Gyro_T

Over my lifetime as an enthusiast, I have built a few dozen sets of wheels. In the 70's we regarded Robergel as a top spoke manufacturer. In the 90's Wheelsmith was considered by many as a top choice. The last set I built was with DT Swiss and the spokes themselves seem fine, but I found the nipples, or perhaps it was the thread tolerance between spoke and nipple, to be inferior to the above mentioned legacy brands. I am getting ready to build a new wheel for my touring bike with a generator hub. I want the best spokes and nipples available. I have always gone with brass instead of aluminum nipples. I am curious what the discriminating wheelbuilders use these days. Thanks.

FBinNY 

Over the years, I've never found a quality difference in top brand spokes, and chosen based on price, availability, and gauge options. FWIW, 100% of the wheels I've built used butted spokes in various gauges depending on the specific application, ie. rim, rider weight, and purpose. Brands I've used included, DT, Wheelsmith, Sapim, "S", Alpina, Stella, Godo, and so on. BITD, there were differences in the various companies tolerance in length, but now all I've used are OK there. Finally, I prefer spokes with shorter butted ends, so that is sometimes a deciding considerstion.

Nipples are a different story. Years ago I preferred the DT nipples which were made by Dubied (EDCO). When DT changed suppliers, I no longer had a brand preference, so today I choose based only on thread length, sourcing 12mm nipples with 7-8mm thread length.

mpetry912 

I have had very good luck with the Wheel Fanatyk splined nips, they are really great.

Splined Nipples - Wheel Fanatyk

yes you do need a dedicated spoke wrench

or the DT brass (non square lock or whatever they are called) just the standard brass ones.

/markp

Kontact

Tons of Wheelsmith nipples on ebay. Have at 'em.

grumpus

Was your preference based on the spline interface or some other quality?

GamblerGORD53

Can't beat DT Prolock nipples. That's all I've used on my heavyweight IGH bikes. No fuss no muss. VERY safe at different tensions. IMO
I like WH 2.3/ 2.0 spokes the best, used on all my drum brake hubs. My Rohloff14 got stuck with 32 straight 2.0, DT Swiss I think.
My last wheel I ended up with Sapim Strong 2.3. They have a longer thick part that is OK, but the head is bigger and uglier. Not so good.

mpetry912 

so the spline drive IS faster to build because the wrench engages every 60 degrees instead of 90 degrees as is the case with the square nipples.

and they are aluminum, so lighter weight.

/markp

Kontact

You put the wrench on, then you turn it. How does having more places to put the wrench make turning it faster?

TiHabanero

Splined nips are due to the nips being aluminum. Square nips round off more easily than brass nips under higher tensions. The spline pattern helps prevent rounding under the higher tensions. Has nothing to do with speed when building a wheel.

Trakhak

I'm guessing that it might not actually be faster but might feel faster. Like the difference between ratchet wrenches with coarse and fine ratcheting mechanisms. Being restricted to 90 degrees and 180 degrees for repositioning the spoke wrench, over and over and over, in building or repairing a wheel can start feeling tedious.

SurferRosa

Sapim Race from bikehubstore.com.

Rick

I use Sapim spokes and nipples. I use sapim Polyax nipples, The head is working like a ball joint. For a better spoke nipple line. When I received my Rohloff equipped bicycle the nipple spoke alignment was terrible. I found some old stock brand new Velocity Psycho rims and used them along with the Sapim spokes and there Polyax nipples. The Rohloff hubs are very large diameter and there has been some hub sheel failures under heavy use. They currently recommend there flange support rings. At the suggestion of a forum member I rebuilt the rear wheel to install the rings. My son bought a Fuji touring bicycle for a very good price. I purchased a son dynohub and had a new better quality shimano hub. I used the Sapim spokes and Polyax nipples. I used Andra 30 rims also.

Russ Roth

Mine is that I've never had one strip out while getting a lighter weight and cool colors. I've built at least 20 wheels with them in the 7 years since I found them and they've been excellent. Otherwise, no cares between the excessive wheelsmith and dt nips I have. I've been building with dt, wheelsmith, pillar and sapim, the biggest thing is picking the best spoke for the job.

Kontact

Turn the wrench to the four quads and you'll always know where to put it.

Try a Spokey wrench. Goes on easier but turns more securely.

Gyro_T

The DT wheels I built, I was not able to get the tension I was after without nearly rounding off the nipple flats. I remember backing off and replacing several that did not round off, but I felt it deform as I tightened. I was using a good spoke wrench. The cast type from Park that has grips on three sides of the nipple.

Kontact

Four sided wrenches are much better.

FBinNY 

I have no idea how much tension you seek, but do wonder if you've bought into the more tension is better myth.

I can't honestly say I've never rounded a nipple, but can say it's NEVER happened on a new build, even with alloy nipples. Then again, I don't build to the tensions some here do. Also, I don't use spoke prep or locking nipples. I lubricate them to minimize spoke twist, which also means they turn easily under load.

IME, butted spokes will twist like taffy at torques far below what would damage the flats on nipples.

TiHabanero

My friend Al, builds wheels and taught me something I had not known for the 35+ years I had worked in the industry. The hub and rim makers do have specs available as to the max spoke tension the hub or rim can take. When he builds he contacts the maker, not the distributor, and gets that spec from them.

Dan Burkhart 

Most rim manufacturers are quite responsive to inquiries like this. Better to try contacting them through their web page or even through social media which a lot of them are on these days than to ask questions about it on forums where most of what you get are uneducated guesses.
Some will put the info right on the web site but you may have to do some drilling to find it. Example Enve which I see a lot of. https://support.enve.com/hc/en-us/ar...rt-and-Tension

Kontact

Some of the responses I have seen from rim makers don't make a lot of sense, except as a limit. There is no way a particular model rim is going to benefit from the same spoke tension on a 20 hole drilling as 32 hole. We read tension off individual spokes, but the total tension across the wheel is much more important.