chaadster

Just a quick reminder to keep your terms straight and not mix up rim width (aka outer width) with internal width (IW). 622x15c rims are not 15mm internal, they’re 13mm; your friends DA 7700 wheelset was most likely the same 13mm IW as your own, original wheelset.

chaadster

It sounds like you’re talking yourself into some Zondas!

SoSmellyAir

I was using the ISO/ETRTO convention so 622 x 15C refers to an internal width (i.e., distance between bead hooks) of 15 mm, and I said that the most that the sci guy can probably hope for is to go up to a 622 x 17C wheel (i.e., a 2 mm increase in internal width) while staying with the same 25 mm tire.

the sci guy said that "the bolt bubble on the rear brake bridge is low and rubs on any tires with a higher volume than 25/26mm." I understood his use of the word "low" to mean that the top of the tire rubs. As you can see from your graphic above, when the same tire is mounted on a rim with a slightly larger internal width (e.g., going from lighter blue to brighter red) with a lower tire pressure (to compensate for the greater tire volume), most of the increase in tire volume is accounted for by the increase in tire width, with only a slight increase in tire height.

SoSmellyAir

Mavic uses ETRTO size: 622 x 17C to designate an internal width of 17 mm (Aksium | Mavic). So either you are wrong or Mavic is wrong.

chaadster

oh, haha…it’s me that’s wrong for sure! I told you I was confused!

I was thinking that internal widths on vintage ‘00/‘01 rims was not 15mm, but apparently I was in error.

Thanks for the correction.

Greatestalltime

WTO 45’s is all you’ll need-Tubeless ready. Go tubeless, you won’t be sorry. (Well, only when mounting tires)

mstateglfr 

Did you just suggest a $2000 wheelset?
https://www.merlincycles.com/en-us/c...els&ucpo=89032

the sci guy 

lol now i'm confused. I was pretty certain i measure the inside of the rim with my calipers on the mavics that came on the bike and i notated 15mm in my notes. i could always do it again.

basically, i want a ~$400 set of wheels that will fit a 700x25/26 tire at the smallest possible volume because of the confined space due to the brake bridge.

Here's I found a video I took of my buddy's bike (same exact frame model just a size 58 instead of the 52 I have). This was putting 700x28 on new Mavic CXP Elites I got at the bike shop
https://www.flickr.com/photos/rattle.../in/datetaken/

I wonder if the rims I got him were a wider IW and I just didn't realize it? And that's causing the issue? I need to have him check.

Here are the wheels that came on my frame, and they had 700x23 tires on them.


So from what I've read so far, if I get a wheelset that's 17mm width, and try to use a 25/26 tires, it will actually have a greater volume & greater height than if I had the same tire on a rim with 15mm width? (which would maybe be bad - as I'm not sure exactly how much clearance I have). I will try to get my buddy to take a pic of the clearance on his bike.

bruce19

I just bought a (new) rear wheel from The Pro's Closet. I was surprised they had them.

SoSmellyAir

Nice, I generally only see the front wheel available on www.theproscloset.com.

SoSmellyAir

No need. You got it right. The label on the Mavic Open Pro wheel shown in your photo said 622 x 15, which designates an internal width of 15 mm. See also: Open Pro Clincher | Mavic.

If you want the smallest possible volume, then you should get a 622 x 15C wheel.

No, Mavic CXP Elites are also 622 x 15C. See CXP Elite | Mavic. So if a 28 mm tire on that wheel does not fit in a bigger frame of the same model, then there is no point to try this on your frame.

Yes, on a 622 x 17C wheel (having an internal width of 17mm), the same 25 mm tire will be noticeably wider and slightly taller (than if mounted on a 622 x 15C wheel), resulting in a greater tire volume.

So the question is, how much clearance is there between the rear brake bridge and a 25 mm tire mounted on a 622 x 15C wheel? If there is a lot of space, then you can probably go to a 622 x 17C wheel while keeping the same 25 mm tire. (Please also note that some 25 mm tires are larger than other 25 mm tires.)

