PatKendall

I’m mid-60s, 190 pounds and just finished my second year of riding. 2700 miles year one on a hybrid. 4200 miles this past year on a Specialized Roubaix Comp Triple. Most of my rides are alone on hilly country roads. About a quarter of my miles are club and charity rides, and much of that riding in pace lines or drafting.

I love my Roubaix, but after 50-60 miles my neck and shoulders begin to ache. I’ve been fitted and tweaked several times. I think I’m reasonably well fitted to the bike. The handlebars on the Roubaix are level with the saddle.

I’d like to ride longer and more comfortably. Hope to ride the length of the Natchez Trace Parkway this spring with friends, about 440 miles over a week. I don’t see myself doing fully loaded tours, but love the light credit card tours.

I’ve been looking at the Sam Hillborne and other bikes that I think would be suitable for my recreational riding and occasional light tour. The main thing I’m trying to accomplish is increased comfort on my longer (50+ mile rides). Overall the Hillborne looks great. I do have some concerns about using bar end shifters on the group rides, especially in a pace line.

Is the Hillborne a good choice? Thanks in advance for your comments.

NOS88

Welcome, Pat, and congrats on your second year of riding.

The Sam Hillborne is a fine bike. It should provide the comfort you seek. If the Roubaix isn't doing it for you, the Hillborne seems to make sense. In terms of the bar end shifters, I use them on my commuter (it's almost impossible to have them break down on you) and find that they are not that difficult to use. However, you could swap them out at a later time for brifters if you find that you don't like them. Rivendell has a great reputation for quality products (even their imported ones). So, I don't think you need to worry on that front. Give you want to do the occasional light tour, like long recreational rides, I'd say go for it.

AzTallRider

I doubt you will find the steel bike more comfortable than your Roubaix, which has one of the smoothest rides of any bike out there. If the idea is to get the bars up even further relative to the saddle, you might try doing that on the Roubaix (different stem, steering tube extender, etc) to see if that's your issue before investing in a new bike.

Most folks that buy Rivendell do so for the panache, and also because they build great bikes. But bear in mind that they are essentially an assembler. They have frames built to their spec's, select the components, and put it all together. They buy at least some of their frames from Waterford, and you can buy the exact same frame, direct from Waterford, and save a lot of cash. Waterford has a lot of expertise to help you get the geometry right, plus the engineers to ensure no issues with the frame. Waterford has a less upscale division (Gunnar) that gets you a lot of the same benefits at an even further reduced cost. I own a custom Gunnar Sport. It's a fine bike, but I do most of my riding on my carbon Madone.

NOS88

I like the idea of trying to get the current bike setup to meet one's needs. However, on the Roubaix getting the bars higher may not be all that easy. The last time I spoke with a Specialized rep he told me that they don't recommend any stack above 40mm with their carbon forks. He also indicated that a steering tube extender is not recommended for these forks either. Given the already long head tube of the Roubaix model and the fact the the OP has already been fitted several times, it may be that he's run out of options on this particular bike. In any event I think your thoughts are worth exploring.... but perhaps this is a case of N+1 creeping into someone's life who is now entering his third year of riding?

AzTallRider

Far be it from me to dissuade anyone from N+1! But it sure would be good if bike #3 totally nailed it, and future N+1's were for other reasons. I'm not suggesting a tube extender as a permanent solution, but it might help isolate the issue. And you can get some pretty extremely angled stems that could help do the same. Of course, there's also the chance, PatKendall, that your aches are fitness related, and you could solve them with an exercise regimen.

mikepwagner

I have a hard time navigating around the Waterford site - which frame of theirs is exactly the same as the Sam Hillborne?

I hope it's clear that I am nor arguing - I just find the drop down menus on the Waterford site kind of confusing.

Thanks,

Mike

John_V 

I think it depends on the fitter and they type of fitting system that he/she uses. Not all bike shops provide professional fitting, although many claim that they do. I'm wondering if the OP has tried a Retul fitting? It's the most accurate fitting you can get and it isn't much more expensive than some of the other professional fittings. I bought my road bike so that I could do a local MS 150 and had the Retul fitting done just after I purchased the bike. I did the MS 150 without a ache or pain after the two day ride. I've done quite a few 100K plus charity rides since then and have never had any issues with soreness caused by a bad fit. I think, that if put in his shoes, I would try the Retul fitting with his bike first and then go from there.

Oh yes! The case of the famous N+1. Colnago Ace or Bianchi Infenuto is where I am at now. It's driving me nuts.

BluesDawg

I'd love to add a Sam Hillborne or a full custom Rivendell to my bike harem, but it is hard to imagine it being a more comfortable long distance bike than my Roubaix. Whether or not you get the Riv, I think you should continue to work on the comfort on your Roubaix.

AzTallRider's suggestion is worth considering. After I got my bike fit dialed in, it still took some core strengthening excercises to keep my neck and shoulders from aching after hours of riding.

AzTallRider

Cervelo S5 is what's calling me (constantly). It's been declared officially ugly by BF, but I like the functional beauty of it, and there is no disputing that it's fricken fast.

cccorlew

I don't think there's a more comfortable road bike out there than what you have (though I'd like to try a Volagi)
Perhaps you need to concentrate on your form. Elbows in, no "vulture" look even if you get tired.

I know the bars the shipped on mine were too wide for me. Bringing them down a size helped a lot.

Side note: Does your Roubaix have a carbon steerer tube? I'm not sure, but I don't think so. I'm pretty sure my Roubaix Expert is aluminum. That might open your options a bit to a taller stack.

