E-bikes allowed on NPS trails
#51
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This looks exactly like a dirt bike, but since it has pedals, it’s actually a bicycle. Coming to a trail near you soon.
https://lunacycle.com/sur-ron-x-bike...black-edition/
https://lunacycle.com/sur-ron-x-bike...black-edition/
#52
Senior Member
This looks exactly like a dirt bike, but since it has pedals, it’s actually a bicycle. Coming to a trail near you soon.
https://lunacycle.com/sur-ron-x-bike...black-edition/
https://lunacycle.com/sur-ron-x-bike...black-edition/
I do agree that there could be a problem with how various jurisdictions define what constitutes an ebike and with how they enforce that definition, but I doubt this particular bike is likely to meet the definition of an ebike anywhere, unless we are talking in very loose terms and referring to e-motorcycles which are an entirely different animal. It might be better if the term used were ebicycle, since there is even a big 950 + pound, 100 + hp e-harley now.
Last edited by staehpj1; 09-17-19 at 05:47 AM.
#53
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This looks exactly like a dirt bike, but since it has pedals, it’s actually a bicycle. Coming to a trail near you soon.
https://lunacycle.com/sur-ron-x-bike...black-edition/
https://lunacycle.com/sur-ron-x-bike...black-edition/
"IMPORTANT NOTE: These bikes are shipped road legal limited to 20mph and 750 watt to make them legal in most states, a 5 minute modification requiring a simple screw driver will take all limits off the bike to make it a full 5200 watts and illegal for road use in all 50 states"
#54
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"IMPORTANT NOTE: These bikes are shipped road legal limited to 20mph and 750 watt to make them legal in most states, a 5 minute modification requiring a simple screw driver will take all limits off the bike to make it a full 5200 watts and illegal for road use in all 50 states"
Also as far as I saw, there were no pedals and no claim to be an ebike so we won't see them legally on the national park trails, again unless I missed something. If there is some reference to pedals or a claim that they are ebikes using the e assisted bike definition please point out my error. I didn't read everything or follow all of the links.
#55
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#56
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Every time e-bikes gets mentioned here it turns into a bunch of weird tantrums about what constitutes bicycling, and who can say that they're "bike touring" and who cannot. I really don't care what you call whatever you're doing.
But when it comes to using the infrastructure, it's a question of doing it safely and responsibly. I see no reason label as invalid any form of transportation that can be operated in the same space with the same level of safety and responsibility. Ride an e-bike, pedals or no; roll around in a giant hamster ball; ride in a hammock suspended from drones. As long as you can do it without being a danger to other trail users or to the trail itself.
#57
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Thread Starter
I didn't read everything or follow every link, but what I saw indicated that it was an electric motorcycle. I saw no indication that it had pedals at all or was in any way claiming to be a bicycle. Did I miss something?
I do agree that there could be a problem with how various jurisdictions define what constitutes an ebike and with how they enforce that definition, but I doubt this particular bike is likely to meet the definition of an ebike anywhere, unless we are talking in very loose terms and referring to e-motorcycles which are an entirely different animal. It might be better if the term used were ebicycle, since there is even a big 950 + pound, 100 + hp e-harley now.
I do agree that there could be a problem with how various jurisdictions define what constitutes an ebike and with how they enforce that definition, but I doubt this particular bike is likely to meet the definition of an ebike anywhere, unless we are talking in very loose terms and referring to e-motorcycles which are an entirely different animal. It might be better if the term used were ebicycle, since there is even a big 950 + pound, 100 + hp e-harley now.
#59
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I love this bike, now that it’s modified. I bought it so I could ride it around my property quietly and it’s perfect for that. My suggestions are that Sur Ron should offer a rear foot brake pedal kit for all the dirt bike guys, a new spot for the horn button, and a way for this bike to sit on a dirt bike stand for easier maintenance. The mods I made were cutting the green wire for faster top speed, ... ... ...
Yup.
And that one photo on their website that shows it has a bicycle license is a bit appalling, most jurisdictions allow you to apply for a bike license on-line so of course they chose to license it that way so that they could claim it was "officially" a bicycle. I could license my truck as a bicycle that way in my community for the cost of $10, but of course nobody would accept the claim that my truck is a bicycle because everybody knows what a truck is.
As I said above in a previous post, I am not opposed to e-bikes on roads, but I am opposed to them being used on trails that were designed for non-motorized travel.
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#60
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FWIW, a lot of the folks feel the same way about MTBs or even bikes in general in the national parks. When you start restricting you just might find bikes kicked out altogether. It isn't impossible.
#61
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I draw the line in a bit different place. I am okay with what I consider genuine power assisted bicycles on MUPs and other developed paths. I am still trying to get my head around what I think about them on actual trails that allow mountain biking. It gets to be more of a slippery slope there. I definitely don't think electric motocross bikes pretending to be bicycles belong in national parks.
FWIW, a lot of the folks feel the same way about MTBs or even bikes in general in the national parks. When you start restricting you just might find bikes kicked out altogether. It isn't impossible.
FWIW, a lot of the folks feel the same way about MTBs or even bikes in general in the national parks. When you start restricting you just might find bikes kicked out altogether. It isn't impossible.
