m open to new tire suggestions. Fire away
It wont help if it the RIMS are not retaining the bead. Not all TL ready rims have a bead retaining design and It may be an exercise futility. Id find out before spending more $ on tires, compressor, etc.
Racing Dan is offline  
Old 06-12-21, 08:33 AM
  #75  
WhyFi
Senior Member
 
WhyFi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: TC, MN
Posts: 34,752

Bikes: R3 Disc, Haanjo

Mentioned: 344 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16835 Post(s)
Liked 5,544 Times in 2,875 Posts
Originally Posted by Racing Dan View Post
Just get a better tyre that wont puncture in the first place and you wont have to worry about the sealant plugging the hole or not. That's been My experience for the past two years or so. I believe you are venturing down a path of backwards logic. like - the more punctures you get, the better TL is, cos they (mostly) get plugged by the sealant.
Why is it impossible to believe that people, living and riding in their own reality, are unable to make a better decision about their equipment choices than you (a nameless, faceless person living in some far-flung place with the godforsaken spelling of "tire" with a "y") are able to do on their behalf?
WhyFi is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.