squirtdad

so the new tech is the dockless renting of scooters, electric, bikes and bikes.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...es-uber-d-j-vu

https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/04/...spoiled-brats/

I am seeing the Lime bikes (especially the electric ones) dropped of in lots of out of the way locations.

but I am thinking that as usage grows, especially with electric scooters and bikes there is going be more contention between those riders and cyclists in the various bike oriented infrastructure.

Hasn't happened to me yet (other than the idiot on a fat tire ebike modded to do about 25mph weaving in an out of walkers) am wondering if anyone has had any contention yet

johnny99

I already see the electric scooters clogging narrow bike lanes and I hear lots of complaints from pedestrians about them riding too fast on sidewalks. Hopefully cities will realize that they need to expand their infrastructure to keep up with demand.

natnatroswell22

same thoughts. Cities with much higher demands on e-bikes should build new faciltiies/rules and separate lanes for them.

Maelochs

Why can't e-bikes share bike lanes? Far from "clogging narrow bike lanes" I'd think they would likely find pedaling cyclists in their way ....

And if we don't want e-bikes in the bike lanes ... I guess we don't want more people riding at all. After all .... if a lot more people rode a lot more, chances are most of them wouldn't be out for serious exercise, (we already got those) but would be more casual riders trying out cycling for pleasure and maybe running errands---who, even if they stuck with it, wouldn't be laying down the pavement-melting watts.

So ... is it that some people who pedal hate e-bikes, or that we really wish that only we and our close friends cycled, and all hat infrastructure was only there for us, and no one else could use it? Maybe we are spoiled because as cyclists, we don't usually have traffic in the bike lanes?

If e-bikes are doing 25 on crowded sidewalks, they certainly won't be holding me up if they use the bike lanes.

bikecrate

I haven't seen too many ebikes here yet. Perhaps in flat FL the demand isn't as big. The only negative encounter I had was someone riding on the sidewalk shot out into the street I was crossing with the light. That could happen with any cyclist or pedestrian though.

Daniel4

Doesn't it all boil down to the same issue: respect and consideration of others?

If it weren't for motorists behaviours and attitudes, we wouldn't need bike lanes.

If it weren't for cyclists behaviours on sidewalks, we wouldn't need traffic laws to get bicycles off the sidewalks.

If it weren't for smokers'inconsiderate attitudes towards non-smokers requests, we wouldn't need smoking-designated areas.

And now it's e-bikes. People don't change.

Maelochs

I say, bring on the flying cars.

Lower the population and weed out the bad rivers.

Leebo

Not allowed on some MUPs in the Boston area.

tyrion

The backlash here in San Diego seems more from regular people than bicyclists. The e-machines generally go faster than bikes and scare pedestrians (a convoy of teenagers zipping along at 15 MPH on walkways can be intimidating), plus the machines get left in places obstructing walkways, driveways, etc.

Legislation is coming.

welshTerrier2

I attended a webinar last night hosted by the League of American Bicyclists (LAB). The league and those who participated in the discussion were highly supportive of e-bikes in general.

There is no question e-bikes present challenges and that we need to develop good regulations to ensure that e-bike riders act in a responsible manner. There are already federal regulations that define what kinds of features e-bikes can and can’t have. There are also insurance regulations that more or less parallel the federal laws.

Generally speaking, the rules seem to require operable pedals and top speeds of not more than 20 mph with a 170-pound (or under) rider. The top speed is not limited if a rider can pedal faster than that with power assistance from the battery. Also, e-bikes also must have either two or three wheels but not four.

My bike club allows e-bikes on our rides but our general courtesy guidelines (i.e. don’t be a jerk) apply to e-bikes and non-e-bikes in just the same way.

Overall, the goal should be more bikes on the road whether they are e-bikes or not. E-bikes can provide a real service. One example was given of a husband who can ride 50 miles but his wife couldn’t go with him because of the pace or the distance. Closer to home, my club has many riders in their late-70’s and early 80’s. Some these folks can no longer keep up with the club or cover the distances we ride. We’re thrilled some of them have recently purchased e-bikes … problem solved.

