satbuilder 

All,

I recently purchased a set of Scott Gabriel's flat stoppers. A set had been advertised them on the CR list, and I jumped on them.

I had been looking for a set of these for some time, for a couple of reasons.

For those of you who knew Scott, known as rootboy on this board, he was a heck of a guy. We had quite a few conversations, from vintage cycling, to fly fishing, to mechanical design and engineering/machining of parts. We shared a great many common interests. He was one very talented individual.

In September of 2019, my wife and I were headed up to Cape Cod, for a well needed vacation, away from the crazy schedule I had been working. She had grown up in central Connecticut, just outside of New Britain, and her family had taken her to the Cape quite often when she was younger. I had never seen that part of the country, and was blown away by the beauty and pristine beaches of the Cape.

Knowing Scott resided up there, I had reached out in hopes of meeting this man of many talents. Unfortunately, he was unavailable at the time, and we never had the chance to meet up.

Another missed opportunity...

I was saddened to learn of his passing in 2021. His knowledge of vintage bikes and his skills in so many areas were of great value to the board.

The flat stoppers I purchased, have been reverse engineered from Scott's patterns, and I am planning on fabricating several sets for personal use. I will also be offering these for sale, once I work out the kinks, and make sure they perform properly.

Scott made two different versions of the flat stoppers, and here's where I need your assistance. The version I have mounts to the brake caliper. He also made a version for those of you who use fenders on your bikes.

Would anyone here, have a set of those, and be willing to loan them to me, such that I can use them for patterns? I'm happy to pay postage both ways, and can also sweeten the pot by se ending along a set or two for trial, if you're interested.

Thanks for any assistance,

Kurt

unworthy1

"The version I have mounts to the brake caliper. He also made a version for those of you who use fenders on your bikes."
How do they differ?
I have a pair I bought way back when rootboy first started selling them, but not sure which version I bought (maybe he only had one style back then?

dphi 

Definitely interested in the brake mounted ones, I regret not getting some previously and had been thinking about attempting to make some myself.

streetsurfer

I dont know if photos will help. I don't see much difference but maybe the hardware, and angle of bends which are usually adjusted when installed anyway for proper alignment.

https://www.renehersecycles.com/shop...s/tire-wipers/

satbuilder 

I took a look at the ones on the Rene Herse site. It appears to me that Scott may have modified the design a bit from the ones I have.

Something else I noticed, and did read in some of the older threads the flat stoppers, is Scott changed over to stainless steel for the lower part of the wiper. He obtained some welding wire from Frank the Welder, which was ductile enough to bend without excessive springback. The ones I have are all brass, so I'm guessing an earlier version. Once I can obtain some fairly ductile stainless, I'll give that a try, although I'm not 100% sure it matters, given the wiper is not intended to ride heavily against the tire.

Here's a snapshot of the ones I purchased, on the bottom, my first cut up top, and a small mod to the upper portion to more closely match Scott's design. I had to make a new die to match.

But looking more closely at the version on the Rene Horse site, it looks like Scott elongated the upper part of the unit, where the ring is located. Why is a mystery to me, but it is entirely do-able.

Again, the more feedback I get, the better these will be for those interested in flat stoppers. I understand they're not everybody's cup of tea, but given the amount of free time I find myself with these days, it seems a worthy venture.

Kurt

The Golden Boy 

Scott was a very nice young man.

79pmooney

I find it a little amusing hearing people's names attached to those wipers. I was using those exact wipers 50 years ago. Commonly available with no labeling whatsoever as I recall. Stores that sold sewups usually had them.

I used to rebuild my wiper sections with coat hanger wire when I'd worn through the previous.

Edit: Bend the eye portion in the other direction. Bolt the glass catcher to the underside of the fender with a small (4mm or #8) screw through a hole drilled in the fender. (Making different versions? We just bent them. Easy. And absolutely no need to use high strength, hard to bend steel.)

Prowler 

For historical reference: I salvaged these off a bike that was on the way to the blast furnace. I've had them for a few years and have no use for them. One problem I encountered (given how old and stiff the rubber sleeves are) is finding some tubing that was the right balance of stiff and flexible enough and had an ID a bit less than 2mm. I have no idea what was used in days of yore. Anyway here's what the originals looked like.

Johno59

They were a feature for tub fitted bikes for the roads in the UK BITD where there is a lot of flint kicking onto paved roads. They were for smooth no tread tubs tires only and were basically useless . I used them on tubs for years and with or without they made no discernible difference to me getting punctures.
You fashioned them from brokwn spokes and wire insulation with the wires removed.

noglider 

In my world, we called them tire savers. Some people liked to call them tire shavers, but I think that was more of a joke.

