DaveSSS 

The SRAM website lists all retail prices for all products. The rival RD was only $285, but it's gone up. There's always google. Try searching sram rival axs rear derailleur.

https://www.sram.com/en/sram/models/rd-riv-e-d1

https://www.backcountry.com/sram-riv...e%20Components

PeteHski

Carbon bars and seatposts are objectively more comfortable than alloy. they absorb a lot more road buzz than metals. Same goes for carbon forks and frames. Have you noticed how all these modern boutique high-end steel and ti bikes are invariably built with carbon forks, seatposts and bars? The only reason they don't make the whole frame out of carbon is because they are tapping into the retro-niche market or simply don't have the skill set to manufacture carbon frames.

TDF GC winners are fairly light and trending lighter in recent years. Now well under 70 kg.

Is carbon the best material for mass-produced consumer bikes? Well maybe not if cost is your main concern and you don't care at all about weight and performance. But for any level of competition carbon is undoubtedly the best choice. I don't race competitively, but I do timed Sportives like the L'Etape du Tour and national level Fondos. I'm certainly not going to handicap myself by riding anything other than modern carbon for those events. I see the odd ti frame at local events, plenty of aluminium and even the odd steel frame. But I'd rather be on my modern carbon frame. I've owned and ridden all the other frame materials at various times in my life, except for ti. I can look back fondly on some of those old bikes, but I don't have any desire to ride them today.

Kai Winters

I get to work on Di2 bikes, including Sram, now and then and they are quite nice. But like bikes in general they work great until they don't. Most often complaints are from people who don't know how to take care of them...dead battery because they forgot to charge it is the most voiced complaint lol. That is the rider's problem, not the kit. Second is the bike won't shift. Generally it is in "crash mode" and when questioned the rider generally admits he/she dropped the bike, etc. and forgot to check it or doesn't know how to recover from that mode.
I'm using mechanical Ultegra, 11 speed, on my Aethos. I just couldn't afford the cost of a new Di2 drive train after buying the frame and a set of Roval Alpinist CLX wheels.
But after riding over 10k miles on the Aethos last year I'm leaving it as it is. Current costs for the new 12 speed Di2 is very costly for Ultegra, even the 105, and I'd rather put the money towards a gravel bike...Diverge...this year.
My mechanical drive train works perfectly and I have no complaints. I do race and considering I started racing on 5 speed mechanical/down tube shifters the mechanical Ultegra is the "bees knees" lol.
But I do admit the electronic drivetrains as great. Shifting is so easy, fast and customizable I wish I could afford it...well I can but my money is going elsewhere.

PeteHski

It's the plain truth. Plenty of posts right here on this thread from people with zero or very little experience of electronic groupsets, stating why they think they are inferior. There's even one well-known muppet who only claims to ride SS who couldn't help wading in.

GhostRider62

Yes, like virtually all of your posts.

GhostRider62

I have 7800 and 7900 and 10 speed Ultegra, they are much easier to shift than that era of SRAM mechanical. All of that stuff is 10-15 years old laying in boxes, also unloved.

The only legitimate functional argument against electronic is cost and unknown durability.

But how many miles and how many years is acceptable? I have about 4 years and over 40,000 on etap set. For me, 10 years is the minimum lifetime for a hard ridden mechanical setup but who knows how long electronic shifters and derailleurs last. I've had Ultegra mechanical shifts barely last 20K

Steve B.

Yes, I finally found something Eagle AXS at $390.

jnbrown

I have SRAM 22 mechanical rim brake on my bikes and like it.
I did have DI2 for awhile and it is nice but I feel riding a bike is a mechanical experience and adding electronics somehow takes away from that.

smd4

Glad we can agree.

tomato coupe

I think an analogy is supposed to support your argument, not refute it.

Atlas Shrugged

But will you?

What makes you think anyone will be wanting to regularly ride a vintage bike 20 years from today? Other than these forums, C&V is limited to a few older riders with fond memories of a time long past and as these people exit the sport there will be even less demand for these bikes as they languish in sheds, basements and garages.

smd4

It was a pretty simple analogy that often, older tech is far more robust than newer tech. And isn't going anywhere. Like why there are tens of thousands of manual-wind pocket watches around and serviceable from the last century and earlier, but virtually no operational 1976 Texas Instruments red-LED watches.

But as I've said before, not everyone can understand everything.

smd4

Because of the numerous examples we can see in every hobby of old technology operating alongside newer technology. C&V bikes aren't disappearing. Ever.

tomato coupe

I think what almost everyone on this forum can understand is that there are very good technical reasons why steam locomotives are no longer used, and that's what makes your analogy so inane.

smd4

Wow, even with an explanation you don't get it. My point is, they're still serviceable to this day. There are some "modern" electric locomotives that are completely unserviceable and will never again turn a wheel.

