Why are Modern Bikes So Expensive?
#276
Nope - weight trumps everything. When riding in a pack, the weight penalty of a heavy bike, and especially heavy wheels will shed you off the back. Then you can be aero as a bullet, but you are not going to be able to reconnect.
When you are sheltered in the pack, your super aero bike might save you a handful of watts, but then you're coasting along at 25 mph expending what? 100 watts total? Joking with your pals about the movie you saw last night and eating a energy bar...
When you are sheltered in the pack, your super aero bike might save you a handful of watts, but then you're coasting along at 25 mph expending what? 100 watts total? Joking with your pals about the movie you saw last night and eating a energy bar...
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#277
I actually rode in 2 closed-road UCI events last year where the UCI weight limit would have applied, had I been competitive 😂
#278
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Nope - weight trumps everything. When riding in a pack, the weight penalty of a heavy bike, and especially heavy wheels will shed you off the back. Then you can be aero as a bullet, but you are not going to be able to reconnect.
When you are sheltered in the pack, your super aero bike might save you a handful of watts, but then you're coasting along at 25 mph expending what? 100 watts total? Joking with your pals about the movie you saw last night and eating a energy bar...
When you are sheltered in the pack, your super aero bike might save you a handful of watts, but then you're coasting along at 25 mph expending what? 100 watts total? Joking with your pals about the movie you saw last night and eating a energy bar...
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#279
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Nope - weight trumps everything. When riding in a pack, the weight penalty of a heavy bike, and especially heavy wheels will shed you off the back. Then you can be aero as a bullet, but you are not going to be able to reconnect.
When you are sheltered in the pack, your super aero bike might save you a handful of watts, but then you're coasting along at 25 mph expending what? 100 watts total? Joking with your pals about the movie you saw last night and eating a energy bar...
When you are sheltered in the pack, your super aero bike might save you a handful of watts, but then you're coasting along at 25 mph expending what? 100 watts total? Joking with your pals about the movie you saw last night and eating a energy bar...
Sure aero might not matter all that much in the odd occasion of travelling in a dense pack because of pack dynamics and the tendency to bring the air along too so the net effect is all person's present are drafting eachother to the benefit of all. But, what about all the time a rider spends riding solo? It doesn't matter there either? You have a history of making it sound that way.
There are other aspects of pack dynamics, too. Like the tendency for the socially burdensome to get dropped for reasons not related to rim weight. What is your time riding solo v/s dense pack riding ratio?
You are seriously telling me (and the world) that drag coefficients just don't matter? That's amazing because because it literally means airplanes, bicycles, rocket ships, bullet trains, and cars could be shaped like barn doors, and it just wouldn't matter. Judging by the effort of the worlds engineers, clearly they feel something there matters to the operation of their vehicle. If not the minimization of drag coefficients, then what? Is that something style? Artistic expression? Shameful attempts to drive up cost?
Please explain your assertion.
Last edited by base2; 03-23-24 at 08:00 AM.
#281
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#282
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1997, I bought my Ritchey for $2000, marked down from $3000 because it had 8 speed Dura Ace as 9 speed was coming out.
2007, I bought a 2006 Bianchi 928 Veloce for $1600, marked down from $2700 because it was last year's model.
2020, I bought a 2020 Canyon Endurace for $2400, no markdown at all.
So, the CF bike with the discs was actually the lowest MSRP of all, even after 23 years.
2007, I bought a 2006 Bianchi 928 Veloce for $1600, marked down from $2700 because it was last year's model.
2020, I bought a 2020 Canyon Endurace for $2400, no markdown at all.
So, the CF bike with the discs was actually the lowest MSRP of all, even after 23 years.
But let's look at the Ritchey for a moment. The Road Logic frame has changed very little over time (so getting closer to an apples to apples comparison) and claims a price of 1600-2300 depending on features. The current Dura Ace gruppo lists for over 3600. With modest parts to complete that bike, you would be around 6k for a complete bike. Googling inflation from 1997 to 2024, the adjusted prices of the two bikes are almost equal, suggesting that the cost of this bike has neither gone up nor down, at least not by much.
Still, that does fit your claim of "something better for the same money", so I see your point.
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#283
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Sorry, but that's as much apples to oranges as any.
But let's look at the Ritchey for a moment. The Road Logic frame has changed very little over time (so getting closer to an apples to apples comparison) and claims a price of 1600-2300 depending on features. The current Dura Ace gruppo lists for over 3600. With modest parts to complete that bike, you would be around 6k for a complete bike. Googling inflation from 1997 to 2024, the adjusted prices of the two bikes are almost equal, suggesting that the cost of this bike has neither gone up nor down, at least not by much.
Still, that does fit your claim of "something better for the same money", so I see your point.
But let's look at the Ritchey for a moment. The Road Logic frame has changed very little over time (so getting closer to an apples to apples comparison) and claims a price of 1600-2300 depending on features. The current Dura Ace gruppo lists for over 3600. With modest parts to complete that bike, you would be around 6k for a complete bike. Googling inflation from 1997 to 2024, the adjusted prices of the two bikes are almost equal, suggesting that the cost of this bike has neither gone up nor down, at least not by much.