ThermionicScott 

IIRC, rootboy was always up-front about his product being a reproduction of an older part. IMO, if someone goes to the effort to put something that people loved back into production, they deserve a little credit.

pastorbobnlnh 

Scott's reproduction tire savers in action. Mine are still in service with the same set of Schwalbe tubulars 8+ years later and still no flats (knocks on wood)!

noglider 

Has anyone ever tested whether these things work? I don't know what a good test would be like, since so much is random and so much else is un-measurable.

79pmooney

The fancy version. Most of mine were like the OP's, the same wire at both ends,

I'm not arguing. Credit is due. But still, i will find it amusing to see a person's name attached to a part that was "invented" by some creative rider most of a century ago as a better version of his all-coathanger predecessor. (He probably worked at a lab and when those first clear plactic tubes showed up, "ding ding!"

And do tire savers work? Set right, they knock off glass, etc. on its first rotation after pickup if it is not already embedded, like a prompt tire wipe with your hand. Whether that prevents flats depends a lot on the tire. Some are really good at embedding stuff first try, others no. Some treads are quiet and encourage the user to set the catcher close. Others are so loud that anybody with ears will set it a little higher and miss the small stuff. Luck plays a huge part. (Broken glass is like the American football when it comes to the predictable "bounce".)

Over my many years of tubular use with tiresaver used perhaps 1/3 of the time I found - I got more flats when I had fenders on and no savers. Much more in back. Fronts I could still wipe and did. My fenderless tire wiping was pretty religious and I was a militant road space occupier to minimize expensive flats. Those were the days of far less construction so many fewer nails and construction debris.

Tire savers help. More if you set them close enough to feel and hear. More if you use tires with smooth or ribbed tread. (Now that I am riding just about only Vittoria's ribbed tread Corsa Gs, maybe I should try them again.) They dirty up the brake bridges, fork crowns and calipers with more grit blow back.Also FDs and chain. Given their small expense and the high cost of tubulars, they will almost surely pay their way if you set them close enough. (If you aren't wearing out the wire arc over the tire, you aren't. It's just a pretty little showpiece.)

And a trick - bend the rear catcher brake bolt eye the other way and bolt it to the chainstay bridge through the fender bolt hole. Removed tire grit goes straight to the road surface from which it came. No fender bolthole on your chainstay bridge? Have a framebuilder correct that! Or drill the fender just above its clip for the bridge - through both fender and clip strap. Lots of ways to improvise that lower location and it is where rear tiresavers really belong. (They do get bent with wheel removal and need to be re-bent after replacement with proper C&V horizontal dropouts. But, just maybe, you need to do fewer of those removals.)

Edit: Qualifications? Probably 20,000 miles of glass catcher use. Probably most of those miles with coathanger lower portions after wearing out the nice originals. (25 years of just sewups for all my riding and the first 10 of those years carless and not living near either work or public transportation. Sewups for the 5 minute tire changes after flats in all weather, all year, much in snow country. I took getting to work on time seriously. Also I liked the 5 minute changes when it was after dark and the neighborhood seedy.)

streetsurfer

I've seen items kicked off by them...goat's heads and sand burrs largely, but once a shard of green glass got picked out of the front (without flatting), thrown free, then hit and stuck in my leg.

ramzilla

I remember having those on my Peugeot PX-10e that I bought mail order brand new (in a box) back in 1972. It was a 21 pound Reynolds 531 double butted bike frame with sew up tires. Bikes were so much more beautiful back then than they are now.

Johno59

What !You don't like Lego bikes? Nothing flicks my switch more than a 6 inch wide bottom bracket shell. I can't wait until they put internal gears down there. I'll be like riding a horse - we already have the saddle.

SJX426 

I bought several sets back in the early 70's or maybe late 60's when I rode sewups.
Still have a couple of sets and use them. Fit best on non-recessed brakes.
PXL_20221105_141121406 b on Flickr

I decided to use them on the Colnago by replacing a washer under the nut. The trick is to hammer the loop into a washer like configuration.
PA132343 on Flickr
83ColnagoSuperissiomoTireSaverc on Flickr
83ColnagoSuperissiomoTireSaverd on Flickr
83ColnagoSuperissiomoTireSavere on Flickr

Bad Lag

chain_whipped

Good guy. Enjoyed his enthusiasm for Motobecane. He made for me tire savers having a coil spring in place of the plastic tubing. Also made me a few sets of leather / stictched brake hoods to fit Campagnolo levers.

dphi 

Hey satbuilder , wondering if you've gotten anywhere with your attempts to recreate these? Still check eBay from time to time and $20/set seems to be the minimum for a crusty looking pair. And I'm guessing Rene Herse is just never going to make these again.

Bianchi84

Chicks dig scars but nobody digs a flat tire!

merziac

Aquarium tubing?

SoCaled 

- that's what i would have thought, Surgical, apparently.
https://www.bikeforums.net/19475825-post3.html

pastorbobnlnh 

Just to be clear, Rene Herse didn't make the tire savers, C&V's own rootboy, may he RIP, made them for Rene Herse to sell.