Dog and owner confrontation: escalate or evade?
03-22-10, 02:09 PM
#51
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Aham, your continued use of the signoff, 'later', may hurt your chances of ever making it to Top Gun.
03-22-10, 02:22 PM
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As long as we're using this episode as an excuse to devolve to the 80's, you might as well wear a cowboy hat on your next ride, blast the ZZ Top, and good naturedly call the owner an SOB. (You'd better pump, you SOB.)
03-22-10, 06:44 PM
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Of course. But you want to make the case to the dog that you are just passing through, are his equal, and not worth any trouble. They chase things that run. If you run, you go from being his equal (after all, you are bigger than him; the dog first assumes you are threatening), to being prey. I'll admit, my first instinct is to sprint, but I check that instinct and shout/bark at the dog and maintain my path out of his territory.
03-23-10, 11:10 AM
#54
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Follow up of sorts: I contacted the town police and inquired about a leash law and my options. No leash law in hicksville and my options according to this civil servant are; don't ride on that road, in fact don't ride in that town because "we" constitute a problem for most drivers. I then asked about their response to the use of a dog repellant in a confrontation, he said that was a bad idea and I could be charged with cruelty to animals. I actually laughed at him and suggested he study the law. I gave him my name and address and said I looked forward to seeing him on my next ride. ( I guess I'm a punk) I purchased the Halt at my LBS, you do not need a FID card (more liberal insanity) for this product. I can avoid the problem house by using another route that has a more difficult climb, as for the town cops, I think I'll make the police station a water/rest stop 
03-23-10, 11:12 AM
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Follow up of sorts: I contacted the town police and inquired about a leash law and my options. No leash law in hicksville and my options according to this civil servant are; don't ride on that road, in fact don't ride in that town because "we" constitute a problem for most drivers. I then asked about their response to the use of a dog repellant in a confrontation, he said that was a bad idea and I could be charged with cruelty to animals. I actually laughed at him and suggested he study the law. I gave him my name and address and said I looked forward to seeing him on my next ride. ( I guess I'm a punk) I purchased the Halt at my LBS, you do not need a FID card (more liberal insanity) for this product. I can avoid the problem house by using another route that has a more difficult climb, as for the town cops, I think I'll make the police station a water/rest stop
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03-23-10, 11:17 AM
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Best real world answer call animal control and let them know they will check into it and have it on record if it continues they will take action for you.
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03-23-10, 11:38 AM
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Sounds like the police really like bicyclists there. That must be nice. Maybe you need to make friends with them so they can find a biker they respect.
As for the homeowner, he has a bigger vehicle than you and you don't know what kind of temper you might be dealing with. That's not worth the trouble. If there is a nice way to discuss the fact that the road is public property and you, and anyone else biking, walking, horseback riding or whatever has as much right to it as a vehicle driver does unless it is posted differently. Does he want his dog to chase down and bite a child on a bicycle? He's not thinking through these kinds of issues and it would be useful for him and the police to do it.
Should tractors and other types of slow moving vehicles not be allowed in that town? They do cause traffic problems sometimes.
How about everybody being a little more decent and caring toward people? We have REAL enemies out there.
As for the homeowner, he has a bigger vehicle than you and you don't know what kind of temper you might be dealing with. That's not worth the trouble. If there is a nice way to discuss the fact that the road is public property and you, and anyone else biking, walking, horseback riding or whatever has as much right to it as a vehicle driver does unless it is posted differently. Does he want his dog to chase down and bite a child on a bicycle? He's not thinking through these kinds of issues and it would be useful for him and the police to do it.
Should tractors and other types of slow moving vehicles not be allowed in that town? They do cause traffic problems sometimes.
How about everybody being a little more decent and caring toward people? We have REAL enemies out there.
03-23-10, 11:51 AM
#58
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Sounds like the police really like bicyclists there. That must be nice. Maybe you need to make friends with them so they can find a biker they respect.
