Need Help Identifying Mystery Frame with Nice Chrome and Beautiful Chrome Fork Crown
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Need Help Identifying Mystery Frame with Nice Chrome and Beautiful Chrome Fork Crown
I am really stumped with identifying this one. No remnants of any decals and it looks like it was crudely repainted, including the wide red band on the seat tube.
Seems to be late 60s to 70s frame given that it has no cable guides (not even a rear derailleur stop) or bottle bosses, but it does have a threaded derailleur hanger. Chromed, ornate lugs on head tube and chromed rear triangle. Fork is completely chrome with a very slight slant to the crown. Has openings in the side of the crown that give it a bit of a bi-plane vibe. All of the chrome cleaned up really nicely with very little effort which is why I’m interested in figuring this one out and properly badging it after a repaint.
Forged dropouts on fork are stamped “Y.C.F” and the steerer tube has “F6F” stamped on it. I thought the fork may have been aftermarket, but on closer examination, the finish work on the dropouts on the fork and rear triangle have a very similar sweep to their transition to the frame that suggests it was the original fork.
Bottom bracket is threaded ISO/English. Shimano BB I suspect was a later add.
Had remnants of a Tange Falcon headset with English threading and the steerer tube inner diameter is 22.2.
Seatpost opening measured 25.4 to 25.8 so not a particularly high end tubing, but the frame feels fairly light, so it is not gas pipe either.
Rear hub diameter measured 127 mm so I suspect it was cold set from its original 120.
Feels like a nice Japanese production bike but the lack of any serial numbers gives me pause.
Any insights would be most welcome. Below are some photos and here is a Google album link with the photos I took today.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/rkr5PXTqdKvK4fLV7
Seems to be late 60s to 70s frame given that it has no cable guides (not even a rear derailleur stop) or bottle bosses, but it does have a threaded derailleur hanger. Chromed, ornate lugs on head tube and chromed rear triangle. Fork is completely chrome with a very slight slant to the crown. Has openings in the side of the crown that give it a bit of a bi-plane vibe. All of the chrome cleaned up really nicely with very little effort which is why I’m interested in figuring this one out and properly badging it after a repaint.
Forged dropouts on fork are stamped “Y.C.F” and the steerer tube has “F6F” stamped on it. I thought the fork may have been aftermarket, but on closer examination, the finish work on the dropouts on the fork and rear triangle have a very similar sweep to their transition to the frame that suggests it was the original fork.
Bottom bracket is threaded ISO/English. Shimano BB I suspect was a later add.
Had remnants of a Tange Falcon headset with English threading and the steerer tube inner diameter is 22.2.
Seatpost opening measured 25.4 to 25.8 so not a particularly high end tubing, but the frame feels fairly light, so it is not gas pipe either.
Rear hub diameter measured 127 mm so I suspect it was cold set from its original 120.
Feels like a nice Japanese production bike but the lack of any serial numbers gives me pause.
Any insights would be most welcome. Below are some photos and here is a Google album link with the photos I took today.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/rkr5PXTqdKvK4fLV7
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Overall shot of bike.
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That’s not stove pipe, that’s beautiful. Thinking of a repaint to set off those lugs, drops and forks?
Definitely a 60s-70s vibe like the early Centurions. Maybe a connection?
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Definitely a 60s-70s vibe like the early Centurions. Maybe a connection?
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I too thought Centurion, maybe from the 70's but they seemed to prefer long points
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I am no expert...
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1987 Crest Cannondale, 1987 Basso Gap, 1992 Rossin Performance EL, 1990ish Van Tuyl, 1985 Trek 670, 2003 Pinarello Surprise, 1990ish MBK Atlantique, 1987 Peugeot Competition, 1987 Nishiki Tri-A, 1981 Faggin, 1996 Cannondale M500, 1984 Mercian, 1982 AD SuperLeicht, 1985 Massi (model unknown), 1988 Daccordi Griffe , 1989 Fauxsin MTB, 1981 Ciocc Mockba, 1992 Bianchi Giro, 1977 Colnago Super, 1971 Raleigh International, 1998 Corratec Ap & Dun, 1991 Peugeot Slimestone
1987 Crest Cannondale, 1987 Basso Gap, 1992 Rossin Performance EL, 1990ish Van Tuyl, 1985 Trek 670, 2003 Pinarello Surprise, 1990ish MBK Atlantique, 1987 Peugeot Competition, 1987 Nishiki Tri-A, 1981 Faggin, 1996 Cannondale M500, 1984 Mercian, 1982 AD SuperLeicht, 1985 Massi (model unknown), 1988 Daccordi Griffe , 1989 Fauxsin MTB, 1981 Ciocc Mockba, 1992 Bianchi Giro, 1977 Colnago Super, 1971 Raleigh International, 1998 Corratec Ap & Dun, 1991 Peugeot Slimestone
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Lesser model?
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It looks like an early 1970s Fuji 'The Finest'. Surprising that there is no serial number on it - can you check the lower part of the seat tube on the non-drive side for any sign of indentation? That's where the numbers usually were around this time.
Here's that tiny bit of overhang on the seat stay caps:
Lugs and fork crown. I think they changed out the crown by mid-70s:
Here's that tiny bit of overhang on the seat stay caps:
Lugs and fork crown. I think they changed out the crown by mid-70s:
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It resembles my late 70's Rex Criterium, almost def higher end Japanese to my eye, My Rex was almost all chrome but only polished at select areas. The lugs were very much like the OP is showing. Nervex lugs maybe?
araya criterium rex - Pedal Room
araya criterium rex - Pedal Room
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Last edited by bykemike; 09-03-23 at 07:24 PM.
