For the love of English 3 speeds...
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Yeah, the asking price is steep, though if it were closer to me, I'd offer $75 or $100 and buy the thing for parts. The wheels / rear hub and shifter are pretty valuable. The rack has a little value too, but some of the other parts are rougher.
There's a segment of the hobby that is obsessed with the S5 hub and throttle shifters though. They have a cross-over interest with some of the road bike people and muscle bike people. Awhile back, I was dealing with a guy who was going through a trove of Sturmey parts for a decedent's estate. He said the first buyer in the door picked all S5 hubs and related stuff. The buyer passed over older AW parts and just wanted S5 stuff. He paid full asking price ($100 per hub, $75 per shifter) for the five speed stuff.
There's a segment of the hobby that is obsessed with the S5 hub and throttle shifters though. They have a cross-over interest with some of the road bike people and muscle bike people. Awhile back, I was dealing with a guy who was going through a trove of Sturmey parts for a decedent's estate. He said the first buyer in the door picked all S5 hubs and related stuff. The buyer passed over older AW parts and just wanted S5 stuff. He paid full asking price ($100 per hub, $75 per shifter) for the five speed stuff.
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Working S5 hubs go for a lot more than any AW, even alloy ones.
I have a set of those shifters, free to anyone that asks if they pay shipping. PM me.
Those throttle shifters are terrible. The S5 is a good unit when properly set up (as it should've been from the factory), with a good strong trigger on the right and a friction puller on the left. Ebay prices for anything vintage and of good quality originally are beyond the pale these days. There's an S5 on there for like $450, which is ridiculous. These are utility bicycle hubs...
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Those throttle shifters are terrible. The S5 is a good unit when properly set up (as it should've been from the factory), with a good strong trigger on the right and a friction puller on the left. Ebay prices for anything vintage and of good quality originally are beyond the pale these days. There's an S5 on there for like $450, which is ridiculous. These are utility bicycle hubs...
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PXL_20221215_131835788.MP
After the hub rebuild, I plan to replace the worn '60s right-side trigger with a new unit (below). The Triumph is an everyday commuter, so I don't mind using new kit mixed with old.
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I appreciate that. Going to an improved shifter set up is on the table for the Sprite this year. The only think that has held me back is the very high degree of originality on the bike. I replaced the tires and the rubber brake blocks, and the front hub cones. I replaced the original dried B72 saddle with a rider B66. I added a light set, bell, and saddle bag. Even the original, plastic shifters and the early sheet metal type bell crank were intact.
The shifting is not 100%, particularly on the bell crank side. The stops in the shifter are still good and crisp, but it will sometimes slip out of ultra high or ultra low. If it were a project bike that was parted together, it would be a no-brainer to replace it. But when they're in a kind of time capsule condition like this one was... I drag my feet on replacing stuff. But the conversion is on the table if the gear slips enough and I get sufficiently pissed off at it...
The shifting is not 100%, particularly on the bell crank side. The stops in the shifter are still good and crisp, but it will sometimes slip out of ultra high or ultra low. If it were a project bike that was parted together, it would be a no-brainer to replace it. But when they're in a kind of time capsule condition like this one was... I drag my feet on replacing stuff. But the conversion is on the table if the gear slips enough and I get sufficiently pissed off at it...
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I appreciate that. Going to an improved shifter set up is on the table for the Sprite this year. The only think that has held me back is the very high degree of originality on the bike. I replaced the tires and the rubber brake blocks, and the front hub cones. I replaced the original dried B72 saddle with a rider B66. I added a light set, bell, and saddle bag. Even the original, plastic shifters and the early sheet metal type bell crank were intact.
The shifting is not 100%, particularly on the bell crank side. The stops in the shifter are still good and crisp, but it will sometimes slip out of ultra high or ultra low. If it were a project bike that was parted together, it would be a no-brainer to replace it. But when they're in a kind of time capsule condition like this one was... I drag my feet on replacing stuff. But the conversion is on the table if the gear slips enough and I get sufficiently pissed off at it...
The shifting is not 100%, particularly on the bell crank side. The stops in the shifter are still good and crisp, but it will sometimes slip out of ultra high or ultra low. If it were a project bike that was parted together, it would be a no-brainer to replace it. But when they're in a kind of time capsule condition like this one was... I drag my feet on replacing stuff. But the conversion is on the table if the gear slips enough and I get sufficiently pissed off at it...
He keeps the 6 volt Lucas system on it for the same reason.
It has a hard time dealing with the headlight and the spark plugs at the same time.
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Just picked up a basket case Sprite 27.
Decent paint, straight frame, but both rims have severe side wall rust/wear and the front hub has a loose flange.
Normally I only mess with the 26" models but it looks the part and I have lots of spare parts.
The rim choices I have on hand are either a set of 35mm wide Araya chrome steel rims in 27", or a set of Weinmann 519 alloy rims in 700c.
I've got zero experience though with the Weinmann 519, which is usually found on modern comfort bikes from the early 2000's or so.
It seems to be a rather stout rim with a brushed finish. The set I have even came with a set of semi slick 700-35 whitewall tires
Decent paint, straight frame, but both rims have severe side wall rust/wear and the front hub has a loose flange.
Normally I only mess with the 26" models but it looks the part and I have lots of spare parts.
