PaulRivers

Yeah, for cheap studded tires that's true, like Innova's (again their non studded tires might be fine I don't know).

I've had a front skinny tire slip out on a bike, and it was just like described online - suddenly I was down with no chance to react.

I invited a coworker to go to a bike demo with fat bikes (pugsleys I think) on a lake, because I was curious how a really fat tire handled ice. She knew how to bike, but was no "serious" biker or anything. The lake surface alternate between large patches of ice and large patches of snow. We both biked across it. When I ended up on the sheer ice section, I could not keep the bike upright and biking forward it would slide out and I'd have to walk it across. But - it slid out slowly enough that I had no problem getting a foot down. Compare this to my skinny tire where I didn't even have time to process that I was going down, let alone get a foot down.

If you want to bike on sheer ice, I'd want studs, but just for safety on commuting where you don't hit much sheer ice with both tires at the same time, I'm not sure if you need them or not. (With skinny tires I feel like you needs studs.)

Huh, you found the Nokian 294's useful? Any more info on the conditions you use them in? Like I said in my post, I had trouble figuring out a use for 2" tires - didn't seem to let me get through any more snow than the 30-40c models.

On a slightly different subject, I think this was your thread on making your own studded tires isn't it?
https://www.bikeforums.net/winter-cyc...ded-tyres.html

PaulRivers

Ha, they are slower. But imagine it's your only form of transportation to get to work, it might be worth being able to handle 6 more inches of snow and rolling over ice that's frozen in bizarre patterns. I also wonder if you acclimate to whatever bike you're riding to a large extent.

They're definitely less than 50% of the bikes I see, but I see a lot of them in Minnesota in the winter.

Sixty Fiver

The 294's are awesome when the snow packs into ice and on the real stuff and yes, my thread on self studded tyres.

The 294's I run were given to me by a customer which was pretty nice.

Skinny tyres on ice are really fun... when I run studless a set of 2.0 mtb knobbies is way better.

noglider 

Funny how the existence of something creates its own need. But it's not insincere.

noglider 

OK maybe people are used to this by now, but I'm somewhat in shock. I found the best price ($65 each) for the Schwalbe tires on Wiggle, a company in the UK. I ordered them on Wednesday. Shipping was free. Huh? OK, great. For an extra $6.62, I could get tracking for the shipping, and I don't normally pay for these extras, but it's nice for an international shipment. I got the package yesterday, Thursday, i.e. THE NEXT DAY! The package was sent and then moved from England, through Leipzig, Germany, and to me in New York City, in ONE DAY.

alan s 

Thanks for the review. I have 26 x 1.75 Marathon Winters (great tires) on one bike and am thinking about adding studded 700c on another bike. Have you actually used this tire? Seems promising for everyday winter riding in the DC area. Also, it would be helpful to add tire weights to your review.

ItsJustMe

I'm on Nokian W240s. Given how long they last, it'll probably be a good 10 years before I need to buy another pair.

Kind of thinking about a fat bike. I saw Performance had one for $700.

fietsbob

My Old MTB wears the studded tires , Suomi Nokian Mount and Ground, W.

had them, bought Wholesale Direct from Finland, since 1990. same tires .. (sold the rest of the bundle)

used a studless 622-40 Nokia A10 tire on a 3/4 year long tour, they too seem very long wearing , look like new.

My LBS, just Mailed up a set of Studded Fat bike tires To a Friend of the Shop that the USCG transferred

to the Kodiak AK airbase.

Leebo

Everybody has different snow. Here in New England we gets lots of freeze/thaw and ice. I do off road year round. Fat bike are great for snow, running a Farley with a bluto up front, 4" tires, Looking at some studded versions when the snow flies. The Nokian and Schwalbe 2-2.3 tires are great for some of the conditions we get here snow, ice and thaw, repeat. Not deep snow but icy trails, and ponds and such. My full suspension 29er gets the studded tires, right next to the fat bike, just pick the right bike for the current conditions, changes every day. The commuter with a front sus fork is an older mt bike, a 26" wheeled rockhopper.Works well.

HardyWeinberg

We haven't had accumulated ice/packed snow in years and years but when we did I was surprised how well my pug's tires deformed (running at low pressure) to the variable surface and found little pieces of traction here and there, kind of like a gecko's fingertips and did really well in general. But that was completely different from say black ice which is the typical winter hazard here.

Mostly I use the pug on the beach for sand riding.

Studded fat tires must weigh like 10# each.

Tim_Iowa

@PaulRivers Very nice summary of studded options. I concur with your assessments.

To add:
Nokian W160 (aka Mount & Ground) 26 x 1.95" tires (also mentioned by @fietsbob) = 2 rows of studs, so not as aggressive as the W240 or 294; they make a good commuting tire and are a better budget alternative than the Innovas. They are sure-footed but pretty heavy and slow. The tread is decent on snow.

RE Fat bikes: I bought a fat bike (Spec Fatboy) last year to commute through the Iowa winters. Partially, at least; my commute is 8.5 miles and I rode it at least once a week last winter, sometimes more often. After the first snow, I immediately bought the studded Dillinger 5 tires. The slush melts during the day and re-freezes at night, so I vastly prefer studs to power over and through the frozen ruts on streets and bike paths.

The studs make the Dillingers much noisier than any non-studded tire on bare pavement. But, surprisingly, the Dillinger 5's (4.5", actually) were barely any slower or harder to pedal than the stock Ground Control 4.5" tires, which are known as a fast-ish tire (for a fat bike). Or, maybe my wallet was so much lighter after buying the Dillinger 5's that it counteracted the difference in effort.