SoSmellyAir

OP has budget of $400 and his frame cannot even fit a 28 mm wide tire mounted on a 622 x 15C wheel. Bora WTO wheels have an internal width of 19 mm (Bike Wheel Bora WTO 45 | Campagnolo) which most likely would not work.

Greatestalltime

My bad. I admit to skimming the post.

For 400$ get some Zonda or Ultegra.

I have 25mm on my WTO. For

the sci guy 

Many thanks for all this. Makes much more sense now.
I texted my buddy but he's a pilot and isn't in town currently. When he's back I'll have him get me some pics showing the currently clearance he has - measure if possible. Currently he's got 700x25 panaracer pasaleas on those mavic cxp elites.
I love pasaleas, but i'm up for a different tire if a 700x26 will edge me just that much closer to a 700x28 as possible.
I'll hold off on a wheel purchase for a few more days at least.

aliasfox

I have Zondas on my Cannondale. Very little riding on that bike so far, but they spin up quickly, are reasonably light, and look cool. The nearly silent freehub is a pleasant surprise, though I always think that something’s weird my first few minutes on the bike (it’s my backup to other, louder bikes). PBK usually has them for just under $400, sometimes a little better, occasionally worse. I like them enough that I’ll likely get another set when my other rim brake bike needs new wheels.

SoSmellyAir

the sci guy As first predicted by jamesdak above (in post #9), Campagnolo Zondas are now on sale for $390: Campagnolo Zonda C17 Clincher Wheelset - Black | ProBikeKit.com Be sure to select the Shimano/SRAM version.

the sci guy 

i saw! Still not sure if the 17mm IW is going to be an issue though so I haven’t pulled the trigger. I wish they existed in a 15!

SoSmellyAir

It is increasingly hard to find a decent 15C wheelset nowadays. This might be the only one:

Shimano Ultegra WH-RS500 Road Wheelset - Tubeless | Competitive Cyclist

A 17C wheel would likely work with the right (i.e., newer and smaller) 25 mm tire. [1] As stated above, the same tire on a 15C wheel would only be slightly taller if mounted on a 17C wheel. [2] Some more recent tire models are smaller than their predecessors at the same stated width, because the newer tire is designed for a 17C wheel, while the older tire was designed for a 15C wheel. One of the more famous examples is the Continental GP4K vs. GP5K. On a 17C wheel, a 25 mm GP4K measures at around 28 mm, while a 25 mm GP5K measures barely at 25 mm.

the sci guy 

Screw it. I pulled the trigger. If they don’t fit the tires I’ll sell them - they’ll be brand new and unused.

SoSmellyAir

Glad you put your tax refund (i.e., your own money) to good use. What tires are you intending to install?

the sci guy 

not sure yet. My go to is Pasaleas, may still try those 25s. Might try to find something in a 26? I really only want to spend about $70-80 total on a pair.

SoSmellyAir

You may be in luck. According to this other BF thread, the 32 mm version of a Pasela Protite folding tire "measure[s] very close to" 32 mm on a CR-18 rim (Bike Forums - View Single Post - Panaracer Pasela PT folding - actual width), which has an internal width of 18 mm (Sun Ringle CR-18 700c Polished Road Rim | Tree Fort Bikes). So it seems safe to guess that other models this tire would not run wide on a 17C rim.

the sci guy 

finally got my buddy take a pic of the clearance on his frame.
these are 700x25 on Mavic cxp elite, which should have a 15mm IW, correct?
seeing this made me nervous for the 17mm Zondas I just got…

the sci guy 

He said a 2.5mm hex wrench will fit between them, but a 3 didn’t without pushing it in.

SoSmellyAir

Yes, Mavic CXP Elite is 622 x 15C, i.e., 15 mm internal width: CXP Elite | Mavic.

That does look pretty tight. What 25 mm tire is he running?