Tell me again that tubeless is stupid
#51
Old fart
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Posts: 24,854
Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.
Mentioned: 154 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3618 Post(s)
Liked 3,458 Times
in
1,963 Posts
#52
Habitual User
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Altadena, CA
Posts: 8,279
Bikes: 2023 Niner RLT 9 RDO, 2018 Trek Procaliber 9.9 RSL, 2018 Storck Fascenario.3 Platinum, 2003 Time VX Special Pro, 2001 Colnago VIP, 1999 Trek 9900 singlespeed, 1977 Nishiki ONP
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5119 Post(s)
Liked 8,451 Times
in
3,993 Posts
Likes For Eric F:
#53
ignominious poltroon
Join Date: Jan 2022
Posts: 4,206
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2315 Post(s)
Liked 3,548 Times
in
1,870 Posts
Anyone recommending it (including Jan Heine).
What sealant did you use?
I am really surprised how poorly it worked in my one attempt.
#54
ignominious poltroon
Join Date: Jan 2022
Posts: 4,206
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2315 Post(s)
Liked 3,548 Times
in
1,870 Posts
Sounds exactly like my tubeless experience. 48mm Rene Herse Barlow Pass tires on Velocity A23 rims simply would not seat, no matter what we tried, including a compressor, and the strap-around-the-circumference trick. Did not buy and try an Airshot or similar bottle inflator, because l can't take one with me on my unsupported rides, now, can I.
The trick that has always worked for me with Rene Herse and other tires with flimsy sidewalls it to first mount the tire with a tube in it, and seat it correctly. Then open whichever side was easier to seal, and pull out the tube, put in a valve without the core, and then seat it with a blast from a pump. When it has seated properly, remove the pump head. All the air will come out of course, but the tire beads should remain in place. (Sometimes it helps to lay the wheel on its side.) Replace the valve core and inflate. If everything works, take the valve core out again, inject the sealant, again replace the valve core, and pump it again. You shouldn't need to do it in the field, but if you do, it will be easier once the tire has a "memory" of being mounted. If I am not in a hurry, I leave the tube in overnight.
Last edited by Polaris OBark; 05-13-24 at 02:17 PM. Reason: ambiguity correction
#55
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: North Central Wisconsin
Posts: 4,715
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3071 Post(s)
Liked 1,228 Times
in
795 Posts
Which model of tire did this happen on?
So I know which tire not to buy.
I'm tubeless in everything (fat, gravel and mountain) except my road bike which is TPU tube.
So I know which tire not to buy.
I'm tubeless in everything (fat, gravel and mountain) except my road bike which is TPU tube.
#56
Expired Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: TN
Posts: 11,929
Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3811 Post(s)
Liked 5,828 Times
in
2,946 Posts
Likes For shelbyfv:
#57
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2021
Posts: 8,871
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4641 Post(s)
Liked 5,175 Times
in
3,200 Posts
Not my problem. If the puncture is big enough then IME it is easy enough to find and plug. I think the OP had an edge case where they managed to keep riding anyway. I prefer the option of plugging punctures vs not, which is one of the main reasons I prefer tubeless over tubed. Something I picked up years ago from running tubeless UST mtb wheels. No sealant in those days, just relied on plugs to fix flats, which I always found way more convenient than messing around with tubes.
#58
The Wheezing Geezer
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Española, NM
Posts: 1,130
Bikes: 1976 Fredo Speciale, Rivendell Clem Smith Jr., Libertas mixte
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 430 Post(s)
Liked 1,026 Times
in
485 Posts
Barlows are 38mm.
The trick that has always worked for me with Rene Herse and other tires with flimsy sidewalls it to first mount the tire with a tube in it, and seat it correctly. Then open whichever side was easier to seal, and pull out the tube, put in a valve without the core, and then seat it with a blast from a pump. When it has seated properly, remove the pump head. All the air will come out of course, but the tire beads should remain in place. (Sometimes it helps to lay the wheel on its side.) Replace the valve core and inflate. If everything works, take the valve core out again, inject the sealant, again replace the valve core, and pump it again. You shouldn't need to do it in the field, but if you do, it will be easier once the tire has a "memory" of being mounted. If I am not in a hurry, I leave the tube in overnight.
The trick that has always worked for me with Rene Herse and other tires with flimsy sidewalls it to first mount the tire with a tube in it, and seat it correctly. Then open whichever side was easier to seal, and pull out the tube, put in a valve without the core, and then seat it with a blast from a pump. When it has seated properly, remove the pump head. All the air will come out of course, but the tire beads should remain in place. (Sometimes it helps to lay the wheel on its side.) Replace the valve core and inflate. If everything works, take the valve core out again, inject the sealant, again replace the valve core, and pump it again. You shouldn't need to do it in the field, but if you do, it will be easier once the tire has a "memory" of being mounted. If I am not in a hurry, I leave the tube in overnight.
It sounds plausible that broken-in tires would seat easier. Next time my brother visits, I'll bet he'll want to try - it's his bike and they're his wheels. Thanks for the tip.
