Question About Tires
#26
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Stop with the personal attacks.
You may have different experiences than I. This is what I do and why I do it that way.
I do what works for me. This is my experience, repeated over and again across the last 60 years of cycling using tubulars and clinchers.
How could you say I run "extremely high pressure" if you do not know what I weigh? I run what works. My experience has taught me what to use and, as it turns out, it is right in line with a lot of the tire pressure recommendations I read.
Whenever I run my tires at even moderately low pressure, I get flat tires from glass. It happened just last Friday when I was too lazy to pump them up and consciously thought, well, it's okay because everyone says running at lower pressures is a good thing.
This was the justification or rationalization I used. I knew it was wrong and sure enough, I got a flat from glass mid-ride.
Likewise, I do not use a wider (28 mm) tire in the rear because wide tires are the latest and greatest, I do so because when I use a more narrow tire (25mm), I get flats from glass. I do not get pinch flats, ever.
More personal and opinion based on my experience - latex tubes are terrible. I just dumped a set of Vittoria tubes. They ride nicely but it seems to be as much about their lower weight and their different sound as it is ride quality. You have to pump them up before every single ride or they flat out (reference the above). There is no amount of ride quality improvement that makes up for frequent flats (1/wk or 1/mo). I never have those problems with butyl tubes.
Right now, I am using Conti Race 28 tubes and Challenge tires on MAVIC MA-2 rims.
I think I'll just go for a ride. After all, I have new WHITE tires on my bike and want to "break them in". Maybe the sun and sand will darken them.
You may have different experiences than I. This is what I do and why I do it that way.
I do what works for me. This is my experience, repeated over and again across the last 60 years of cycling using tubulars and clinchers.
How could you say I run "extremely high pressure" if you do not know what I weigh? I run what works. My experience has taught me what to use and, as it turns out, it is right in line with a lot of the tire pressure recommendations I read.
Whenever I run my tires at even moderately low pressure, I get flat tires from glass. It happened just last Friday when I was too lazy to pump them up and consciously thought, well, it's okay because everyone says running at lower pressures is a good thing.
This was the justification or rationalization I used. I knew it was wrong and sure enough, I got a flat from glass mid-ride.
Likewise, I do not use a wider (28 mm) tire in the rear because wide tires are the latest and greatest, I do so because when I use a more narrow tire (25mm), I get flats from glass. I do not get pinch flats, ever.
More personal and opinion based on my experience - latex tubes are terrible. I just dumped a set of Vittoria tubes. They ride nicely but it seems to be as much about their lower weight and their different sound as it is ride quality. You have to pump them up before every single ride or they flat out (reference the above). There is no amount of ride quality improvement that makes up for frequent flats (1/wk or 1/mo). I never have those problems with butyl tubes.
Right now, I am using Conti Race 28 tubes and Challenge tires on MAVIC MA-2 rims.
I think I'll just go for a ride. After all, I have new WHITE tires on my bike and want to "break them in". Maybe the sun and sand will darken them.
another shop employee measured the pressure. 11 atm on a Clement tire gauge.
now That is High pressure.
#27
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I was not being a smart a** when I mentioned coffee as a way of staining the white rubber at the beginning of this thread. It is a pretty common way of "aging" things in the vintage guiter & antique hooby space. Get a jar of freeze dried coffee at the supermarket and you can adjust the "strength" of you brew for staining.
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I have no dog in the fight but I stopped using Challenge tires because they seemed be flat-prone in my experience. I thought the ride was nice but it seemed any type of road debris would result in flat. Glass, thorns, wire strands and I also found them unnecessarily difficult to mount, when new across a variety of rim types.
I also found that after they were mounted and stretched, they had a tendency roll right off the rim after becoming flat while riding. I decided to move on. YMMV.
I also found that after they were mounted and stretched, they had a tendency roll right off the rim after becoming flat while riding. I decided to move on. YMMV.