There’s no reason not to give everyone a chance to enjoy our sport as long as problems that arise from the new technology can be reasonably addressed.

johnny99

The word "scooter" is confusing since it can mean a lot of different things. The type that has been in the news this month are the type you stand on with no pedals and are powered by an electric motor. Here in California, electric scooters are allowed in bike lanes and bike paths, but not sidewalks. The laws for using them are somewhat different than for bicycles. Scooter companies seem to be doing a poor job about educating the riders about how to use them legally and politely.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...stupid-humans/

Hoopdriver

I'm thinking that there is a place for e-bikes in the future. As batteries become lighter and more reliable, and as traffic and parking becomes more challenging, more will opt for an e-bike. The issue of prudent and courteous use will have to be worked out though. Even though I think that most riders will have a clue, and I hate the idea of special regulation because this will trickle down to regular bikes, there will be some incident that will result in some knee-jerk response that will be bad for all of us.

Daniel4

I'm guessing that traffic laws were written because of the automobile taking over the streets in the 1910s. (I'd like someone to produce some historical records supporting or refuting my claim, for educational purposes.)

I can't imagine that pedestrian fatalities were much of a problem in the days of the horse and buggy or even when bicycles were popular before cars came along. (The only record I have is a chart of pedestrian fatalities in an article about Toronto's King Street.)

So I think ebikes are a current or future problem not because they behave anything out of the ordinary to motorists but because non-cars are all squeezed into limited spaces left behind by cars-and a lot of people would just want to avoid cars because they're so dangerous.

Maelochs

Part of the problem might be non-cyclists riding ebikes on sidewalks---not confident or skilled enough to handle the streets, but way too fast for sidewalks. They need to do what the rest of us did (or should have done): learnt eh laws, practice, learn some safety techniques, and ride where they belong.

B. Carfree

I really look forward to the conflict that e-bikes will create with our current crop of idiot traffic planners. They are designing everything as though people on bikes travel at 8 mph and will always be few in number. As e-bikes allow our huge sedentary population to get in the saddle (I saw a guy with an oxygen tube rolling along on an e-bike recently), both the typical speeds and the number of cyclists will quickly make all our cycling infrastructure worse than obsolete.

Perhaps not surprisingly, it's the same collection of people who have been cheering on the move towards lousy separated facilities who are now loudly decrying the use of e-bikes.

KraneXL

E-bike may help lower societies carbon footprint but they are not the solution to physical fitness and better health. In fact, they only exacerbate the problem. The sidewalk issue is easy: SIDEWALKS ARE FOR PEDESTRIAN. If it has a motor, it should not be on the sidewalk.

squirtdad

I am of mixed feelings about e-bikes....I think pedal assist with boots limits is a probably a good thing, but then you are going to get those things that a bikes in name only, that don't require any pedaling and my guess is that is going to cause more consternation

personally I think electric scooters are going to be more problematic.......

350htrr

Ding, Ding, Ding... and... There's the "problem". As far as I am concerned, for the rules here in N. America are WAY...too loose/weak, because, as soon as there is a throttle, you are riding a moped. IMO. as soon as the "assist" is more than 350 watts and you do not need to pedal, You are riding a moped... IMO, having ridden, and actually owning an E-Bike/, make that an E-Assist bike ACTUALLY, for the last 5+ years and knowing just how much of an assist they "can" be, even at "only" 350 watts. At 750 watts an E-Bike with a throttle is not a bicycle, is not an assisted bicycle, it's a moped, which mine IS NOT, My BionX system is a MUST be pedalled to get anywhere system, that "Assists" with some added E-power for one to make it up a hill without thinking one is going to die...

Daniel4

I'm going to commit the sin of painting electric-scooterists and e-bikers with a wide brush as I offer this explanantion.

They are all motorists and drivers. They don't have the courage or confident to ride bicycles on the road. They state that riding bicycles are too dangerous.They are the same motorists who yell at cyclists to get off the road. Hence, they ride on the sidewalk.

Daniel4

I don't think health is the reason they ride e-bikes. No amount of lecturing is going to change a smoker's mind about the dangers of smoking.

Fixed it. You left out the word "not".

noisebeam

I see a need for improving MUP design to include banked turns.

Oneder

I'm holding off on getting an ebike til they offer a 200 lb ebike with a cowcatcher on the front, which would be just perfect for all the people acting like idiots on the sidewalks and bike lanes around here.

KraneXL

Bike lanes maybe? Sidewalks, on the other hand, are for pedestrians, so they always have the right-of-way there.

Robert C

As you know, my first exposure to mass e-bike use was outside of the US. In comparison the US has extremely restrictive laws that have hindered the acceptance of e-bikes.

This is the same old conversation that fills this forum whenever e-bikes are mentioned, "e-bikes good/bad?"

Leebo

You mean bikepaths or MUP's?