As for the homeowner, he has a bigger vehicle than you and you don't know what kind of temper you might be dealing with. That's not worth the trouble. If there is a nice way to discuss the fact that the road is public property and you, and anyone else biking, walking, horseback riding or whatever has as much right to it as a vehicle driver does unless it is posted differently. Does he want his dog to chase down and bite a child on a bicycle? He's not thinking through these kinds of issues and it would be useful for him and the police to do it.
Should tractors and other types of slow moving vehicles not be allowed in that town? They do cause traffic problems sometimes.
How about everybody being a little more decent and caring toward people? We have REAL enemies out there.
As for the homeowner, he has a bigger vehicle than you and you don't know what kind of temper you might be dealing with. That's not worth the trouble. If there is a nice way to discuss the fact that the road is public property and you, and anyone else biking, walking, horseback riding or whatever has as much right to it as a vehicle driver does unless it is posted differently. Does he want his dog to chase down and bite a child on a bicycle? He's not thinking through these kinds of issues and it would be useful for him and the police to do it.
Should tractors and other types of slow moving vehicles not be allowed in that town? They do cause traffic problems sometimes.
How about everybody being a little more decent and caring toward people? We have REAL enemies out there.
03-23-10, 12:46 PM
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I think you did ok. In Michigan we have a leash law. As soon as the dog leaves the property the owner is breaking the law. I have pepper sprayed 2 dogs, same incident, and the owner was screaming at me like I did something wrong. I try the pepper spray first, if the dogs managed to latch on to me they get the 9mm.
03-23-10, 01:11 PM
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...because nothing communicates the reasoning behind a justifiable response toward a chasing dog to an unknowing dog owner better than "FU pal, you're next." Well done bozo. I wonder what kind of understanding that owner will have for the next cyclist who rides by?
It's easier to get angry and mouth off, and feels somewhat exhilarating too. I know my Mom always taught me to "always do what's easiest and feels good son."
-Jeremy
It's easier to get angry and mouth off, and feels somewhat exhilarating too. I know my Mom always taught me to "always do what's easiest and feels good son."
-Jeremy
03-23-10, 01:18 PM
#61
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I think OP was right to spray the dog, but before talking about lawyers and/or guns, maybe just consider the situation from both sides.
To you, the dog was a snarling missle, an unknown, could be vicious, could be friendly, but who wants to take a chance, right? Pepper spray is non-lethal, so you were right to use it.
To the owner, his dog may be a friendly family pet who likes to bark at and chase moving things (this is 99% of dogs) while wagging his tail -- all in fun. All he knows is that his dog was barking at something, and now his dog is howling in pain and there is some guy on a bike saying "You're next pal". Only once you rode off and the pepper spray wore off did the owner piece together what happened. Don't go ascribing qualities that may or may not be true -- the owner is a lawless jerk, probably has a record, obviously no respect for the law -- because his dog was off the leash and chased something.
Write the guy a letter. Drop it in his mailbox (you may want to drive there :-) ). Tell him you regret what happened but you were frightened, did not know the dog and had to act, and that you ride in the area regularly and won't change your route. Tell him you like dogs and don't want to hurt them unnecessarily, but if the situation arises again you'll react the same.
To you, the dog was a snarling missle, an unknown, could be vicious, could be friendly, but who wants to take a chance, right? Pepper spray is non-lethal, so you were right to use it.
To the owner, his dog may be a friendly family pet who likes to bark at and chase moving things (this is 99% of dogs) while wagging his tail -- all in fun. All he knows is that his dog was barking at something, and now his dog is howling in pain and there is some guy on a bike saying "You're next pal". Only once you rode off and the pepper spray wore off did the owner piece together what happened. Don't go ascribing qualities that may or may not be true -- the owner is a lawless jerk, probably has a record, obviously no respect for the law -- because his dog was off the leash and chased something.
