Bike Radar
#51
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I definitely see your point about too many warnings being worse than no warning at all. While a Varia (or another rear-facing radar) cannot predict which (if any) approaching object will collide with me, I still find it invaluable for the times I have to cross traffic lanes to turn left or leave the bike lane temporarily to avoid obstructions.
I'll have to play with it to see what works best.
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-Stupid hurts....ride safe
Cheers, Mike
-Stupid hurts....ride safe
#52
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It might be age, experience, or worldview, but even for free, I'm not interested.
Even if it worked great, I don't imagine there's any way to reliably predict which drivers are going to hit me from behind and which are going to swing around and pass safely (defined as no contact). Secondly, there's the question of timing, Even in the best of worlds, with excellent accuracy, I don't believe, I can fet warned soon enough to react effectively. So, I don't want to ride where I'm repetitively diving for shoulders, or tuning out false alarms. If I can't use info effectively, I don't need to have my peace disturbed.
Ask those who live with automated warning alarms, ie. jet pilots, and they'll tell you how too many alarms is as bad, or worse, as never having alarms in the first place.
Even if it worked great, I don't imagine there's any way to reliably predict which drivers are going to hit me from behind and which are going to swing around and pass safely (defined as no contact). Secondly, there's the question of timing, Even in the best of worlds, with excellent accuracy, I don't believe, I can fet warned soon enough to react effectively. So, I don't want to ride where I'm repetitively diving for shoulders, or tuning out false alarms. If I can't use info effectively, I don't need to have my peace disturbed.
Ask those who live with automated warning alarms, ie. jet pilots, and they'll tell you how too many alarms is as bad, or worse, as never having alarms in the first place.
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#53
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Prior to getting the Varia, I wasted too much time studying maps to plot routes to avoid left turns.
#54
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So, I'm not trying to convince anyone to use or not use new tech. However, I'm not as sold as many others are. Part of that is because use of tech leads to reliance on tech, so it can become zero sum.
I agree with your point about left turns and lane changes, which I also could use help from time to time. OTOH, I don't know if and how much I'd rely on that info vs. trying to be an owl. I also don't know if the quality of the info is good enough to bet my life on.
All in all, I'm not arguing against tech, just giving my personal perspective and reminding folks to think before deciding.
‐‐-------------
Side story below, read only if you care.
Besides bicycling I engage in various "dangerous" activities, one of which is SCUBA diving. When I started we had to manually track depth and time, then use tables to manage dives.
Then, dive computers thad did that for you became popular, allowing much better dive management. The expectation was that better management would reduce dive accidents. The opposite happened, and the rate of decompression went up instead. It turns out that working somewhat blind made divers err to the side of caution. With a dive computer, divers felt empowered to work closer to line.
Last edited by FBinNY; 05-14-24 at 12:44 PM.
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#55
Senior Member
To clarify my question, I wonder if folks who live in less urban areas and are often on backroads, often without shoulders, are finding these more useful then perhaps a rider, like myself, who rides in more congested areas, where there is pretty much always a car back, as it were.
To address your concerns over the audibility of the beeping sound, I will mention that the visual display on my Edge 1040, which is on an out-front mount and so in my sight line, almost always catches my attention.
When I ride my commuter bike through town, I find the Varia far less useful -- to the point that I rarely use it. There will always be cars approaching, so I always ride all the way to the right and assume there are approaching vehicles. The Varia might offer a bit of benefit by virtue of its flashing pattern, which changes (for max visibility) as a vehicle approaches, but since I typically run two tail lights (one solid, one flashing) I'm not too worried about it.
#56
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#57
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the sudden alert of the tail light flashing in itself is worth it imo. The radar adds on top of it. A single rear facing light in solid or flashing might be enough for some, but for my areas of riding you should have one steady on 200+ lumens tail light & a flash upon close range distance 200+ lumens tail light. it'll have a better chance in "waking up" a driver.
I will say this, if* you don't see me as you approach, you either are having a medical issue, intoxicated, or are deliberate in your attempt in checking off a vindictive box.
I will say this, if* you don't see me as you approach, you either are having a medical issue, intoxicated, or are deliberate in your attempt in checking off a vindictive box.
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#58
It is an option. Changing minds, or at least, providing info and broadening the knowledge base on which people form opinions is what forums are about.
So, I'm not trying to convince anyone to use or not use new tech. However, I'm not as a old as many others are. Part of that is that use of tech leads to reliance on tech, so it can become no sum.
All in all, I'm not arguing against tech, just giving my personal perspective and reminding folks to think before deciding.
‐‐-------------
So, I'm not trying to convince anyone to use or not use new tech. However, I'm not as a old as many others are. Part of that is that use of tech leads to reliance on tech, so it can become no sum.
All in all, I'm not arguing against tech, just giving my personal perspective and reminding folks to think before deciding.
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They have become very popular over the last few years for good reason and I haven’t come across anyone in real life who has regretted buying one. But this is BF, so I’m fully expecting someone to hate their Varia😂
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#59
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So, we just finished a 20 mile ride and the Varia significantly improved my awareness. It let me know when a car was approaching so I could check my mirror.
