Corrado912

I recently purchased a 2009 Scott CR1 Team bike, size XXL (61cm). I swapped out the 130mm stem for a 110mm 6 degree rise stem at my LBS, but feel like I'm reaching just a little bit longer than I'd like to when in the hoods (drops feel great) on longer rides (I have very long legs and a short torso).

Questions for your feedback and experiences:

-- What is the minimum length stem you recommend for a 61cm road bike and why?
-- Would a 90 or 100mm stem with a 10 or 20 degree rise be OK to use with my 61cm carbon frame (2009 Scott CR1 Team)?
-- Anyone use shorter stems or larger angled (10 or 20 degree rise) stems on larger frames? Any thoughts or differences in fit/feel that you notice?

Thanks in advance for your help.

umd

You get a stem that puts the bars in the proper location. All your other questions are not relevant. The size of the frame doesn't matter.

This chart should help you figure out how lengths and angles relate.

Corrado912

Awesome, thank you UMD. Appreciate the quick response.

Longfemur

There's no definitive answer to your question, because you can play with both height and reach, and then there's also the design of the bars themselves (reach from stem, how deep or shallow the drops are, how high or low on the curve the hoods are). All will have an effect on how you feel at the various hand positions. For example, you can get shorter reach to the hoods by bringing the bars closer but using deeper drops, and vice-versa. Strictly-speaking, you should feel like you have to stretch out a little when riding on the hoods, otherwise, it may be too short a reach. Don't make your hood position be what the ramps should be.

But as you try to achieve this, it's probably best to arrive at a fit that won't require too much of an extremely short or long stem. That's when frame size comes into the picture. If you need, say, a 60 cm stem, your frame may be too long for you.

I used to say bike fits weren't worthwhile, but on the other hand, they can help solve a lot of confusion in cases like this. Without it, you could be experimenting all summer and never find a good fit.

umd

I will add that if are too stretched out and need to get a short stem with a lot of rise, you may have a bike that is too big, regardless of the actual size of the frame. Did the shop fit you? How did you determine that was the appropriate frame size?

Corrado912

The shop fit me and that's what led to swapping out the 130mm for the 110mm. I was much more comfortable with the 110mm at that point, but after riding some more I feel like it could be brought in slightly. Their (LBS) take was that I'd need to play around with things to dial in the fit as I spent more time on the bike. I agree, but just want some opinions on how short / steep I could go.

I went with that size after testing a lot of smaller frames (58-60), which typically led to a huge drop to the handlebars given the amount of seatpost I use to get the right fit in my legs.

At this point I'll probably play around with the hood placement and handlebar position, and if I need to maybe switch to a 100mm or 10 degree rise? The important thing is to probably change only one thing at a time so I can identify what works and what doesn't?

umd

Some stems are somewhat adjustable. The Specialized Pro-set stems have a sleeve that can rotate around so that you can change the angle. I would stay away from the ones that have a bolt to adjust though.

Corrado912

Thanks for the suggestion. The one I have on there now is a Ritchey WCS (not sure of the numbers/letters after it), which I don't think is adjustable. I'll keep my eyes out for deals. Agreed on the bolt adjust -- heavy and ugly!

noise boy

I am in the same boat as you, I am 6' 4" with a 38" cycling inseam. I have a 63cm CAAD9 with a 90mm 6 degree rise stem. It isn't weird at all, that is why they make them that size. Also I went through the same thing when I bought the bike, it came with a 120mm stem which was too long, I swapped for a 100mm initially, then after a couple of weeks went back and got the 90mm put on. Also I have found that the position of the hoods on the bars is a big deal too, I made a couple of very small (in distance) changes in where the hoods were on the bars that had a big effect on fit and comfort.

DaveSSS 

If you're already using a +6 stem angle, then a smaller frame that would have a shorter head tube is not a solution. A different model with a taller head tube, but not a longer reach might be an option.

A +10 stem would raise the bars about 7mm. Keep in mind that flipped up stems are horizontally shorter, so your current stem is only about 101mm in horizontal length. A +10 would be 98mm in horizontal length.