I wouldn't mind E-bikes on MUPs or Rail-Trails if the E-bike rider would use some sense and ride in a manner that doesn't endanger others. I've seen and experience far too many instances of E-bike rider riding as fast as their E-bike could go and with absolutely no regard for anyone else who might be on the trail or path. Zooming along at high speed whilst approaching a blind curve/corner where someone including children or people with children might be approaching from the opposite direction is not a considerate thing to do on a bicycle or on an E-bike let alone an electric scooter/motorbike.
Cheers
#62
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Adjusted...
I replace 1 word and your paragraph applies perfectly to what I see most times I am on a busy interurban paved path near me.
Its not the arrow- it's the cyclist.
I wouldn't mind road bikes on MUPs or Rail-Trails if the road bike rider would use some sense and ride in a manner that doesn't endanger others. I've seen and experience far too many instances of road bime rider riding as fast as their road bike could go and with absolutely no regard for anyone else who might be on the trail or path. Zooming along at high speed whilst approaching a blind curve/corner where someone including children or people with children might be approaching from the opposite direction is not a considerate thing to do on a road bike.
Its not the arrow- it's the cyclist.
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#63
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Yeah. Happens on a very popular trail in Philly that goes out into the 'burbs. It's basically the I-95 of bike trails in the area. I am a courteous cyclist so that sort of behavior drives me nuts. We even get a good number of people using aero bars that appear to be training for tris. They don't stop for anyone. Ride like that at 6 a.m., when the trail pretty empty, not on a Saturday afternoon when it's crowded.
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I've just toured in Germany. They sold 1.2 million E bikes last year. That said (and yes they were everywhere) I'm surprised to see in the original post that E bikes were previously banned ?
Why would local authority or country be so short sighted as to ban an E bike.....they are restricted to 15 mph as a rule yet open up a massive leisure activity for people who couldn't ordinarily cycle for whatever reason.
Why would local authority or country be so short sighted as to ban an E bike.....they are restricted to 15 mph as a rule yet open up a massive leisure activity for people who couldn't ordinarily cycle for whatever reason.
#68
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There's no maybe this or maybe that, rules,... It's you MUST pedal or you are not riding a bicycle... How much simpler can you get...???
Last edited by 350htrr; 09-19-19 at 09:12 PM. Reason: add stuff
#69
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On trails, the ban is for safety. The trails were designed for low speed muscle powered bicyclists or pedestrians and the trails are quite narrow, narrower than a single traffic lane on a street.
I do not think any e-bikes sold in my state are restricted to 15 mph, I think that they are all restricted at 20 or 30 mph. But as mentioned above, many such bikes have the restricting device disabled so they can go as fast as the 750 watt motor can take them.
The state considered a rule that allowed e-bikes on the bike trails as long as they never went over 15 mph. The lobbyists for the manufacturers and retailers pushed hard for this rule, but since few if any of the e-bikes that were sold here were fitted with a speedometer, nobody would know if they are going slow enough or not. I think that is one reason that the state did not allow them.
Some of the bike trails here are not rail to trail type trails, thus they do not always go in straight lines, some trails here are through forests and have curves where you can't see more than 20 to 30 feet ahead at times.
#70
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From an article on BC ebike regs:
Because of the lack of available data or evidence, the ministry has decided to develop a policy to regulate e-bikes, which it said is more flexible and easier to amend in the future than legislation.
He said the speed allows riders to complete more laps of a trail in a shorter amount of time, and could mean increased wear on trails.
Those opposed to allowing e-mountain bikes on trails worry that the relative speed of the bikes compared to other users, such as hikers, could result in conflict on narrow, single-track trails.
Because e-bikes allow riders to travel farther, faster and with less effort, some organizations are raising red flags about ease of access to the backcountry for those who are unprepared for wilderness conditions.
Whistler's Off Road Cycling Association (WORCA) has taken a public stance against e-bikes on the trails it manages, pointing to the increase in wear and tear on the trails.
"The issue is, really, who's supplying the money to do the maintenance? And at the end of the day there isn't really any provincial money," said WORCA president Craig Mackenzie.
He said the speed allows riders to complete more laps of a trail in a shorter amount of time, and could mean increased wear on trails.
Those opposed to allowing e-mountain bikes on trails worry that the relative speed of the bikes compared to other users, such as hikers, could result in conflict on narrow, single-track trails.
Because e-bikes allow riders to travel farther, faster and with less effort, some organizations are raising red flags about ease of access to the backcountry for those who are unprepared for wilderness conditions.
Whistler's Off Road Cycling Association (WORCA) has taken a public stance against e-bikes on the trails it manages, pointing to the increase in wear and tear on the trails.
"The issue is, really, who's supplying the money to do the maintenance? And at the end of the day there isn't really any provincial money," said WORCA president Craig Mackenzie.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/regulation-for-Regulation for electric bikes may forever change B.C. mountain trails
Then there is this...
Getting Away with Riding an Illegal ebike: 10 tips
https://www.electricbike.com/illegal-ebike-riding/
#71
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https://nyc.streetsblog.org/2019/06/...an-exemptions/