Fear&Trembling

According to Social Identity theory, drivers see other drivers as part of their “in-group,” and see cyclists as an “out-group,” to be discriminated against. And in order to justify that discrimination, the in-group will catalogue the negative, anti-social behavior of members of the out-group as stereotypical behavior of the out-group; this “stereotypical” anti-social behavior is then identified as the reason that the out-group is discriminated against. In the case of anti-cyclist rhetoric, this means that “scofflaw cyclists” are presented as the reason underlying the discrimination against all cyclists. The flip side is that cyclist often feel persecuted and stereotype the out-group (ie drivers).

filtersweep

Cyclists are not unpopular in many other parts of the world. There is a real bully mentality on the roads in the US.

Also notable is how easy it is to get a drivers license in the US--- where they seem to care more about eyesight than skill.

defiancecp

There ARE real problems with the way cars drive. That doesn't change the fact that there are also problems with the way some cyclists ride, and that it makes the problem worse. When I see those idiots weaving through traffic across cantrell, I'm mad - not because of any inconvenience to me directly, but because his behavior throws more fuel on the fire.

As for working on the bigger problems first - is there something more we could be doing to directly address the other problems? I know that any time I see something I can do, I do it. I'm always courteous and law-abiding when I ride, I talk to coworkers and acquaintances, and I try to take advantage of any opportunity to spread the idea that bicyclists should be welcome. These efforts are undermined by every valid argument we give the opposition, however hypocritical it is of them to use it, so in my opinion, addressing this problem would only further our efforts to resolve the other, much more important issues.

As for me commuting, it honestly wouldn't help in my case. My son is 9, and he goes to school at a magnet school (meaning no busses) downtown. We ride together a lot, but his skills aren't ready to handle downtown. His school is about 2 miles from home, and the wife and I work about 2 miles from school, so going back home to ride to work would be pointless. In a couple years, I hope my son will be up to the level to be able to, though.

2new2this

Non cyclists, is who I was speaking of. I should have re-worded it, "Only cyclists . . ."

uke

Yup. Cycling is several times more dangerous in the US than in most places overseas.

crhilton

No, they'll hate you no matter what. They hate you because you travel at half their speed. They hate passing you. They hate the notion of being delayed by you.

uke

They also hate your freedom (to travel without gas). I remember an editorial discussed in this forum where the writer referred to bicyclists "gliding past gas stations" while writing about how they needed taxing or licenses to be on the road.

frymaster

sure there are -- anything that makes driving less effective or more expensive takes asses out of cars and puts them in busses or on bikes reduces the impact drivers have by making less of them. the bottom line is that we all here are (theoretically at least) bicycle advocates. to me that means encouraging folks to get out of cars and onto bicycles. that means making driving less attractive and biking more appealing.

were i you (although i'm not so feel free to ignore me) i'd start by pressuring this "magnet school" to offer bussing.

Saving Hawaii

Shoot; I got my drivers license with about five hours of time behind the wheel. Absolutely should never have been allowed and I was far from safe when I started driving. It wasn't until an employer put me through a pretty good defensive driving course (commercial driving makes that happen, eh?) that I learned a lot of the things I should have known about before I ever touched the ignition.

Paul Barnard

Let me see if I have this right. Motorists hate me because I slow them down, then they hate me if I run a traffic light to get out of the congestion, the result of which keeps me from slowing them down. What are the potential consequences to the motorists if I break the law? What are the potential consequences to me if a motorist breaks the law? I'm glad we had this talk. I feel better now.

CB HI

So address their hypocrisy rather than blame other cyclist for motorist bad behavior.

Here are 3 easy options for you:
Trail-A-Bike, Trek Mountain Train or Burley Piccolo

https://www.trail-a-bike.com/product/...inal-folder-1/
https://larryscycle.com/06trekmountaintrain206.htm
https://www.burley.com/products/child/piccolo.cfm

wheel

The big complaint seems to be the number of bicyclists who routinely ignore traffic laws.


Well that is the only thing they can complain about because it is illegal. So hence the big complaint.
Else you sound like a dictator.

PaulH

Because the weak always envy the strong.

