waingroo

Hello,

I have a chance to buy a cheap, almost new, geared motor hub 250W 36V.... The problem is that it come without any controller, just the motor itself.
The question is, if it can be plugged direct to a power source (36V battery) without any controller, just a switch button (on/off)?

The Hub have an 9 pin plug (6 thinner and 3 thicker pins).

Thanks

CigTech

yes you could, but you would not be able to control the speed. it will be on or off. 0 mph or full speed. Also when you hit the breaks you'll have to cut the motor off. The control does that for you. hope this helps

waingroo

Thank You for the answer. Actually, this is what i really want.... to be as simple possible and just to help me on some small hills. I'll try to handle the rest of things that a controller is made for.

Perhaps the 3 thicker pins should be needed to supply with power. One should be "-", another "+", but the third can be another "+"?

chas58

You think it would work without any phase wires? I'm no expert on this, but if it is a 9 pin plug, I'm thinking the phasing of the power to the hub is important. If I wire my 9 pin out of phase, it goes backwards, slowly, or not at all...

On the other hand, a 250watt motor is basically an on/off motor. its not that powerful and typically an all or nothing thing.

chas58

What is cheap? Got a picture of it? A motor is $79, and a controller is $15 from china. Of course shipping is going to double the price if you have to ship them by themselves.

waingroo

I'll get it for about 28$, is a SH down from an german bike. I think is made in Taiwan

chas58

A basic controller is like $15. Maybe $30 with shipping. I got a spare from greenbikekit. Plan on getting one of those.
Not knowing the speed (RPM) of a motor, makes it quite a gamble in my mind. Say the motor pulls at 10mph max. Is that what you want? I’m going to take a wild guess that the motor pictured pulls at 10-15mph tops.

waingroo

Sorry for later reply... The project was abandoned because I had some kind of doubts about the seller.

All I actually want, is just a motor enough to help me running uphill when I come back home from city center.

15rms

Hill Topper Electric Bike Kit, Electric Bike Batteries: Electric-Bike-Kit.com

Seems like this is exactly what you are asking for.

chas58

My thoughts exactly. Keep in mind that realistically it is going to cost about $1000, most of that is in the battery. The cheapest it would cost is maybe $500 if your have DIY skills.

waingroo

Thank you for the link . I decided to buy an Heinzmann Hub 250w witch is considered one with the best torque. Also reliable german hub but a bit noisy than others.

chvid

Take all internet advice with a grain of salt.

Your motor is most likely a three phase brushless hub motor, with either Hall sensors or no Hall sensors. Either way, it cannot be run without a controller with just DC in, black and red.

If it is a brushed motor (two wires going into the motor), you could run it directly off the pack with just an "all on, all off" switch. Not recommended.

A Heinzmann is the latter type. I also have a similar brushed geared motor among my collection, and it is torquey and can run on very cheap <edited: BRUSHED> controllers, or pure DC in.

waingroo

Thanks for the advices Chvid. True, just on and off, probably will just make the bike twitch, but also i disagree the normal type of accelerator (revo). Rather something like a push button will be more on my liking.

I think the heinzmann is the best for what I want, I know is a bit out of fashion, heavy and noisy, But instead it has a great torque, from what I know it has metal gears. I would like it to have epicyclic train like brushless ones, but someone told me that it has actually a single gear on the main axle and a crown gear. Epicyclic give me a bit more trust in reliable..... mostly, if there are metal gears.

Brushless, look smaller, but In my view, without being an electronist, the hall sensors just give a kind of virtually data transfer between controller and hub, witch can result in power loosing or failures. Of course with the advantage of being silent and most of them with planetary system.

Do you know any photos with an opened (gears syde) Heinzmann ?

chvid

The Halls are low power sensors in brushless motors, either geared or ungeared, which tell the controller what rotational state the motor is in, so the phases can fire correctly to get the motor going.

I think the Heinzmanns are very good, and torquey, but will eventually need to be opened up to replace the brushes after they wear out. My brushed geared has three white plastic gears in it. I believe that the model of that motor is "P2A" which can't be easily found anywhere these days - good motors until they overheat - brushed motors often have heat issues. Otherwise don't know much about the Heinzmann, other than that the integrated torque arm is a nice feature. Haven't seen any pictures of the Heinzmann opened up.

I'd go brushless - the controllers are cheap, and there are a lot of different motor options. You can run many of the brushless motors with a sensorless controller, which is more reliable but not quite as smooth, and won't start immediate. My sensorless controllers I use from bmsbattery.com will start a brushless direct drive motor from very close to zero km per hour speed.

Good luck, Chris