Write the guy a letter. Drop it in his mailbox (you may want to drive there :-) ). Tell him you regret what happened but you were frightened, did not know the dog and had to act, and that you ride in the area regularly and won't change your route. Tell him you like dogs and don't want to hurt them unnecessarily, but if the situation arises again you'll react the same.
03-23-10, 01:20 PM
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I think OP was right to spray the dog, but before talking about lawyers and/or guns, maybe just consider the situation from both sides.
To you, the dog was a snarling missle, an unknown, could be vicious, could be friendly, but who wants to take a chance, right? Pepper spray is non-lethal, so you were right to use it.
To the owner, his dog may be a friendly family pet who likes to bark at and chase moving things (this is 99% of dogs) while wagging his tail -- all in fun. All he knows is that his dog was barking at something, and now his dog is howling in pain and there is some guy on a bike saying "You're next pal". Only once you rode off and the pepper spray wore off did the owner piece together what happened. Don't go ascribing qualities that may or may not be true -- the owner is a lawless jerk, probably has a record, obviously no respect for the law -- because his dog was off the leash and chased something.
Write the guy a letter. Drop it in his mailbox (you may want to drive there :-) ). Tell him you regret what happened but you were frightened, did not know the dog and had to act, and that you ride in the area regularly and won't change your route. Tell him you like dogs and don't want to hurt them unnecessarily, but if the situation arises again you'll react the same.
To you, the dog was a snarling missle, an unknown, could be vicious, could be friendly, but who wants to take a chance, right? Pepper spray is non-lethal, so you were right to use it.
To the owner, his dog may be a friendly family pet who likes to bark at and chase moving things (this is 99% of dogs) while wagging his tail -- all in fun. All he knows is that his dog was barking at something, and now his dog is howling in pain and there is some guy on a bike saying "You're next pal". Only once you rode off and the pepper spray wore off did the owner piece together what happened. Don't go ascribing qualities that may or may not be true -- the owner is a lawless jerk, probably has a record, obviously no respect for the law -- because his dog was off the leash and chased something.
Write the guy a letter. Drop it in his mailbox (you may want to drive there :-) ). Tell him you regret what happened but you were frightened, did not know the dog and had to act, and that you ride in the area regularly and won't change your route. Tell him you like dogs and don't want to hurt them unnecessarily, but if the situation arises again you'll react the same.
03-23-10, 01:23 PM
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How do you know the dog owner can read and comprehend a letter.
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03-23-10, 02:00 PM
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Says the man who will discover the large dog who takes snips as the slow asses on the largest hill of the ride he is doing tonight for the first time. The dog hits you at the steepest grade - when you are your slowest.
...let me see your ass sprint up that one...
....just sayin.
later.
...let me see your ass sprint up that one...
....just sayin.
later.
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03-23-10, 02:09 PM
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I do have a mean wish for the dogs that come after me: This is a great time for a car to pass me and take them out...provided I don't get hit in the process. God help me not to be vindictive.
03-23-10, 03:01 PM
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03-23-10, 04:04 PM
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Every dog understands eye contact and a firm "No!". I've even turned back a pack of eight coyotes who were coming after my dog. (And then later realized they could probably have dragged me down if I hadn't.)
03-23-10, 04:37 PM
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03-23-10, 04:48 PM
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Even if you're the most impotent little wet-noodle who's ever turned a pedal, all dogs recognize we tree-dwelling primates as their superiors. At the very least, it will still make the dog hesitate for a second while you proceed.
03-23-10, 04:54 PM
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Sorry buddy but I can't agree with you... some dogs maybe even "most" dogs "respect" an adult humans "stature"... but by no means do "all dogs" or "every dog".
03-23-10, 05:00 PM
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Wait, you were serious? What you've posted might be true about some dogs, but you're not even close to correct about "all dogs."
03-23-10, 05:04 PM
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It's never failed for me, not even when there were 8 coyotes closing on my dog. But it sounds like you guys have more faith in your guns or chemical spray than in your masculinity.