Riding the fat bike definitely takes more effort than a MTB, which takes more effort than a touring bike, which takes more effort than a skinny road bike. I can rarely coast; I have to keep a good pedal effort going to maintain speed.

But, the fat bike kept me active last winter which kept me from gaining weight.

So, I'm very happy with the fat bike as a winter commuter. It also makes a great MTB; I haven't ridden my Cannondale 26er hardtail once since I bought the fattie. The extreme traction of the fat bike makes up for my pitiful skills on technical MTB trails, and the fat bike feels more "proportionate" to my 6' 225# frame.

Sixty Fiver

Regular fat tres often weigh less than a lot of knobby mtb tyres... the weight of their studded tyres is fairly comparable to other studded tyres but you give up some suppleness as they need to be a little stiffer to support studs.

Schwalbe fat bike tubes are really nice as they are fairly lightweight.

I really like my Pug for sand and riding along the river, for this and winter riding I might run 8-10 psi to give me as much float and stickiness as possible. For the street 15 psi is stiff enough for my skinny butt.

HardyWeinberg

I weighed my pugsley wheels recently: 16.5# (w/ discs, cassette, tires, surly tubes).

noglider 

I ordered Schwalbe Marathon Winter studded tires from Wiggle in England on Wednesday, and they arrived on Thursday. I didn't even know that was possible.

TenGrainBread 

Welp, well, I got it. It was pretty fun on the way home. Got a bit of time before the snow starts falling here but I'm excited.

fotooutdoors

@TenGrainBread As a Madison local, I don't think that single speed is a bad idea at all. I have only regularly ridden 5 miles each way for my winter commute, but I spent 2 winters on single speed. The reason I gave it up is that I need to tow my son (then 1 year old), which is a considerable jump in rolling resistance in the snow as compared to just my two tires.

That said, I think 95% of the time, a 29er with studded tires are the winning combo for commuting in Madison. Additionally, the times when a fat tire is useful are those where drag is high. Don't get me wrong, I picked up a fatbike this past year. I just mean to temper your hopes of what you can ride through unless you have much more beastly legs than mine.

Mr Pink57

All good stuff.

A fellow Minnesotan here who commutes all year. And has done it one a few different bikes a few different ways.

- 26in with mount and grounds; this was good and pretty easy to get around as long as there is not a ton of snow.
- 29er with fat front and studded rear tire; this did ok and was really nice when the snow got deep since the front would push the snow apart and let the rear Nokian Extreme ride in it's wake problem with this setup was ice.
- Fat bike; this was a ok option to, the snow I see on our roads is considerably different then what I see on our trails so it's not a 1:1. There is a lot more stable snow on a singletrack trail then there is on the road it all wants to brake loose. Plus was it pushed out all the ruts
- 29er with studs; this is my favorite option as of now it works for me and is most importantly predictable.

My biggest suggestion for all year commuters who are especially just starting out is yes get a studded tire for your winters the greenways here do not use salt so they just get scraped and become shear ice. But also get some pogies and leave them on all winter, I have two sets now one for the fatty and one for the commuter. I can now wear a thin 45nrth wool glove all the way down to about -35F and even then my hands just sweat if I push it too hard. And for goodness sake if you do not wear a helmet all year, wear one at least in the winter. Some many chances to randomly fall over.

wolfchild

My personal experience with Nokians 294's was that they are strictly off road tires and not commuting tires. They are very good on frozen trails with rutted ice or frozen lakes. I didn't really like them for commuting in traffic snow or in mixed conditions.

I agree. In my experience, 2 inch tires offer no advantages over 30-38mm tires for commuting on snow covered roads. In fact I have been able to ride through much deeper snow with narrower tires then with wider tires. Skinny tires cut through all the slush and traffic snow and wider tires just slide all over the place. Wider tires are better at very low pressure on frozen bumpy hardpack snow/ice.

PennyTheDog

I use two bikes with Schwalbe Marathon Winter tires for the Minnesota winter. 35 mm for a Surly Crosscheck and 2.1 inches by 26" for a mountain bike. They've worked great and been really durable.

Gresp15C

I've been similarly surprised by shipping costs and speed from England and China. I suspect both countries are heavily subsidizing their postal systems to support export business.

unterhausen

I have studded fat tires, and they are really not that bad. They weigh less than the Nates I have, which aren't studded. Of course, that comes at a price, they are well over $300 for a set. I got one studded and one unstudded and moved some studs between them to save money. So neither tire is fully populated with studs.

We have a lot of ice, and it gets rutted right away, so a fat bike is a lot more comfortable ride for much of the winter. Hopefully this winter will not be quite as bad as the last two.

HardyWeinberg

I have a sprung brooks on mine which is an amazing compliment to the tires. Also helps keep the whole bike >40#.

noglider 

@unterhausen, how far do you ride on your fat bike? I'm thinking I may need to allocate a lot of time to riding the winter bike to work.

I haven't weighed the new tires yet, but they feel extremely heavy. I know I might be very happy with them, considering they will make an impossible ride possible. I might even enjoy the sound they make.

wolfchild

There are a lot weight weenie cyclists who exaggerate the weight and rolling resistance of studded tires... Yes it's true that studded tires weigh a little more then regular tires and they are a little bit slower but it's not as bad as some people make it sound. Winter riding will always be slower and harder not just because of the tires, but because of being dressed in heavier clothing, because of the air density and poor road conditions.

noglider 

I normally ride the lightest tires I can. I don't care about flats. I'm adept at fixing them. I just want light tires. But I'm willing to try these tires. I better be willing, after all I spent on them. They are cutting edge technology, so they won't ride as badly as their shear weight implies.