Germi Super Sport '65
#1
Full Member
Thread Starter
Germi Super Sport '65
Here is a bike I picked up last summer. It a Germi Super Sport and I think it might be from 1965 but I am not sure. The Titan bars are marked with '65' so it is not just a guess. The bike needs some work and unfortunately is not 100% original, I believe. The fork is obviously a replacement, which is a bummer, the cranks, pedals and the rear derailleur don't look original to the bike either. I don't have a clear plan yet what I am gonna do with it, but I'll start stripping the frame from the parts soon. It is my size so I am planning on keeping it in any case.
Here is some information about this marque form Klassiekeracefiets:
"Germi was a private brand of Gerrit de Weerd from Hilversum. The name Germi is a contraction of the first names of Gerrit and his wife, called Mien. De Weerd started his business in 1952 and stopped in 1981. At the time, you could order custom frames from De Weerd, which were made in Amsterdam by Jasper Bouma (Jabo) and painted at a different address. The final assembly then took place at De Weerd's shop at 119 Kometenstraat in Hilversum."
Here is some information about this marque form Klassiekeracefiets:
"Germi was a private brand of Gerrit de Weerd from Hilversum. The name Germi is a contraction of the first names of Gerrit and his wife, called Mien. De Weerd started his business in 1952 and stopped in 1981. At the time, you could order custom frames from De Weerd, which were made in Amsterdam by Jasper Bouma (Jabo) and painted at a different address. The final assembly then took place at De Weerd's shop at 119 Kometenstraat in Hilversum."
Likes For alexnagui:
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Middle Earth (aka IA)
Posts: 20,954
Bikes: A bunch of old bikes and a few new ones
Liked 4,323 Times
in
2,383 Posts
I like the bike a lot but you might want to lose that kickstand.
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: North of Boston
Posts: 913
Bikes: 1973 Schwinn Sports Tourer plus a " few" more :)
Liked 203 Times
in
149 Posts
That's one cool bike !!!!
Agree.....maybe get a better fitting kickstand, or adjust the one on there.**********
Just doesn't seem to look " correct"
Looks in GREAT shape as well !!!!
AWESOME score !!!!
Agree.....maybe get a better fitting kickstand, or adjust the one on there.**********
Just doesn't seem to look " correct"
Looks in GREAT shape as well !!!!
AWESOME score !!!!
Likes For bikemike73:
#6
Senior Member
-----
lug pattern NERVEX 48/161
shell NERVEX with nozzle cut 158
front Maillard QR skewer a pattern which did not launch until 1973
cycle's Normandy Sport hubs with small round holes were last produced 1966
chainset puzzling, inner face of arms appears to be marked uK 170, is that correct?,blk plastic dustcovers appear to be popout type rather than threaded, chainwheel pattern matches OFMEGA Forgiato, wonder if set could be a brand such as Suarini...
as you say, pedals and rear mech clearly too late for cycle
shall look forward to following along as the experts weigh in
-----
lug pattern NERVEX 48/161
shell NERVEX with nozzle cut 158
front Maillard QR skewer a pattern which did not launch until 1973
cycle's Normandy Sport hubs with small round holes were last produced 1966
chainset puzzling, inner face of arms appears to be marked uK 170, is that correct?,blk plastic dustcovers appear to be popout type rather than threaded, chainwheel pattern matches OFMEGA Forgiato, wonder if set could be a brand such as Suarini...
as you say, pedals and rear mech clearly too late for cycle
shall look forward to following along as the experts weigh in
-----
Likes For juvela:
Likes For alexnagui:
#9
Senior Member
note the scuff near the letter S of Tourisme
a front mech may have been mounted at some point
cable routing hole in chainguard bracket appears it may be threaded for an adjusting barrel
since rust can be seen in hole it may have been employed at some juncture in the past...
-----
#10
Senior Member
Doesn’t it run to the stop on the NDS and then there is housing from there under the BB and up to the seat tube housing stop? The DR is a bit above that housing stop.