DiabloScott

Consider seeing a chiropracter instead of looking at new bikes. I used to have serious neck pain after 60 miles or so; now... not nearly so much.

NOS88

OK, I've re-read this thread, and what I'm wondering is does the man just want a new bike? The N+1 drive sometimes needs internal rationalization....

I have a Roubaix S-Works that I like a great deal....BUT...my Indy Fab CJ Ti is much more comfortable. At least that's the rationale I used for getting it...the Roubaix just wasn't comfortable enough.

PatKendall

Thanks for the thoughts on core strength, chiropractors, raising the bars, etc. I'm not familiar with the Retul fitting system, but I'll see if that's available in my area.

Yes, my thought was to find a bike that would allow me to raise the bars above the level of the saddle. After several fitting adjustments with a guy I trust, I think I've pushed the Roubaix about as far as I can. While the idea of riding a Rivendell has a lot of appeal to me, I'd be disappointed if it didn't allow me to ride longer distances w/o the neck and shoulder pain.

John_V 

Check it out at Retul.com. It's the fitting system that is used by Carmichael Training Labs and several other top training camps. It uses a laser and a computer to get real time measurements while you are pedaling the bike. You are hooked up to the computer with electrodes on your foot, leg, hip, arms and hand and everything is measured as you pedal. There is no guess work or the possibility that the fitter will put the measuring device at a different point of measurement.

According to their web site, there are two bike shops in Tennessee that offer the Retul fitting. One is East Ridge Bicycles (5910 Ringgold Road Chattanooga, TN 37412) and the other is Endeavor Performance (1811 Hayes Street Nashville, TN 37203). Not sure how far from Memphis these shops are, but if they aren't that far, it may be worth your while to check it out.

On the other hand, if you really want that N+1, go for it. I'm in the same dilemma on the N+1 but not because my bike doesn't fit.

PatKendall

Hey! We only need "one more!" Right?

Nashville is three hours (by car). Well worth exploring. Thanks!

Dudelsack 

Bag it all. Get a recumbent. Cycle in luxury.

skilsaw

Mid 60's? Riding over 2K per year? You only live once. Get the bike.

But only if you can afford it. Having to scrimp to make credit card payments sucks. I know. I dove into my savings last year for a big purchase, and now am having the dickens of a time saving up again. (What is "the dickens of a time" anyway? In trailerpark speak, it is "having a *itch of a time" but I moved out of the trailerpark so I can't say it anymore.)

Racer Ex 

There are a fair number of stems out there with considerable angle...I know this because on a couple of time trial bikes I needed to get lower than the head tube. I'd check that out first, though going higher might not be the answer. A shorter stem might be better.

I'm not a big fan of Rivendell or Waterford steel...a lot of money for a steel rehash. You can get the same or better ride out of a number of mid 80's frames which give you both retro cool and money to go do stuff, like buy better components. I trained on an 87 cromo Trek for a year...really superb ride. $100 frame that I built up.

Bar end shifters, unless they are on the end of TT bars, are going backwards. Every shift you're having to go to the drops and you're increasing the time it takes to get to the brakes, along with being slightly off balance if you're just going to one side.

irwin7638

It's real easy to overthink this but I ended up with a Hunqapillar which had basically the same geometry but heavier tubing.
This is the story of my tortured decision.
If you're asking about comfort,this is all I got.

Racer Ex 

One thing I'm big on is the right saddle. While the OP's issues aren't going to be cured by that, there's a lot of "sympathetic" pain that goes with having not exactly the right saddle (or the right saddle set wrong).

Love to try a Brooks someday.

BluesDawg

Somehow I have managed not to experience these problems with the several bikes I have ridden over the last 20 years with bar end shifters. I had a nice ride Sunday on my Casseroll with Suntour friction bar ends. No problem getting to the brakes whenever I wanted to use them and no balance problems.

BluesDawg

Pretty sure you are mistaken. I know for sure my Expert has a carbon steerer.

Racer Ex 

Muscle memory is a beautiful thing, especially 20 years worth. And you are to be congratulated on your lack on intimacy with the pavement, may that rabbit continue to limp to your benefit.

However I'd say that a 60's guy going into his third year on his third bike might have issues when the texting teen pulls out in front of him in the middle of a shift on an unfamiliar set up that was abandoned by most riders 20 years ago for obvious ergonomic reasons. I'd rather not read a thread about the broken hip if it can be avoid by modern controls.

BTW those Suntour shifters have enough throw to run 10 speed if you can get around the slight indexing from the ratchet mech. Just sold a pair on Ebay.

BluesDawg

Way to use emotion to stretch a point.

I think anyone on a bike with any shifting technology could have issues in that situation. My hands are on the hoods most of the time just like they are on my bike with brifters. There are plenty of reasons someone might choose brifters over bar ends, but safety? I'm not buying that.

8 speed is as much as I run with the friction bar ends. No doubt more would work, but the margin for error gets smaller as the shift spacing gets tighter. My 10 speed bike has Ultegra 6700 and I like that, too.

qcpmsame 

I haven't seen the bicycle you are asking about, if it is a Waterford wouldn't a custom frame and fitting be a part of the purchase? (I know nothing about Waterford's bicycles other than a connection to the Schwinn Paramount bicycles.) As to the neck and back pain, I had back problems when I returned due to 2 fused disks in my lower back with the stock -10 degree stem on my bike. I went to a threadless adapter and a flipped upward -17 degree, 100 length Ritchey stem and 42 width Ritchey anatomical bars. The slight upright position helped tremendously. However N+1 is hard to refuse at any time. I have the virus from N+1 now and I am looking really hard for a new Cannondale or Masi.

Bill