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#30
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As long as I stay properly inflated, I don't get flats. In never got goat head flats in ABQ and the only thing that gets me here is broken beer bottles (glass) + under inflation.
Which version of the Challenge tires were you guys using? The ones I just mounted have "PPS", which I believe stands for puncture protection system or some such. Not all versions have had that.
My 28 mm tire lists 90 psi as the minimum inflation. Were you guys keeping up with the proper inflation levels or running them soft?
Also, what tires are you running that are so different in their resistance to flats?
Oh well, doesn't matter. It's just my idle curiosity. I have these tires on the bike. I'll find out for myself soon enough.
Which version of the Challenge tires were you guys using? The ones I just mounted have "PPS", which I believe stands for puncture protection system or some such. Not all versions have had that.
My 28 mm tire lists 90 psi as the minimum inflation. Were you guys keeping up with the proper inflation levels or running them soft?
Also, what tires are you running that are so different in their resistance to flats?
Oh well, doesn't matter. It's just my idle curiosity. I have these tires on the bike. I'll find out for myself soon enough.
#31
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Bad Lag - could you give feedback about what type of inner tubes you are running? Butyl or Latex? Also just curious but which rims do you have these mounted on?
Your repeating your belief that there is some kind of marketing of low pressure and “fad”, my response to this is that it is not a fad. Yeah, I get it that if you read some of the advertising hyperbole of say, Rene Herse then yeah maybe they are taking it a bit too far sure.
But you taking a supple tire like these Challenge tires in a 28 width and insisting on running them at 110 psi just sounds stubborn on your part.
Your repeating your belief that there is some kind of marketing of low pressure and “fad”, my response to this is that it is not a fad. Yeah, I get it that if you read some of the advertising hyperbole of say, Rene Herse then yeah maybe they are taking it a bit too far sure.
But you taking a supple tire like these Challenge tires in a 28 width and insisting on running them at 110 psi just sounds stubborn on your part.
Have no idea where the OP is weight wise
bottom line is pressure depends on lots of variables tire, tire type, tube type, rider weight, rider preference
FWIW and apropos to nothing the best ride magic feeling i have was on an 84 team miyata with 25mm challenge eltite tubular at 130psi (and lightish rims Mavic Gel 330)
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#32
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We have drifted far, far away from my original question but here goes one more.
This graphic addresses the weight/tire pressure issue, as mentioned by squirtdad.
I have no idea what either my bicycle or I weigh or the distribution of that weight front and rear. Because of that, I left the indicators as blobs that get me into the approximate range.
Also, I don't pump before every ride, so tire pressure varies from day-to-day.
This graphic addresses the weight/tire pressure issue, as mentioned by squirtdad.
I have no idea what either my bicycle or I weigh or the distribution of that weight front and rear. Because of that, I left the indicators as blobs that get me into the approximate range.
Also, I don't pump before every ride, so tire pressure varies from day-to-day.
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#33
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Hey Bad Lag - sorry to suggest you were being (unnecessarily) stubborn in your choice of tire pressures. I guess I was thinking of myself and also my riding buddies who have all come up with the high tire pressure urban myth.
I am sorry though that your experience with the latex tubes was not positive. Your experience is not uncommon from what I have heard. My weekend riding buddies that tried latex have all abandoned the latex and migrated back to the butyl tubes. Call me the outlier if you will, because I forged ahead with some early latex failures and have now gotten to a place where I truly feel that they are indispensable for me. In my opinion, a lot of the flatting that people get comes from inside the tire, from issues with rim tape that is less than optimal or minor issues with bead pinches. I have heard fans of latex say that latex tubes are less vulnerable to flats from glass shards compared to butyl and I tend to believe this.