Still, that does fit your claim of "something better for the same money", so I see your point.
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#285
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...sell a man a fish at $6 per pound, he eats for only a day. Teach a man to fish, and he has an excuse to buy $100,000 bass boat, and equip it with a $15,000 Mercury 300 outboard.
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#287
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Nope - weight trumps everything. When riding in a pack, the weight penalty of a heavy bike, and especially heavy wheels will shed you off the back. Then you can be aero as a bullet, but you are not going to be able to reconnect.
When you are sheltered in the pack, your super aero bike might save you a handful of watts, but then you're coasting along at 25 mph expending what? 100 watts total? Joking with your pals about the movie you saw last night and eating a energy bar...
When you are sheltered in the pack, your super aero bike might save you a handful of watts, but then you're coasting along at 25 mph expending what? 100 watts total? Joking with your pals about the movie you saw last night and eating a energy bar...
EDIT:
https://youtu.be/0QDnUkUaQfk?si=-CAJ9mFux6jzPFlx
Last edited by Eric F; 03-24-24 at 05:25 PM.
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#289
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Fishing is like biking in terms of overspending and overdesign of equipment - and the justifications for buying the equipment are similar.
Yeti makes a 5 gallon bucket and it used to sell it for around $80. They invented a reason you need it - pre ice the fish before putting them into the cooler - coolers they sell for 5-8x that of a regular cooler. Pre icing the fish in the bucket makes the ice in the cooler last longer - but they claim the ice in the cooler will last 5+ days.
Basic filet knife. I worked on a fishing boat for about 5 years, filleted 10's of 1000's of fish - with a $15 knife. But the fishing community has you paying $2-300+ for a knife - because the advertisement and internet says its better.
Rods are x% more sensitive, lures catch x% more fish, reels make x% more drag or hold a little more line.
But, people buy the stuff, and that's all that matters.
Some people buy the stuff because they think they need it - some buy it because they simply want it.
Same with bikes.
#290
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Edit: I found their website.
https://hcbyachts.com/
Last edited by seypat; 03-25-24 at 05:57 AM.
#291
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Or something like this. I pass monsters like this one on Rt. 95 heading south in the fall and north in the spring. I passed one with 5 225s on back a few years ago. Looked it up and it was over a million dollar boat/ship at the time. This one had 5 450Rs on back. It made me think of a Lefty Frizzell song.
Edit: I found their website.
https://hcbyachts.com/
Edit: I found their website.
https://hcbyachts.com/
If you want to see something that makes that HBC look like a toy - check out Freeman boatworks. Insane. People pay for a place in line just to get one built, then they sell their build slots for more money as the date gets closer.
Toy's outpacing inflation is a thing.
My boat sold for 32k new in 2008. Inflation would have the same boat at 45-48k new now, but they list for 90k+.
I paid 17k for the boat, it was 2 years old and was barely used, about 50% off. Nowadays, you may pay more for a used boat than a new one because of the wait times for a new boat...
My boat is tired and needs to be replaced. Prices are high, even for old boats, so I thought about selling. But selling would be final for me - I would be out of boating forever as I'm completely priced out of the recreational small boat market.
Unless I was willing to do 20 year financing that is... and that is what's supporting the boat market.
I have to wonder how many people are financing bikes and for how long.
#292
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The next question we need to spend a dozen pages discussing: "Why Are Expensive Bikes So Modern?"
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#293
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Platypus gravelus.
Platypus gravelus.
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#294
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This one isn't as old, but certainly ain't modern...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/27629798124...mis&media=COPY
https://www.ebay.com/itm/27629798124...mis&media=COPY
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#296
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Not all modern bikes are expensive. Only the few that I like are exorbitantly priced 😂.
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#297
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This one isn't as old, but certainly ain't modern...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/27629798124...mis&media=COPY
https://www.ebay.com/itm/27629798124...mis&media=COPY
EDIT: The Eroica folks would disagree with out about the "certainly ain't modern" part.
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#298
With a mighty wind
My vintage Spectrum was $2400 in 1984. The original owner had about $300 of additional accessories with it. I know this because he kept the receipts.
So that $2700 in 1984 is about $7800 today.
Performance doesn’t count because of technical advancement but “tier” wise, it’s damn close to what you could get with $7800 today.
So that $2700 in 1984 is about $7800 today.
Performance doesn’t count because of technical advancement but “tier” wise, it’s damn close to what you could get with $7800 today.
#299
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This one isn't as old, but certainly ain't modern...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/27629798124...mis&media=COPY
https://www.ebay.com/itm/27629798124...mis&media=COPY
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#300
Steel is real
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Anything that is nuovo record and new old stock or showroom condition regarding vintage colnago always has a significant pricetag. The price of the nuovo record spare parts alone is close to 4000$ but this type of bike is not for the people that love di 2, disc brakes and carbon frames. It is for the collector before all. A nice high end steel frame made in the US by a reknown framebuilder with high end tubing and ultegra will be ahead 6000$ unless you want something mass produced from the big brands you will find something within that budget.