GhostRider62

There will always be people who can't let go of their old tube amplifiers, turntables, and LPs. Or car enthusiasts who think their LS6 Chevelle or old Z28 was wicked fast when objectively, there are passenger saloons that will out accelerate, have a higher top speed, corner better, brake better, better fuel economy and be infinitely more comfortable. None of these obsolete products are going away nor are the old bikes. They just are not relevant to many people nor are they remotely comparable in performance to current high end bikes.

Atlas Shrugged

You are not the only one. I mostly sold my bikes as I purchased a new one (including a 74 Masi GC with 1st Gen Super Record), but I ended up keeping two for whatever reason. A 1978 Custom Marinoni with Super Record, all restored to original hanging in my Den. The other is a team surplus 2006 Team Davitamon-Lotto Ridley Damocles with 10sp Record; this one is hanging in my exercise room. I have no desire to ride them, but I do appreciate the memories they bring.

GhostRider62

I love taking 3 year olds to see choo choo trains at museums or Thomas the Tank Engine days. Heck of a lot of fun. But give me the TGV any other day

L134 

So, if Lael needs electric motors to ease her hand fatigue so that she can set a FKT, how is that different than someone else using an electric motor (fancy, dancy new tech) to ease their leg fatigue? Mechanical pedaling certainly gives me leg fatigue and sometimes pain. Is she driving her electric motors from a dynamo hub? If not, seems to me her FKT deserves an asterisk, at least if one cares about such things. Where is the blurry line? Mine is probably different than yours. To be clear, Lael could whip my butt riding a Varsity even if I were riding an electric bike. That isn't the point. The point is that some may choose to use certain gear for reasons that have absolutely nothing to do with nostalgia, being anti-tech, or being a mindless, tearful retrogrouch. Hey, if you told me that electronic shifting could be powered by the new high tech dynamo hubs without my being locked into some groupo, I might get interested (at a reasonable cost). Just saying...

The thread is a fun read.

GhostRider62

The only bikes I got rid of were the ones I wrecked or the steel frame failed. I have them all scattered about in the garage, shed, basement, office, and of course the attic. I have been toying with throwing some of them out, notably the Kestrel but I did my first PBP on it and it is hard to toss.

GhostRider62

Just saying....we disagree. You are a dynamo grouch and I am a battery grouch. We would never agree in person or online.

elcruxio

It truly comes as no surprise that you have no idea what survivor bias is... funnily enough electric motors are typically far simpler, more elegant and many times more robust than any steam locomotive could ever hope to be. Or diesel engine for that matter.

I take it you don't use a bike computer or take a phone with you on rides?

I'm pretty sure the blurry line is quite crisp and it is drawn between propulsion and auxillary aids, such as electronic shifting. So the system can't move the bike forward or aid in moving the bike forward. Pretty simple stuff if you give it more than a knee jerk thought.

tomato coupe

A tiny, tiny fraction of steam locomotives are serviceable today. And, they’re only serviceable in the sense that any antique is serviceable - via expensive and time consuming restoration.

L134 

I don't claim to have no contradictions in what I do. Yes, I use a bike computer and cell phone. However, neither actually aids me in being able to ride between point A and point B in a given time. Alleviating had pain, I'm not saying a bad thing, arguably does aid an endurance cyclist's ability to ride between point A and point B in a FKT. If I cared, and if she had broken my record, I might take exception to her claim. My main point was that each of us makes our decisions for various reasons and the blanket characterizations being made were no less silly than my comparing electronic shifting to electronic pedaling. Electronic shifting in fact does give me pause - it pushes ME past MY blurry line. It is not at all a knee jerk thought. Your line is crisp, mine is not. Admittedly, it has nothing to do with the OP but I'm hardly the first to have strayed.

smd4

The simple fact remains. Some older tech is just more robust than newer stuff (notice I didn't say more efficient, better, faster, etc...). Forget steam locomotives---go to the example I posted earlier (after you had already quoted me in reply): There are tens of thousands--if not hundreds of thousands--of manual wind pocket watches (mine's a 1911 Hamilton), that are serviceable and operational today. There are virtually no functional examples of the Texas Instruments red LED watches from 1976.

My slide rule is able to do computations that my long-dead solar-powered calculator cannot anymore. And will never, ever stop functioning if properly cared for. My bike will be functioning perfectly long after your plastic bike with electronic parts is nothing but a fond memory in a landfill.