SandLizrd

Moose hate dogs with a passion. And there is a phrase unique to moose - one isn't attacked, or mauled or injured or any other common word -

One is STOMPED by a moose. Pretty descriptive, huh?

I was riding the coastal trail in Anchorage, happy as a lizrd could be, and whipped down this little hill and around the curve. There stood baby moose. Just then something that looked the size of a VW rose up and turned and looked at me - that was mama moose's head! Scary stuff. I never knew I was a world-class sprinter until that moment

jabantik00

i use an older ursack. i have never seen any evidence that a bear has tried to break into it, so i can't give any opinion as to how bear-proof it is. it is not an approved bear container in yosemite, where bears are notoriously smart about getting human food. i'm fairly confident it will keep out raccoons and squirrels and jays and other varmints that could make a go for your food.

they compress as you deplete your food, requiring less space compared to a hard container. where will you be travelling and how much food will you be carrying? i think they are designed to hold around 7-10 days of backpacker-style, calorically-dense, dehydrated food. you are that family with that triple-tandem, right? i think i ran into the dad and kids at mackerriker park in california in 2006. i think you could probably get all your food and scented items into 2 or 3 such bags, but that is just a guess. are you going to remote areas where your will not be able to frequently resupply?

i'm not convinced that pepper spray is a good thing. the bear-style fogger cans are rather expensive, bulky, and potentially dangerous. and i wonder if i will ever be in a situation where i will have the capacity and need to use it. then again, i don't travel with any children or pets that i may need to defend. i'd be interested to read some testimonials about people who use such products, but for the most part, i think people are trying to buy a bit of false security or confidence when they buy such things.

be bear-aware. make lots of noise, don't startle bears or other spookable critters, practice the triangle, yadda yadda. have a good trip. where are you going?

jamawani 

If you can kiss a bear very gently on the nose, you should be safe.

JohnyW

Hi,

take your camera and make a nice picture. Last year I was in Canada (3 weeks in bear country) and in summer in Japan (2 weeks in bear country) I saw in total 3 bears. 2 Black bears run away when I put my camera out and the grizzly was quite far away.... (I always hike without a bear bell)

I cooked and stored my food (open) 100 m far away from the site I slept. Not even a mice touched my food. Once I tried the thing with the tree but I wasn't successful

In Canada/Japan I had more problems with mosquitos...

So don't be so afraid. The bears normally dissapear before you'll see them. And they are only interested in your food.

Thomas

Rowan

Keep in mind that your behaviour may well be fatal for the bear.

If you intervene in a bear's activities, in the belief that you are safe, then you may well be bitten, or worse.

There have been several recent cases in Canada where bears have attacked overconfident tourists, and two black bears have been shot, while the hunt is on for a grizzly.

rhm

Okay, this is all very interesting, and good reading too. I'm glad I bumped this thread.

Moose question: will moose ever come to my campsite looking for food or trouble, or is that something only bears (and raccoons, skunks, mice, &c) do?

Clearly both bear and moose are dangerous when encountered at close quarters while moving, i.e. during the day. Either one is likely to be protective of its young, its territory, its food, its self, and so on. That said, I'm not too worried about these encounters; if I'm on a bike, on paved roads, and aware of my surroundings, I should be able to avoid them most of the time and, when I can't avoid them entirely, be careful not to spook them.

Torrilin

I would not *expect* a moose to come into a human campsite looking for food. But it is always possible that you will run into a wild animal who has been fed by humans and is no longer afraid of them. And in some areas of the US, the moose herd is more used to humans in general... I know an EMT who lives about 30 miles south of the New Hampshire/Quebec border, and he expects to see several accidents involving humans and moose every year.

Bekologist

Me and a buddy were bivying in a high pass in the north Cascades and spent an uneasy night with a bull elk that felt we were bedding down in HIS hollow!

There was a thread from one of the forum moderators (Tom) that had an encounter with 'territorial' wolves along pictured rocks natl lakeshore.

I've seen a bear within 20 miles of downtown seattle.

Torrrilin brings up a good point - campground behavior of conditioned wild animals can be problematic - look at the learned 'bad bear' behavior among the Yosemite bears....

jamawani - nice allude to treadwell.

SandLizrd

Moose are famous for getting into Alaskan's yards and eating all the flowers. Smart Alaskans look out the window before they open the front door and walk out. Golf courses often have a moose alert - if it sounds, there's a moose on the fairway somewhere and all the golfers go to the lounge for awhile.