Likes For Fredo76:
#59
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 3,905
Bikes: Trek Domane SL6 Gen 3, Soma Fog Cutter, Focus Mares AL, Detroit Bikes Sparrow FG, Volae Team, Nimbus MUni
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 920 Post(s)
Liked 2,113 Times
in
1,113 Posts
All of my bikes are tubeless now, exclusively road bikes ridden 99% on pavement.
Unlike others who've had no on road issues, I've had several. Cut sidewalls requiring boot and tube (3), tread cuts that did not seal (2). Every one of those would have been an identical failure and repair if originally tubed.
So that's a wash.
I've had one cut that I successfully repaired with a plug.
So that's a win.
I've had many punctures on road that sealed with minimal pressure loss.
That's a win.
I've had many frustrating sessions in the garage trying to successfully tape a rim, trying to seat a tire, trying to remove a tire.
That's not a win. I'm getting better, perhaps have taping figured out, which is huge.
IMO, road tubeless is not as great as often reported, not as easy as often suggested. But still an overall improvement.
I just rode a 400k brevet, pretty sure my rear tire (gp5k) settled down to 20psi for the last 200 miles. I could have stopped and tubed it, but meh - which itself is a tubeless win.
Unlike others who've had no on road issues, I've had several. Cut sidewalls requiring boot and tube (3), tread cuts that did not seal (2). Every one of those would have been an identical failure and repair if originally tubed.
So that's a wash.
I've had one cut that I successfully repaired with a plug.
So that's a win.
I've had many punctures on road that sealed with minimal pressure loss.
That's a win.
I've had many frustrating sessions in the garage trying to successfully tape a rim, trying to seat a tire, trying to remove a tire.
That's not a win. I'm getting better, perhaps have taping figured out, which is huge.
IMO, road tubeless is not as great as often reported, not as easy as often suggested. But still an overall improvement.
I just rode a 400k brevet, pretty sure my rear tire (gp5k) settled down to 20psi for the last 200 miles. I could have stopped and tubed it, but meh - which itself is a tubeless win.
#60
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: South shore, L.I., NY
Posts: 7,066
Bikes: Flyxii FR322, Cannondale Topstone, Miyata City Liner, Specialized Chisel, Specialized Epic Evo
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3366 Post(s)
Liked 2,198 Times
in
1,246 Posts
Barlows are 38mm.
The trick that has always worked for me with Rene Herse and other tires with flimsy sidewalls it to first mount the tire with a tube in it, and seat it correctly. Then open whichever side was easier to seal, and pull out the tube, put in a valve without the core, and then seat it with a blast from a pump. When it has seated properly, remove the pump head. All the air will come out of course, but the tire beads should remain in place. (Sometimes it helps to lay the wheel on its side.) Replace the valve core and inflate. If everything works, take the valve core out again, inject the sealant, again replace the valve core, and pump it again. You shouldn't need to do it in the field, but if you do, it will be easier once the tire has a "memory" of being mounted. If I am not in a hurry, I leave the tube in overnight.
The trick that has always worked for me with Rene Herse and other tires with flimsy sidewalls it to first mount the tire with a tube in it, and seat it correctly. Then open whichever side was easier to seal, and pull out the tube, put in a valve without the core, and then seat it with a blast from a pump. When it has seated properly, remove the pump head. All the air will come out of course, but the tire beads should remain in place. (Sometimes it helps to lay the wheel on its side.) Replace the valve core and inflate. If everything works, take the valve core out again, inject the sealant, again replace the valve core, and pump it again. You shouldn't need to do it in the field, but if you do, it will be easier once the tire has a "memory" of being mounted. If I am not in a hurry, I leave the tube in overnight.
#61
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: South shore, L.I., NY
Posts: 7,066
Bikes: Flyxii FR322, Cannondale Topstone, Miyata City Liner, Specialized Chisel, Specialized Epic Evo
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3366 Post(s)
Liked 2,198 Times
in
1,246 Posts
IMO, road tubeless is not as great as often reported, not as easy as often suggested. But still an overall improvement.
[/QUOTE]
Tend to agree with this. One thing forgotten is that with tubeless, you can generally run less air pressure. I find running 70-80 psi on my road bike, instead of 105-110 makes for a far more comfortable ride. So that’s a win.
[/QUOTE]
Tend to agree with this. One thing forgotten is that with tubeless, you can generally run less air pressure. I find running 70-80 psi on my road bike, instead of 105-110 makes for a far more comfortable ride. So that’s a win.
Likes For Steve B.:
#64
cowboy, steel horse, etc
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: The hot spot.
Posts: 45,263
Bikes: everywhere
Mentioned: 74 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13033 Post(s)
Liked 7,958 Times
in
4,232 Posts
#65
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 8,173
Mentioned: 42 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7163 Post(s)
Liked 11,366 Times
in
4,858 Posts
The point, as outlined in the original post, is that my riding conditions are mine -- and in those conditions, I benefit from tubeless tires. The post is addressed to those bf'ers who can't fathom that other people may not ride for the same reasons, or on the same roads, as they do.