#11
Senior Member
-----
arrangement of chainguard mounting brackets also serving as housing stops reminds me of the pump pegs on this Favorit model F12 of 1979 -
---
arrestors -
is it fairly common for NL producers to combine Alti and Weinmann bits on one cycle?
------
arrangement of chainguard mounting brackets also serving as housing stops reminds me of the pump pegs on this Favorit model F12 of 1979 -
---
arrestors -
is it fairly common for NL producers to combine Alti and Weinmann bits on one cycle?
------
#12
Stop reading my posts!
that's a real find!
BUT...so "germ-y", kind of bad timing.
BUT...so "germ-y", kind of bad timing.
#14
Polymultiplié
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: South Holland, NL
Posts: 11,238
Bikes: Yes, please.
Liked 5,266 Times
in
1,939 Posts
What a nice find! Beautiful frame. It's a pity pretty much everything else seems to have been replaced over time, except maybe the saddle, seat post, bars and stem.
The "Super Sport" moniker puts in the sixties. It was the popular name at the time for bikes that were in a market segment between "Sport" and "Race". Light, expensive and the best you could have for your Sunday afternoon out. They typically came from established frame builders or well-reputed factories. There are some examples of these bikes to be found online, if you're interested in getting it back to period-correct spec. I'll see if I can find some examples.
These are a couple of my own examples from that period.
A RIH Sport "Super". Built by Willem Bustraan jr. in early 1965. As it came to me, and clearly suffering from the same "upgrade-itis". Only the Campagnolo Record transmission, and maybe the rear rack, are original:
And a Joco "Ronde van Europa" from a couple of years earlier:
The "Super Sport" moniker puts in the sixties. It was the popular name at the time for bikes that were in a market segment between "Sport" and "Race". Light, expensive and the best you could have for your Sunday afternoon out. They typically came from established frame builders or well-reputed factories. There are some examples of these bikes to be found online, if you're interested in getting it back to period-correct spec. I'll see if I can find some examples.
These are a couple of my own examples from that period.
A RIH Sport "Super". Built by Willem Bustraan jr. in early 1965. As it came to me, and clearly suffering from the same "upgrade-itis". Only the Campagnolo Record transmission, and maybe the rear rack, are original:
And a Joco "Ronde van Europa" from a couple of years earlier:
#15
Full Member
Thread Starter
What a nice find! Beautiful frame. It's a pity pretty much everything else seems to have been replaced over time, except maybe the saddle, seat post, bars and stem.
The "Super Sport" moniker puts in the sixties. It was the popular name at the time for bikes that were in a market segment between "Sport" and "Race". Light, expensive and the best you could have for your Sunday afternoon out. They typically came from established frame builders or well-reputed factories. There are some examples of these bikes to be found online, if you're interested in getting it back to period-correct spec. I'll see if I can find some examples.
These are a couple of my own examples from that period.
A RIH Sport "Super". Built by Willem Bustraan jr. in early 1965. As it came to me, and clearly suffering from the same "upgrade-itis". Only the Campagnolo Record transmission, and maybe the rear rack, are original:
And a Joco "Ronde van Europa" from a couple of years earlier:
The "Super Sport" moniker puts in the sixties. It was the popular name at the time for bikes that were in a market segment between "Sport" and "Race". Light, expensive and the best you could have for your Sunday afternoon out. They typically came from established frame builders or well-reputed factories. There are some examples of these bikes to be found online, if you're interested in getting it back to period-correct spec. I'll see if I can find some examples.
These are a couple of my own examples from that period.
A RIH Sport "Super". Built by Willem Bustraan jr. in early 1965. As it came to me, and clearly suffering from the same "upgrade-itis". Only the Campagnolo Record transmission, and maybe the rear rack, are original:
And a Joco "Ronde van Europa" from a couple of years earlier:
Here are some examples from oudefiets.nl:
Joco Ronde van Europa
Jan de Reus
#16
Polymultiplié
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: South Holland, NL
Posts: 11,238
Bikes: Yes, please.
Liked 5,266 Times
in
1,939 Posts
Yes, those are the examples I meant to find. Locomotief made some nice ones as well. Search for "Locomotief Tour de France".