It was also very helpful in seeing vehicles approaching on the right when they are exiting the freeway.
The app is a little kludgy and doesn’t give any indication of lateral position. Does anyone with more experience know if there is setting that will show lateral position?
Update:
We just finished a 52 mile ride, and the Varia lasted 7 hours (I left it on during lunch). On the way home, the traffic was much heavier and the alerts became almost constant, rendering it much less useful.
The lack of lane advice is disappointing, so I'm going to try the Trek CarBack. The advertising for that clearly states it give lane information. Will have to see how accurate it is.
It was also very helpful in seeing vehicles approaching on the right when they are exiting the freeway.
The app is a little kludgy and doesn’t give any indication of lateral position. Does anyone with more experience know if there is setting that will show lateral position?
Update:
We just finished a 52 mile ride, and the Varia lasted 7 hours (I left it on during lunch). On the way home, the traffic was much heavier and the alerts became almost constant, rendering it much less useful.
The lack of lane advice is disappointing, so I'm going to try the Trek CarBack. The advertising for that clearly states it give lane information. Will have to see how accurate it is.
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Cheers, Mike
-Stupid hurts....ride safe
Cheers, Mike
-Stupid hurts....ride safe
Last edited by PromptCritical; 05-14-24 at 04:38 PM.
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#60
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The Varia detects and track vehicles based on closing speed. It cannot distinguish which lane an approaching vehicle is in; no rear facing bike radar in the market can. Implementing this additional capability would require either (a) the radar to sweep back and forth and a processor to calculate the resulting differences in the Doppler shifts or (b) adding a rear facing camera and a processor to correlate the respective data stream from the radar and the camera.
#61
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The Varia detects and track vehicles based on closing speed. It cannot distinguish which lane an approaching vehicle is in; no rear facing bike radar in the market can. Implementing this additional capability would require either (a) the radar to sweep back and forth and a processor to calculate the resulting differences in the Doppler shifts or (b) adding a rear facing camera and a processor to correlate the respective data stream from the radar and the camera.
Not that I believe much advertising, but a false claim like this would be a huge issue for Trek.
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-Stupid hurts....ride safe
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-Stupid hurts....ride safe
#62
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#63
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The advertising for the Trek Carback expicitly states it can discern which lane the car is in. See minute 1:58 in this video. https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/carback/
Not that I believe much advertising, but a false claim like this would be a huge issue for Trek.
Not that I believe much advertising, but a false claim like this would be a huge issue for Trek.
#64
Junior Member
Check the GPLama youtube channel. He has a thorough review of Trek, Garmin and Bryton together. The lane feature is only on the app, which means you have to use it w/ your phone.
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#65
The advertising for the Trek Carback expicitly states it can discern which lane the car is in. See minute 1:58 in this video. https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/carback/
Not that I believe much advertising, but a false claim like this would be a huge issue for Trek.
Not that I believe much advertising, but a false claim like this would be a huge issue for Trek.
#66
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I am still curious how the Trek CarBack accomplishes the lane or lateral position feature. One can imagine the consequences of getting this wrong.
#67
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You might find this review video useful. He mentions the lateral lane detection on the Trek, but he didn’t think it was effective and that feature only works with the phone app, not cycle computers.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z481-qOzQn0
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z481-qOzQn0
Sounds like the CarBack is bit disappointing. I'll stick with the Varia for now.
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Cheers, Mike
-Stupid hurts....ride safe
Cheers, Mike
-Stupid hurts....ride safe
#68
Yeah, the CarBack doesn’t appear to offer any real world advantages over the similarly priced Varia. despite claims of longer detection range and lane position. The Varia seems more sorted, which is not surprising since it’s now a 3rd gen product. I expect the CarBack will probably improve with updates. In practice they both appear to work almost identically when paired with a Garmin computer.
Last edited by PeteHski; 05-15-24 at 04:06 AM.
#69
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#71
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Soon enough we'll be roped into an agency paid by taxes that monitors pov ground transportation... ATC... Automotive Traffic Control
I don't foresee a free future anytime soon...
I don't foresee a free future anytime soon...
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#72
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Yep, that's when my '69 Alfa Romeo becomes my daily driver. Pretty tough to monitor a car with no electronics.
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Cheers, Mike
-Stupid hurts....ride safe
Cheers, Mike
-Stupid hurts....ride safe
#73
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The stock Garmin seatpost mount sucks. I recommend this one: Amazon.com: TUSITA Bike Seat Post Mount Compatible with Garmin Varia RTL510 RTL515 RVR315, Rearview Radar - Round,D Shaped,Aero Seat Post Compatibility : Electronics
#74
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The Varia detects and track vehicles based on closing speed. It cannot distinguish which lane an approaching vehicle is in; no rear facing bike radar in the market can. Implementing this additional capability would require either (a) the radar to sweep back and forth and a processor to calculate the resulting differences in the Doppler shifts or (b) adding a rear facing camera and a processor to correlate the respective data stream from the radar and the camera.
#75
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