It is interesting that you did comment on the sound the tires make being different, and also that the feel is slightly different. Maybe you are right that the actual rolling resistance isn't much different but that quieter rolling sound is very reassuring to me I know that. Also, you didn't say what type of classic road bike you are riding but I am wondering if it is a steel road bike that is already supremely compliant then you really are already riding a steed that can tolerate high pressure tires and still give a great ride. My aluminum bike that I pictured earlier in this thread is unfortunately overbuilt in a budget way. The ride on that bike is not compliant, the frame geometry was a neat fit experiment that I did on a budget and I learned a lot. Unfortunately it is a budget aluminum frame and they never optimized the compliance.
I am sorry though that your experience with the latex tubes was not positive. Your experience is not uncommon from what I have heard. My weekend riding buddies that tried latex have all abandoned the latex and migrated back to the butyl tubes. Call me the outlier if you will, because I forged ahead with some early latex failures and have now gotten to a place where I truly feel that they are indispensable for me. In my opinion, a lot of the flatting that people get comes from inside the tire, from issues with rim tape that is less than optimal or minor issues with bead pinches. I have heard fans of latex say that latex tubes are less vulnerable to flats from glass shards compared to butyl and I tend to believe this.
It is interesting that you did comment on the sound the tires make being different, and also that the feel is slightly different. Maybe you are right that the actual rolling resistance isn't much different but that quieter rolling sound is very reassuring to me I know that. Also, you didn't say what type of classic road bike you are riding but I am wondering if it is a steel road bike that is already supremely compliant then you really are already riding a steed that can tolerate high pressure tires and still give a great ride. My aluminum bike that I pictured earlier in this thread is unfortunately overbuilt in a budget way. The ride on that bike is not compliant, the frame geometry was a neat fit experiment that I did on a budget and I learned a lot. Unfortunately it is a budget aluminum frame and they never optimized the compliance.
#34
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So, I finally mounted the front tire. I've been riding the rear for over a week now but now I have WHITE WALL TIRES front and rear.
Honestly, they are not as bad as I thought but I would prefer to have not made this stupid mistake.
The new tires ride differently than the old tires, despite the same labeling, especially in the front. I will have to measure that front tire, too. It seems wider than the old one, which might explain the different ride.
Thanks, everyone.
Honestly, they are not as bad as I thought but I would prefer to have not made this stupid mistake.
The new tires ride differently than the old tires, despite the same labeling, especially in the front. I will have to measure that front tire, too. It seems wider than the old one, which might explain the different ride.
Thanks, everyone.
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Just use the appropriately colored enamel paint on the sidewall. It won’t take that long to paint them.
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Whitewalls might not be so bad......
I remember the Michelin foldable "Bib TS20" tires that Peugeot supplied with some of their mid level and higher end bikes in the early 80's actually had white sidewalls and they looked pretty good. The sidewalls did not stay so white after just a little time and a few miles because of brake pad residue and and tire rubber dust from the roads. I assume the same will happen to these tires.
I remember the Michelin foldable "Bib TS20" tires that Peugeot supplied with some of their mid level and higher end bikes in the early 80's actually had white sidewalls and they looked pretty good. The sidewalls did not stay so white after just a little time and a few miles because of brake pad residue and and tire rubber dust from the roads. I assume the same will happen to these tires.
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#37
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I've been riding these tires every day for well over a month now. I no longer care about the white color, as it has darkened a little with use.
They are great tires, performance-wise, as good as tubulars. I love the way they corner. I go out of my way to find fast, downhill turns. I added yet another to my route just a couple weeks ago.
Great tires!
They are great tires, performance-wise, as good as tubulars. I love the way they corner. I go out of my way to find fast, downhill turns. I added yet another to my route just a couple weeks ago.
Great tires!
#38
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I've been riding these tires every day for well over a month now. I no longer care about the white color, as it has darkened a little with use.
They are great tires, performance-wise, as good as tubulars. I love the way they corner. I go out of my way to find fast, downhill turns. I added yet another to my route just a couple weeks ago.
Great tires!
They are great tires, performance-wise, as good as tubulars. I love the way they corner. I go out of my way to find fast, downhill turns. I added yet another to my route just a couple weeks ago.
Great tires!
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