Paul

Flying Merkel

Cuz we're slow, in the way & wear ugly clothes.

pueblonative

I probably have the same fear of dogs until I realize that if a dog were to actually try and bite me the dog would probably be going on a very short and painful trip. Not to mention most dogs wouldn't know what to do with a bicycle if they caught it in the first place. This is different from the shock when a dog I don't notice starts biking out of the blue.

sknhgy 

The complaints I have heard, or read about in the paper, are of packs of cyclists who ride two abreast and hold up traffic when they could be going single file, or using an adjacent bike path.
There are bike paths here that parallel the roads, but some bike riders don't use them. Instead they ride the road and hold up traffic. That is very annoying.

Biknmik

Right now we are the ones "who must have a DUI and can't drive a car or are too poor to do so".
If your will remember a short time ago, (I'm telling my age now) Harley riders were considered bums
and the like. Now it's cool to be a Harley rider. It's like this, they can't or won't see us on the road
so therefore we scare them when they have to swerve to miss us. Like deer, most people love to
look at them but when they cross the road "those damn deer" is the phrase heard most often.
We slow them down in their "must have it now" world. Me, if I see a guy on a bike while I'm driving,
I give him every courtesy due him since I know how it is to travel on both sides of the fence.
Ohh well, some day.

cyclezealot

also, because they are big time stressed out.. Humans just hate it when some of us a not maladjusted.

CB HI

Not nearly as annoying as the packs of motorist that jam up the roads and slow me down during rush hour(s). Especially when they all could move over to the fast lane and leave the right lane clear for cyclist capable of moving at a higher speeds during rush hour(s).

zeytoun

They have freeways designed specifically designed for car use. I find it very annoying when cars use surface streets instead of sticking to the freeway, and slow me down when I'm cycling.



If the bike path parallel to the road were better, you can bet that the cyclists would be using it. The fact that a cyclist is willing to face traffic full of weirdos like you, is a testament to how inconvenient or unsafe the path must be.

Blue Roads

A lot of good thoughts in this thread, but I think you largely answered your own question.

Some cyclists, by ignoring traffic laws -- and dare I say, what could be called basic traffic courtesy, such as signaling an intention -- make it tough for the cycling community. For the folks in cars, I'd also add equal parts of "My hurry is more important than you" -- in our fast-paced culture, some perceive being delayed for one minute as a slap in the face -- and they don't understand or care about cycling laws.

I'm no traffic angel on my bike, I've certainly run a few stop signs, but 99% of the time I try to be courteous, predictable, and as safe as possible, including taking the lane when that's the best course. I'm also well lit with good reflective gear. As a result, I've had very few conflicts with cars while cycling.

It's only common sense that good conduct while cycling is safer and benefits us all. And it's still fun.

crhilton

I don't count the taxation excuse. I don't think it's particularly common and it's based entirely in incorrect data. While we pay no direct taxes we pay for 25%-40% of road costs through other taxation (based on our income, luxury purchases, and property values) and we require far less than 25% of the road width as currently built.

If anything, drivers are free riders due to the massive amount of free and otherwise subsidized parking that they receive.

But I'm preaching to the choir aren't I?

(I'm speaking of the US).

sknhgy 

Dang man, chill out. I'm just telling you what I hear.
How did you know I was a wierdo?

Gee3

That's interestingly funny. Before I started cycling I saw cyclists as a bother because if they were too slow and I wasn't able to safely get around them my impatience would kick in. In fact, it still does at times when there is ample shoulder for a slower "vehicle" to move over so faster vehicles could pass by. (Vehicles in CA code are consiudered both cars and bikes)

But now as a cyclist myself that has to "share the road" I am more apt to be more careful and patient with cyclists. That or give them ample room when passing. I know I appreciate it when others do the same for me.

However, I have never thought or felt anger or dismay at a cyclist (even prior to becoming one) because I felt they could travel without gassing up or becuase they are "free"! I could care less about that. And others I know have never complained to me about me gliding past gas stations while they are stuck in a car.

Sorry, I just have never heard that argument in the San Francisco Bay Area (or the Dallas area when I lived there) from anyone I've known or met. It's mostly about impatience [by both sides]. We, both as a driver and cyclist, can do our own part to de-fuse situations by simply being more courteous and patient.

zeytoun

Sorry.