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If You Squint...
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the headlugs are "Nervex Inspired" but definitely of JP origin. Fuji was a prime user of these lugs but there were a few others, I don't know if the maker was ever ID'd.
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Pretty Sure it is a Fuji the Finest
Thank you for all the replies. Having pulled up a number of early 70s Fuji “The Finest” photos, it appears that is what this is. The lugs are an exact match and the head tube rivet holes line up with the very wide Fuji head badge in use back then. I have a first generation Shimano Dura Ace group set I have been looking to match with the right frame. Looks like this will be an interesting project.
With VeloCals being gone, going to be a bit of a challenge finding the right decals for it. Any suggestions are welcome. Also, if anyone has an early 70s Fuji head badge separate from a frame, drop me a line.
With VeloCals being gone, going to be a bit of a challenge finding the right decals for it. Any suggestions are welcome. Also, if anyone has an early 70s Fuji head badge separate from a frame, drop me a line.
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Centurion did use those lugs but the combo of the fork and the position of the head badge stud really points out to the Fuji.
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Lots of love around for The Finest. You should be pleased with the project.
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There's a couple head badges on ebay that sadly don't appear to be in a condition worthy of a full resto. Hopefully someone here has one as some jerk just bought the nicest one off of ebay this week for their '81 America...
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Thank you for all the replies. Having pulled up a number of early 70s Fuji “The Finest” photos, it appears that is what this is. The lugs are an exact match and the head tube rivet holes line up with the very wide Fuji head badge in use back then. I have a first generation Shimano Dura Ace group set I have been looking to match with the right frame. Looks like this will be an interesting project.
With VeloCals being gone, going to be a bit of a challenge finding the right decals for it. Any suggestions are welcome. Also, if anyone has an early 70s Fuji head badge separate from a frame, drop me a line.
With VeloCals being gone, going to be a bit of a challenge finding the right decals for it. Any suggestions are welcome. Also, if anyone has an early 70s Fuji head badge separate from a frame, drop me a line.
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Now I have More Questions than Answers
I uncovered the serial number on the non drive side of the lower down tube. It appears to be “6F06068” which doesn’t seem to match the Fuji serial number protocols since the first digit is a number and the second is a letter. Having now looked at a number of vintage Fujis, it is possible the Frame is a Fuji newest. Seems like they were the exact frame, but the color scheme matches a Newest and I found no evidence of blue when l used paint stripper to uncover the serial number. If the first 6 is the Showa calendar number, then the frame is a 1971. Thoughts?
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"F" Is For Faint?
I uncovered the serial number on the non drive side of the lower down tube. It appears to be “6F06068” which doesn’t seem to match the Fuji serial number protocols since the first digit is a number and the second is a letter. Having now looked at a number of vintage Fujis, it is possible the Frame is a Fuji newest. Seems like they were the exact frame, but the color scheme matches a Newest and I found no evidence of blue when l used paint stripper to uncover the serial number. If the first 6 is the Showa calendar number, then the frame is a 1971. Thoughts?
Could that be a very lightly struck "F" indicating the production facility in front of that first "6"?
(A side light might highlight it.)
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I uncovered the serial number on the non drive side of the lower down tube. It appears to be “6F06068” which doesn’t seem to match the Fuji serial number protocols since the first digit is a number and the second is a letter. Having now looked at a number of vintage Fujis, it is possible the Frame is a Fuji newest. Seems like they were the exact frame, but the color scheme matches a Newest and I found no evidence of blue when l used paint stripper to uncover the serial number. If the first 6 is the Showa calendar number, then the frame is a 1971. Thoughts?
Edit: machinist42 just beat me.
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I uncovered the serial number on the non drive side of the lower down tube. It appears to be “6F06068” which doesn’t seem to match the Fuji serial number protocols since the first digit is a number and the second is a letter. Having now looked at a number of vintage Fujis, it is possible the Frame is a Fuji newest. Seems like they were the exact frame, but the color scheme matches a Newest and I found no evidence of blue when l used paint stripper to uncover the serial number. If the first 6 is the Showa calendar number, then the frame is a 1971. Thoughts?
Update: Glad to see others seeing the F.
Last edited by MrGastrognome; 09-04-23 at 07:55 PM. Reason: update
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Not a Newest. The frames actually were quite a bit different. I have a 72 Newest. Serial number is on the bottom bracket also. Different lugs and seat stay treatment. Suntour dropouts and different fork crown too.
Last edited by sd5782; 09-04-23 at 08:28 PM.
#24
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Check the integrity of the braze where the seat stay meets the seat tube. Some these would crack along the plug and then turn 90 degrees across the tube.
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There is a faint F
Thank for the sharp eyes. There IS a faint “F” at the beginning which DOES line up with JP serial number protocols for a Fuji. Thanks for the heads up about the stamping on the steerer tube showing the “F6F” which reinforced that there is a faint F at the beginning of the serial number and that this is the fork that came with it.
According to T-Mar’s excellent Asian serial number guide in the C&V sticky section: https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...ber-guide.html the whole serial number can be interpreted as follows:
I will post updates as I move along with this project. Going to be a fun one!
According to T-Mar’s excellent Asian serial number guide in the C&V sticky section: https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...ber-guide.html the whole serial number can be interpreted as follows:
- The first F is the Fuji facility where it was made.
- The 6 is Showa year, which is 1971.
- The second F is the month of June.
- The remaining numbers are the serial number of this particular bike.
I will post updates as I move along with this project. Going to be a fun one!