I always recommend short reach bars for the short-torsoed rider. If you make the stem much shorter, you may hit the bars with your knees while pedaling out of the saddle (but maybe not if the bars are real high).

Give yourself some time to get used to the road bike position, if you're new to road bike riding. It's common for people to adapt to a longer and lower position fairly quickly.

RiPHRaPH

I also have a Scott CR-1, but in a 59cm.
I really disliked the stock handlebars.
I installed new K-Force bars and left the 110cm stock stem.
All issues with reach and comfort were resolved.

ImaPoser

The chart may be a great tool, but who makes stems out of the typical sizes? My bike came with a 6 degree 110mm stem, which I felt was too low and long, so I swapped to a 100mm 17 degree stem. It's too high. Who makes a 10-12 degree stem?

schnee

One fit possibility: when your saddle is too far forward, that puts your weight up front, more weight on your hands, and as a result sometimes people try to use a shorter stem and flip it up steeply. If your saddle is further back, then - to a point - it gives you better balance and weight distribution and you naturally lower the stem. I did that myself, over time, on a bike that I bought when I was new to riding. Even though my knees were over the pedals with my fit, my hips were in the wrong place. It turns out once I got in better shape, I moved the saddle back and the stem lowered significantly.

I also had another bike with a 61cm road frame with a 2cm too-long top tube (for me), and I was not in shape, so I sat relatively upright too. I ran a 100mm stem, 15 degrees up. Since I ride such wide handlebars (46cm), it felt twitchy but I got used to it in an hour. When I got in better shape, I lowered the angle and pushed the saddle back, but the stem was still 100mm.

--

I hate to recommend replacing the frame, but maybe look into the Specialized Roubaix, Giant Defy, Gunnar Sport, or the equivalent. They have shorter top tubes and taller head tubes than typical road racers. For a normal casual rider, that puts them more upright, but in your case it might just allow you to buy a smaller size frame, put on a 120mm stem with a shallower angle and have a normal fit.

OR, if you don't mind steel, you're a perfect candidate for custom. They're not that expensive, try a Gunnar with made-to-order geometry. $1250 or so for the frameset.

Another issue might be the bars and brifters. I never liked Shimano Ultegra 6600. They were too long and felt uncomfortable. They were 1.5cm longer in reach than earlier Shimano 105 and current SRAM for example. When I swapped out the brifters, I wasn't so stretched out and felt better.

Corrado912

Thanks for the feedback, schnee. I tested the Roubaix and Defy Advanced before I got the CR1. Definitely more upright in the hoods (Roubaix 61cm frame is shorter in the TT by .5cm and longer in the HT by 2.5cm), but in the drops I felt awkward and scrunched. I guess I could probably have made some adjustments to help that, just as I am going shorter with the CR1, but I felt like with my arms closer and more bent, I tended to put too much weight forward (that's what you mean above?).

One LBS had similar thoughts about getting use to the road bike position and gaining flexibility. They said once I do, I'll probably prefer a lowered position vs. more upright. Their thought was that it's easier to make a more aggressive bike relaxed than a more relaxed bike aggressive -- you agree? Anyone have experience with that? I'm new to road biking (only mountain biked before this), so maybe it's just a matter of strengthening my core/back and focusing on staying light in my hands? And from what everyone has said so far, if I need to do it after getting used to the bike, it doesn't seem to be an issue if I shorten the stem to 90 or 100mm (even though stock was 130mm - super long).

Last night I rotated up the handlebars just a tad and it seemed to help, with no change in comfort in the drops. While in the hoods looking down, the front hub is a litlte behind my line of sight to the handlebars, but I can maintain a slight bend in my arms and my back/neck are comfortable. How much stock do you all put in the "rule of thumb" that the handlebars should block your line of sight to the front hub? Off topic, but guess it's related to stem length. Thanks again.

sixate

Are you serious? There's a lot of 10 degree stems on the market.

https://www.google.com/products?hl=en...d&sa=N&start=0