As for the OT posts about pool noodles and injecting sealant into tubes...well, that's just the sort of dross that lands in almost every bf thread.
Likes For Koyote:
#66
Junior Member
Likes For slow rollin:
#67
Grupetto Bob
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Seattle-ish
Posts: 6,554
Bikes: Bikey McBike Face
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2745 Post(s)
Liked 6,097 Times
in
3,108 Posts
All of my bikes are tubeless now, exclusively road bikes ridden 99% on pavement.
Unlike others who've had no on road issues, I've had several. Cut sidewalls requiring boot and tube (3), tread cuts that did not seal (2). Every one of those would have been an identical failure and repair if originally tubed.
So that's a wash.
I've had one cut that I successfully repaired with a plug.
So that's a win.
I've had many punctures on road that sealed with minimal pressure loss.
That's a win.
I've had many frustrating sessions in the garage trying to successfully tape a rim, trying to seat a tire, trying to remove a tire.
That's not a win. I'm getting better, perhaps have taping figured out, which is huge.
IMO, road tubeless is not as great as often reported, not as easy as often suggested. But still an overall improvement.
I just rode a 400k brevet, pretty sure my rear tire (gp5k) settled down to 20psi for the last 200 miles. I could have stopped and tubed it, but meh - which itself is a tubeless win.
Unlike others who've had no on road issues, I've had several. Cut sidewalls requiring boot and tube (3), tread cuts that did not seal (2). Every one of those would have been an identical failure and repair if originally tubed.
So that's a wash.
I've had one cut that I successfully repaired with a plug.
So that's a win.
I've had many punctures on road that sealed with minimal pressure loss.
That's a win.
I've had many frustrating sessions in the garage trying to successfully tape a rim, trying to seat a tire, trying to remove a tire.
That's not a win. I'm getting better, perhaps have taping figured out, which is huge.
IMO, road tubeless is not as great as often reported, not as easy as often suggested. But still an overall improvement.
I just rode a 400k brevet, pretty sure my rear tire (gp5k) settled down to 20psi for the last 200 miles. I could have stopped and tubed it, but meh - which itself is a tubeless win.
I see it as a worthwhile trade-off.
__________________
Road 🚴🏾♂️ & Mountain 🚵🏾♂️
Road 🚴🏾♂️ & Mountain 🚵🏾♂️
#68
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 39,669
Mentioned: 211 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18596 Post(s)
Liked 16,094 Times
in
7,557 Posts
Thanks for the congrats, but bragging was not the point, as I suspect many bf'ers regularly do more impressive rides.
The point, as outlined in the original post, is that my riding conditions are mine -- and in those conditions, I benefit from tubeless tires. The post is addressed to those bf'ers who can't fathom that other people may not ride for the same reasons, or on the same roads, as they do.
As for the OT posts about pool noodles and injecting sealant into tubes...well, that's just the sort of dross that lands in almost every bf thread.
The point, as outlined in the original post, is that my riding conditions are mine -- and in those conditions, I benefit from tubeless tires. The post is addressed to those bf'ers who can't fathom that other people may not ride for the same reasons, or on the same roads, as they do.
As for the OT posts about pool noodles and injecting sealant into tubes...well, that's just the sort of dross that lands in almost every bf thread.
#70
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2021
Posts: 8,871
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4641 Post(s)
Liked 5,175 Times
in
3,200 Posts
It’s a bit different with mtb tyres where pinch flatting might require significantly higher pressure with a tubed tyre.
#71
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: South shore, L.I., NY
Posts: 7,066
Bikes: Flyxii FR322, Cannondale Topstone, Miyata City Liner, Specialized Chisel, Specialized Epic Evo
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3366 Post(s)
Liked 2,198 Times
in
1,246 Posts
With road tyres, pressure is related far more to tyre width/volume than whether or not tubeless. For the same width tyre, the recommended pressures are within a few psi for tubed vs tubeless.
It’s a bit different with mtb tyres where pinch flatting might require significantly higher pressure with a tubed tyre.
It’s a bit different with mtb tyres where pinch flatting might require significantly higher pressure with a tubed tyre.
Likes For Steve B.:
#72
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2021
Posts: 8,871
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4641 Post(s)
Liked 5,175 Times
in
3,200 Posts
The difference with road tyres is that the optimum running pressure (lowest rolling resistance) should be high enough to avoid pinch flats regardless. But you are correct in saying that you could run much lower tubeless pressures if you wanted to maximise ride comfort.
#73
Old fart
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Posts: 24,854
Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.
Mentioned: 154 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3618 Post(s)
Liked 3,458 Times
in
1,963 Posts
#74
Old fart
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Posts: 24,854
Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.
Mentioned: 154 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3618 Post(s)
Liked 3,458 Times
in
1,963 Posts
#75
The Wheezing Geezer
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Española, NM
Posts: 1,130
Bikes: 1976 Fredo Speciale, Rivendell Clem Smith Jr., Libertas mixte
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 430 Post(s)
Liked 1,026 Times
in
485 Posts
The crap we put up with here from the resident bf buttheads, who can't even take a joke! Sheesh!
WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHH !! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHH !!