High Roller

Like many of you without persecution complexes have related here, the vast majority of my interactions with motorists are cooperative and uneventful. (Yes, the occasional “get on the sidewalk, arsewipe” maybe once every month or two, more often than not from an unfortunate product of our failed public education system whose financial welfare and self-esteem issues would have been better served by a Viagra prescription than by huge monthly payments on a freakishly enormous pickup truck.)

In the last year or so, however, I have observed that this cooperation seems to be breaking down at intersections. Not because drivers are trying to kill me or force me to make a claim on my woefully inadequate medical insurance, but because they are reluctant to assert their right of way! In these increasingly frequent encounters, for example at four-way stops or while making a left turn without a dedicated green turn arrow, I make it clear to them via hand gestures that I will not take their ROW and insist that they clear the intersection before I take my turn. This has become a bit annoying, though, especially when there is other traffic stacking up behind me.

What’s your take on this? Have you observed this phenomenon where you ride? Have motorists suddenly developed some misguided sense of compassion for those of us whose “inferior” method of transportation suggests we must be victims of the current economic hardships? Or are they afraid they will squash us because their recent experiences with an increasing number of cyclists have conditioned them not to trust that we will follow the rules of the road for drivers of vehicles?

Roughstuff

I have noticed it on my bike and on foot. We have crosswalks, with pedestrian crossing "WALK" signals that indicate when it is time to cross. Alot of time there will be a GREEN LIGHT, and I am perfectly capable of waiting for the signal to change so that I can enter the crosswalk when traffic has come to a stop.

But NO NO NO some doogooder moron sees a sign (or hears the 'law') about 'stop for pedestrians in the crosswalk,' and stops. This is ABSOLUTELY worthless, since it is a two lane road and there is no guarantee (nor should there be) that folks in the other lane are gonna come to a stop at what IS, after all, a GREEN LIGHT.

Folks...if ya got the light. GO! If ya got the red, STOP. If you are a pedestrian, wait till ya have the crossing signal. Everything else is an ad hoc nightmare and accomplishes nothing.

I especially hate it when there is ONE SOLITARY car coming and they slow down/stop so that I can walk across the street. In the time it takes them to slow down, and convince me that they mean it and its worth the risk, they could have been SAFELY by, all along.

roughstuff

CbadRider

I have also noticed this trend happening more frequently. I have had drivers get angry at me because I did not take their ROW.

Cyclesafe

+1 on this! Just yesterday as I was turning left into the street from a parking lot, a car travelling opposite to the way I wanted to go actually stopped and waved me through to make a left turn IN FRONT OF THEM. I motioned that they should go ahead, but they motioned me again! WTF!

This was totally crazy. I went ahead, but thought later that I should have just got off my bike and sat on the curb until that person went on her way.

The issue is that cyclists have become so unpredictable (actually predictable in that they nearly always violate the ROTR) that motorists are paralyzed into inaction or driven into a rage. And in my area police give tickets to cyclists only when infractions are beyond the pale - like when I turned left against a red arrow on a screaming downhill. ("But officer, there were no cars anywhere" was ineffective, but "guilty as charged your honor, I have learned my lesson", got the fine reduced in half).

Nearly all of us also drive cars, so we should be aware of this phenomenon.

alhedges

I've noticed this happening a lot more, too. It's kind of a pain, but I don't think it's a problem. I think it means that drivers are realizing that there are bikes on the road, and that the bikes have a right to be there and need to be accomodated.

The problem is just that they don't quite know how to do this. But I'll gladly accept this problem over the problem of drivers not knowing that bikes are on the road, or not accepting that bikes have a right to be there. Over-politeness is, frankly, a problem I'm happy to deal with.

DX Rider

+1 everything that Roughstuff posted. I thought it was just me. I appreciate the fact that they're being courtesy, I hate the fact that sometimes courtesy blinds common sense.

I've had drivers trying to be nice wind up forcing me into a worse predicament trafficwise than if they had just gone on their merry way. If you're in a car and you approach me on the road and I wave you on....please GO!!!

dougmc

Many cyclists do run through red lights and stop signs when they can do so without getting hit. Even if it inconveniences others.

They may just not be willing to take the risk that you're one of those people. Personally, I'd say the best you can do is wave and go. Or wave them through, your choice.

duke_of_hazard

Not sure what you mean by this. I find edyots exist in all classes of society in equal proportions. Having said that, I do think BMW drivers are the worse,

kyle16

+1

I have noticed this for the past year or so. Yes, it is annoying, at least they see you.

It is up to cyclists to make sure to keep ourselves safe. Sometimes, I will take their courtesy (such as at 4 way stops and they are waving me on), but sometimes I won't (going straight through a green light when a car is waiting for you to pass on the right so then they can turn right). Above all else, I try to keep myself safe, no matter who is being courteous or not.

Also, as some other people were saying, there are a lot of cyclists that are horrible on the road. There are many that take advantage of people's courtesy or just expect people to wait on them. I do not know if anyone will agree with me, but it seems as though riders on the San Francisco Peninsula are far worse than even in the Silicon Valley or Marin County.

Kevrob

- https://www.onlinetrafficschoolguide....ving_laws.html

Just this morning I was approaching a 4-way stop, with a lady in an SUV nearing the stop line to my immediate left. It was plain to me that she was going to reach the intersection first, therefore she would have the ROW. I was slow-rolling and about to put my foot down, so I waved her through. It could be that, since I was on her right, she figured I had the ROW.

I believe many people don't know the rules for proceeding at a 4-way stop. Some are overcautious as a result, while others take the point of view that the universe is ordered for their sole convenience, and do whatever the hell they think will serve them best.

Yesterday afternoon I was ready to turn left onto the 2-lane state highway from a full stop, having signaled. Across the street, at a 45º angle, was another road with a STOP sign. A fellow was going to turn right onto the same road I was about to use. He would have had the ROW, except:

• I had reached the intersection first, and

• He hadn't come to a full stop.

I, in the midst of my turn, extended my right hand and arm in the universal sign for hey, waitaminute buddy! He slowed and nodded at me, and I swung into the right third of the lane.

Did I mention that this intersection is right in front of the town green, behind which is the town hall, complete with police station? You'd think that people would mind their P's and Q's where they are most likely to get ticketed, but, sadly, they are often oblivious.

Kevin

nelson249

I have noticed this is well. Oftentimes I time my rolling up to an intersection based on the assumption that the driver will take their ROW. It is a little frustrating when they sit and stare at me but I can deal with it much easier than a driver ruthlessly cutting me off when it is my turn to go.

I would far rather deal with the occasional overly cautious driver thanks very much.

noisebeam

They generally don't trust that there is a predictable cyclist behavior.

I very rarely, perhaps 1-2x per year have this issue when cycling. I communicate my intent consciously with traditional hand signals lane position and perhaps unconsciously via body language.

As a pedestrian if I am in a situation where don't want traffic to stop at a cross walk, but instead prefer to wait for a gap, I will stand far back from the roadway away from curb and only approach when I want traffic to stop for me.

ghettocruiser

If they insist on giving me their ROW, I'll take it with an appreciative wave.

If they want to forcibly take my ROW, I'll wave with fewer fingers.

I've been conditioned to assume they won't follow the rules of the road either, and act accordingly.

High Roller

Even if their intentions are good, I am very reluctant to do this because a) it reinforces their belief that cyclists are a disadvantaged and inferior lot who need special concesions and are incapable of following the rules of the road, and b) they may be unaware of other things going on in the traffic environment, such as a vehicle that speeds around from behind and clobbers me after I accept their gracious offer to go first. Don't let them kill you with kindness. I and nobody else am responsible for my survival out on the road and predictability trumps courtesy every time.

rwp

That's exactly what the guy in the car is thinking - "That dude on the bike might wait his turn but is just as likely to dart out in the middle of the intersection at any time. Better to just wave him through and be sure."

127.0.0.1

I never ever let a motorist give up their ROW for me. I will ignore them or ride backward or something to get them to shove off. ONE time I took the bait I got creamed by an impatient motorist going around the ROW yielder.


upsetting the natural rotation and order of ROW...death awaits.

TwoShort

This drives me crazy.
Jerks who do not respect my right of way are worse, of course, but aren't actually that common.

But every other time I come up to a 4 way stop with a car that was there way before me, and obviously has the right of way, they don't move. I slow down, nothing. I stop and put a foot down, nothing. Look questioningly at them and shrug... and a hand comes out to wave me along. By which time another car has come up from another direction, and who knows what they're going to do.

I just want to sit every driver down and say, look, I know you're trying to be nice, but just go when it's your turn. I can't tell if you're waiting for me to go when it's not my turn, or distracted by your cell phone and about to cream me. I've got to be prepared for the possibility of you following the rules of the road, so just do that and don't make me deal with another option too.

unterhausen

taking the ROW against the rules of the road is dangerous. Most of the time there is some jerk behind the "courteous" motorist that is going to do something aggressive and dangerous. I generally refuse to go when someone waves me through.

sd_mike

AARRGGH! There is one intersection, just a block from my place, this happens to me most frequently. I know why too. Most every other cyclists just runs the stop sign, without even slowing. So, when I approach, to stop, they don't seem to think I will, and yes, will try to wave me through. Sad. I've also had people try to wave me through an intersection - WHILE THEY WERE ROLLING THROUGH THE STOP! Do I really have STUPID on my forehead? I don't go when they wave, regardless of what my mode of transport is.

hairnet

I find that I get waved at more often when I track stand. Usually when I put my foot on the ground they will go but some of them still insist I go. I hate the confusion it creates, especially when another car approaches. Sometimes I just feel like yelling out "GO! YOU GOT HERE FIRST!"

have you ever been honked at, from behind, while waiting in an intersection when you clearly did not have the right of way?

Cyclaholic

It must be nice cycling in your universe. Here in my universe drivers are slowly but surely getting worse.

IbikezLA

are you talking intersections or taking that quote out of context?

JohnBrooking

Drives me nuts, too. I have found that a slight head movement indicating their forward direction, and mouthing "go", as I put my foot down, is sometimes effective, and easier than waving.

cooker

Twice last summer my good behaviour almost got other cyclists hurt. It was the same both times. I stopped at a stop sign and stubbornly waited for the car on the cross street which had the right of way, to go first. On both occasions they hesitated, then gingerly started forward, only to have to jam on the brakes as a cyclist coming from behind me blew through the stop sign and intersection, inches from the car bumper.

hairnet

HA speaking of the devil