The rim choices I have on hand are either a set of 35mm wide Araya chrome steel rims in 27", or a set of Weinmann 519 alloy rims in 700c.
I've got zero experience though with the Weinmann 519, which is usually found on modern comfort bikes from the early 2000's or so.
It seems to be a rather stout rim with a brushed finish. The set I have even came with a set of semi slick 700-35 whitewall tires
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Just picked up a basket case Sprite 27.
Decent paint, straight frame, but both rims have severe side wall rust/wear and the front hub has a loose flange.
Normally I only mess with the 26" models but it looks the part and I have lots of spare parts.
The rim choices I have on hand are either a set of 35mm wide Araya chrome steel rims in 27", or a set of Weinmann 519 alloy rims in 700c.
I've got zero experience though with the Weinmann 519, which is usually found on modern comfort bikes from the early 2000's or so.
It seems to be a rather stout rim with a brushed finish. The set I have even came with a set of semi slick 700-35 whitewall tires
Decent paint, straight frame, but both rims have severe side wall rust/wear and the front hub has a loose flange.
Normally I only mess with the 26" models but it looks the part and I have lots of spare parts.
The rim choices I have on hand are either a set of 35mm wide Araya chrome steel rims in 27", or a set of Weinmann 519 alloy rims in 700c.
I've got zero experience though with the Weinmann 519, which is usually found on modern comfort bikes from the early 2000's or so.
It seems to be a rather stout rim with a brushed finish. The set I have even came with a set of semi slick 700-35 whitewall tires
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At work this week, a component of a very old machine failed and caused some equipment damage. No person was hurt, thank Gord.
In the discussion of what caused the event it was suggested that the failed component was probably not original to the equipment, but had been replaced at some point in the decades since the machine was installed.
The best parallel to this situation I could think of was Sturmey Archer 3-speed hubs - It is my understanding that if you have a SA hub from the 40s or 50s, it is likely to keep working forever with minimal maintenance, but that a SA hub from the eighties is likely to fail under regular use - earlier models were made like a piece of farm equipment and had similar reliability, and 'improvements' to the manufacturing process were likely designed to decrease cost and/or build in some 'planned obsolescence'.
In the discussion of what caused the event it was suggested that the failed component was probably not original to the equipment, but had been replaced at some point in the decades since the machine was installed.
The best parallel to this situation I could think of was Sturmey Archer 3-speed hubs - It is my understanding that if you have a SA hub from the 40s or 50s, it is likely to keep working forever with minimal maintenance, but that a SA hub from the eighties is likely to fail under regular use - earlier models were made like a piece of farm equipment and had similar reliability, and 'improvements' to the manufacturing process were likely designed to decrease cost and/or build in some 'planned obsolescence'.
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1970 Raleigh Tourist in nice condition.
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Bikes are okay, I guess.
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Snaps to the director of this American cell phone TV commercial for putting "Einstein" (actor Paul Giamatti) on a rod-braked three-speed.
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ClydeClydeson : my understanding (and not direct experience) is that the higher level of unreliability in the later hubs was due to the machine tools used to manufacture the hubs not having been renovated, so the parts being made were sloppier. By the time SunRace bought out the factory it seems the machinery was pretty spent.
Having said that, my lower level of use has proven that all my hubs (from 40s through 80s) all work very well indeed.
Having said that, my lower level of use has proven that all my hubs (from 40s through 80s) all work very well indeed.
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I was also told that the earlier production cyanide surface-hardening process was outlawed. Plus, in the 70s~90s, more and more cycle production moved from Europe to Asia, and Sturmey hubs bore the additional cost to OEMs of transportation from England, yet had to be cost-competitive with Asian-produced hubs, leaving little margin for new machine tools, more expensive alloys & processes and R&D. Once Shimano replaced the 3.3.3 with the Nexus, the writing was on the wall.
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That is all good information. I'll think twice about quoting Craigslist item titles in the future.
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I swapped the calipers and levers with a pair from an older Sports and for a while ran a set of modern 700c wheels with a Nexus 7 speed hub.
There were plenty of room for proper brake pad alignment with the smaller 700C wheels.
(I didn't stick with that set up though, the Nexus 7 hub was just too heavy and really didn't show me any serious benefit. I eventually just built up a set of Araya w/o rims with an AW hub. The Nexus hub, with a 20t rear cog basically gave me two gears that were far too low to use, and three that were too tall for me 99% of the time, I found myself using it as a two speed in 3rd and 4th gear with those ratios feeling pretty much like a stock AW set up in 1st and 2nd gear. I sold the wheelset along with the rest of the set up after only a few months).
I did like the wider tires though, which were slightly wider than most 590 sized tires found on the 26" wheel models.
Bikes are okay, I guess.
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Dos Turistas for $450 in NJ! These look really nice.
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...02583665415871
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...02583665415871
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Bonus for Kool Stop Continental brake pads though that’s quite a creative solution to securing the double-ended cable:
This saddle has more brackets attached than I can make sense of:
TCW hub dated Dec. 1961:
In case you were wondering where it was made:
Rear rack is the most corroded part and will likely get removed. Chrome fenders should clean up well. It’ll be a winter project, and in the spring I’ll give it away to a work colleague.
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I've got one of those tcw hubs. Are they pretty failure prone?