I think this was originally one. Bontekoe was a Locomotief dealer, and my guess is that he also got 'blank frames' from them to brand as his own.
I think this was originally one. Bontekoe was a Locomotief dealer, and my guess is that he also got 'blank frames' from them to brand as his own.
#17
Polymultiplié
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: South Holland, NL
Posts: 11,238
Bikes: Yes, please.
Liked 5,266 Times
in
1,939 Posts
Here is an article from the "Kampioen", which shows a whole range of models from various companies: Moet er een nieuwe fiets komen?
#18
Full Member
Thread Starter
Yes, and without the chain guards but with drop bars they were usually called "semi-race", I believe. But there were no fixed rules, as "marketing" was already a thing back then.
Here is an article from the "Kampioen", which shows a whole range of models from various companies: Moet er een nieuwe fiets komen?
Here is an article from the "Kampioen", which shows a whole range of models from various companies: Moet er een nieuwe fiets komen?
Yes, those are the examples I meant to find. Locomotief made some nice ones as well. Search for "Locomotief Tour de France".
I think this was originally one. Bontekoe was a Locomotief dealer, and my guess is that he also got 'blank frames' from them to brand as his own.
I think this was originally one. Bontekoe was a Locomotief dealer, and my guess is that he also got 'blank frames' from them to brand as his own.
Have you seen this one here?
#19
Full Member
Thread Starter
I finally got around to stripping the frame from all the parts and cleaning and polishing the frame set. I am thinking whether I should touch up the frame with transparant nail polish or somehting like that and then I'll wax it.
The top tube has some small dents which I had not mentioned previously. Let's consider this patina
One of the seatstays is kinda flattened a bit at the joint with the dropout. I believe it was made this way, but it is a bit weird...
The brake bridge is vertically drilled, I actually had a hard time removing the the vertical bolt because it just kept rotating in its aluminimum "body", the nut wouldn't loosen at all. I don't think the bolt is reusable anymore, but I belive I have a set of Mafac Dural forge with a vertical bolt
The braze-on bracket is a little bit broken
I think that I will have to modify the chainguard if I am gonna use a double in front. Like make a slot for the front derailleur, I don't see how it's gonna work without such a modification
I found a serial number: 6716. I might be from 1967, not 65 as I thougth before
The top tube has some small dents which I had not mentioned previously. Let's consider this patina
One of the seatstays is kinda flattened a bit at the joint with the dropout. I believe it was made this way, but it is a bit weird...
The brake bridge is vertically drilled, I actually had a hard time removing the the vertical bolt because it just kept rotating in its aluminimum "body", the nut wouldn't loosen at all. I don't think the bolt is reusable anymore, but I belive I have a set of Mafac Dural forge with a vertical bolt
The braze-on bracket is a little bit broken
I think that I will have to modify the chainguard if I am gonna use a double in front. Like make a slot for the front derailleur, I don't see how it's gonna work without such a modification
I found a serial number: 6716. I might be from 1967, not 65 as I thougth before
#20
Polymultiplié
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: South Holland, NL
Posts: 11,238
Bikes: Yes, please.
Liked 5,266 Times
in
1,939 Posts
That's a nice Bontekoe! Too small for you, unfortunately, isn't is?
Have you seen this one here?
Have you seen this one here?
And I did see the thread on the Oude Fiets forum. I like that the owner got it back on the road the way he did.
This is another Bontekoe I spotted in the wild in The Hague a few years back. Didn't get to speak to the owner, alas.
Likes For non-fixie:
#21
Full Member
Thread Starter
Thanks. Yes, it is too small, and yes, that is unfortunate.
And I did see the thread on the Oude Fiets forum. I like that the owner got it back on the road the way he did.
This is another Bontekoe I spotted in the wild in The Hague a few years back. Didn't get to speak to the owner, alas.
And I did see the thread on the Oude Fiets forum. I like that the owner got it back on the road the way he did.
This is another Bontekoe I spotted in the wild in The Hague a few years back. Didn't get to speak to the owner, alas.