Meadows, streams and glades full of sweet green munchies might be a bad place to camp but that's about all the threat you'll have. Suspend all your chives and onions 20 feet above the ground! Of course, a dog changes this equation - the usual scenario is dog runs and barks at moose, dog gets stomped. Or you might read some Iditarod stories about enraged moose jumps a dog team, gets tied up in the leads, several dogs get stomped. Nasty business, I met a man who lost a dog this way and he said it was pretty much puppyburger when moose was done

nancy sv

We are now in Jackson, Wyoming and are just about at the southern end of bear country - another 200 miles or so and we shouldn't have to even think about them. That means, of course, that we've now pedaled through 3600 miles of bear country - and all four of us are still alive.

We practiced the basic triangle - tent in one spot, cooked in another, and stored food in another. We kept all our food in waterproof drybags set on the ground at least 100 meters away from the tent. Originally we have thought we would hang it, but we started up in the Arctic tundra where there were no trees, and then the trees were stunted for a while - so there simply was no way to hang them. Besides, carrying enough food for four people for ten more more days is a lot of food and it was simply too heavy to hang!

We did have one close encounter with a bear and, while very, very scary, we came out OK. I don't think it had anything to do with food at all and, short of not cycling through that area at that particular moment, I don't think there was anything we could have done. But as they say, all's well that ends well!!

After our close encounter someone gave us some bear spray so I have it on my handlebars now. Of course, we've never even come close to needing it since we got it! When the bear was standing four feet from my side, however, I would have used it if I had had it!

jabantik00 - yes, we are that family. We now have one tandem and two singles and are riding from Alaska to Argentina. I was so bummed I missed the northern California coast on our last trip!!

Rowan

Are we talking moose or elk? Elk will wander through organised campsites. The bulls are big, imposing animals.

I've been told a story about a deer farm owner who put a young buck in with a much older bull. The next morning, the buck was dead, gored many times all over, and his body had been rolled through a fence that was "deer proof".

Moral of that story is: Don't argue with a big male elk.

Take a look at these pictures -- an elk family working their way through the Whistler Campground at Jasper, August 2008. Note how Machka is well distanced from the male elk, and has trees nearby, as well as an escape route back towards me.

And the third picture shows just how close these animals can get to your tent -- and you! We certainly didn't get between this one and the male.

Erick L

Elks also enjoy a lil' golfin'



I had rutting elks chasing each other pass right by my tent in Jasper. One morning, a male was rounding up his harem and for some reason, chased a photograper... twice! Don't know why he picked him. Must be the perfume.

Bekologist

moose are more dangerous than elk to humans, moose will attack cars. doubt a motorist would ever be in danger.

I've come up on more than a few moose in the woods -it's as thrilling as surprising a bear.

Who has ever heard a moose coming thru thick brush? they sounds like a bulldozer..

kuan

I'm pretty surprised. The only time I've ever come across a Moose when I snuck up on it in a canoe. It bolted.

Hofweber

:vandal:

TruckerMike

Consider keep stuff that gets the scent of food or toiletries confined to one bag, and the rest in a seperate bag (ie your other pannier). So clothes, tools, maps etc go in left pannier, and your stove, food, utensils, soaps etc go in the the right pannier. Put said right pannier up in the tree.

This is a good point to acknowledge the Ortlieb classic roller design. Ever seen a climber's "haul bag" - they're smooth and burly for being pulled up via ropes along the rock face. Now picture pulling your pannier up into a tree and watching it hit all the branch and treebark on the way up (it happens). I'd argue the the smooth exterior and sturdy fabric of those Ortliebs would a)be the least likely to get caught up on limbs, and b) is least likely to show the wear from this type of abrasion.

Another poster acknoledged the common scenario of rolling it at dusk and the trials and tribuations of getting your rope up a tree in the dark/semi-dark. If this is likely to be u, recommend avoid having to hunt for a suitable rock, tie on rope yadayada and instead get a plastic container (500mL) with a landyard loop rigged to it. You put in something weighty like your multi-tool and have a rope tied to landyard and voila - you streamline the whole tedious process. If you like, make this the first step when you set up camp.

Fueled by Boh

re: cooking and camping in open areas

I've heard that bears like open areas too. I bumped into a guy in missoula, MT who had just ridden the cassiar or Dalton highway (forget which) and spent one entire night being bluff charged by a grizzly while camped in a gravel pit. Didn't have anything to do with campsite contamination, i dont think. He just happened to be on her turf. So, obviously avoid obvious bear signs (ie bear waste, carcasses -no duh-). Hello John, if you're reading this.

NoReg

Here is an interesting article about a BC guy who beat a bear to death with a stick. Lucky to find a stick that strong:

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/cbc/08100...ack_survivor_1