#23
Full Member
Thread Starter
I will most likely just leave it as a 5-speed for now. I have a spare Stronglight 49D crankset but I feel like this bike deserves a nice cottered crankset. I will see if I can find one from Stronglight, those are quite rare AFAIK
#24
Full Member
Thread Starter
I've given up the idea of finding a nice cottered crankset and instead gotten a chainring from SunXCD which I thought would look nice with Stronglight 49D crank arms.
Ran into a problem with the bottom bracket. I tried installing a cheap sealed 111mm JIS Sunrace unit which looked to be proper length for a Stronglight single. The crank however seems to sit "too close" to the bottom bracket shell, so that some of the little chain ring bolts on the inside hit the bottom bracket shell. Those are original Stronglight bolts, maybe I could use some other ones which won't protrude as much. The chain line with this bottom bracket is around 42mm though, which is correct for 120mm spacing on the rear.
However, there is (almost) no space between the crank arm and the chain guard So I definitely need a longer bottom bracket if I want to use the Stronglight cranks with the chain guard. But how long? A sealed JIS 115mm is already meant for a double. I am afraid that the chain line will be off by too much.
I should have measured the chain line with the original crank, the bottom bracket it came with is a mix of Tange and Shimano with a Shimano D-3NL spindle (122.5mm). That seems like way too long to me!
Aslo, the original crankset seems to have wider "tread" in comparison with the Stronglight, which means more distance between the crank arm and the chain ring.
Ran into a problem with the bottom bracket. I tried installing a cheap sealed 111mm JIS Sunrace unit which looked to be proper length for a Stronglight single. The crank however seems to sit "too close" to the bottom bracket shell, so that some of the little chain ring bolts on the inside hit the bottom bracket shell. Those are original Stronglight bolts, maybe I could use some other ones which won't protrude as much. The chain line with this bottom bracket is around 42mm though, which is correct for 120mm spacing on the rear.
However, there is (almost) no space between the crank arm and the chain guard So I definitely need a longer bottom bracket if I want to use the Stronglight cranks with the chain guard. But how long? A sealed JIS 115mm is already meant for a double. I am afraid that the chain line will be off by too much.
I should have measured the chain line with the original crank, the bottom bracket it came with is a mix of Tange and Shimano with a Shimano D-3NL spindle (122.5mm). That seems like way too long to me!
Aslo, the original crankset seems to have wider "tread" in comparison with the Stronglight, which means more distance between the crank arm and the chain ring.
#25
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Port Angeles, WA
Posts: 7,927
Bikes: A green one, "Ragleigh," or something.
Liked 644 Times
in
361 Posts
Yep. Fitting a new crank/chainset to a bike is always a can o' worms - with or without a chain guard involved. Looks like you need a longer spindle.
__________________
● 1971 Grandis SL ● 1972 Lambert Grand Prix frankenbike ● 1972 Raleigh Super Course fixie ● 1973 Nishiki Semi-Pro ● 1979 Motobecane Grand Jubile ●1980 Apollo "Legnano" ● 1984 Peugeot Vagabond ● 1985 Shogun Prairie Breaker ● 1986 Merckx Super Corsa ● 1987 Schwinn Tempo ● 1988 Schwinn Voyageur ● 1989 Bottechia Team ADR replica ● 1990 Cannondale ST600 ● 1993 Technium RT600 ● 1996 Kona Lava Dome ●
● 1971 Grandis SL ● 1972 Lambert Grand Prix frankenbike ● 1972 Raleigh Super Course fixie ● 1973 Nishiki Semi-Pro ● 1979 Motobecane Grand Jubile ●1980 Apollo "Legnano" ● 1984 Peugeot Vagabond ● 1985 Shogun Prairie Breaker ● 1986 Merckx Super Corsa ● 1987 Schwinn Tempo ● 1988 Schwinn Voyageur ● 1989 Bottechia Team ADR replica ● 1990 Cannondale ST600 ● 1993 Technium RT600 ● 1996 Kona Lava Dome ●