urbanknight

I lost count on how many threads he has come in to sing his praises for Rema. It actually makes me want to try it, but I switched to tubeless and haven't had to patch a tube since.

urbanknight

That makes sense, and would indeed suggest Rema has a better, success ensured product. I just think it's disingenuous to claim that the other products are not "long lasting", especially seeing how many other people have patches that hold up for years. Just say it's harder to use properly and be done with it.

pdlamb

I can't say I agree with this characterization. I've used the same tube preparation for decades with glues from Rema, Slime, Park, no-name patch kits, and even Elmer's Rubber Cement. I've only had a couple fail. One failed because I missed the hole -- user error, not attributable to whatever glue I was using at the time. The other was a cut that was too big for the patch I had -- again, not a glue failure.

FWIW, missing that tiny hole was what led me to buy a couple silver Sharpies to mark the leak.

cyccommute 

Not from that, no. Several years of personal use along with several years of research on how cold vulcanization works and the chemistry behind it are what have lead me to use Rema exclusively. I have been using them exclusively for more than 30 years so the experience at the co-op was confirmation of what I already knew. By the way, I haven’t said the others don’t “work”, they just don’t work as well nor as permanently.

cyccommute 

Your comments make me conclude that you have no idea what goes into something you say is “simple”. I assure you that cold vulcanization is anything but “simple”. Just because you can go and buy something without thinking about what went into making it doesn’t mean that someone else…or many someone elses…didn’t spend a whole lot of time thinking about it. Nor should you assume that just because someone copied the look of some product, that it is equivalent to the people who actually put a whole lot of time and effort into designing the original. The patches you buy at HellMart are analogous to the bicycles you buy at HellMart and you should expect similar results.

cyccommute 

The comments completely agree with each other. I have tired different patch kits at various times including when I first started bicycling seriously 40+ years ago. Sometimes when I haven’t had a choice and especially early on in my bicycling experience when I didn’t know better. I’ll admit that I have botched my share of patch jobs even with Rema patches but if a patch is going to fail even when applied properly, it’s going to be the one that is not Rema, in my experience.

GhostRider62

I did not get a single flat last year and not a single one this year until a 600k ride recently when I had two. The problem was my sealant had dried out in 3 weeks? Due to heat? Or heavy miles? I threw the tire away although the dynaplug worked fine.

urbanknight

I think I get what you're saying, but it's my contention that if a patch is "applied properly", it won't fail. Setting that aside, would it be fair to say that your experience is that Rema is much more reliable and fool proof?

urbanknight

Mine have mostly been because I didn't get the patch to lay flat before the glue set. I did miss the hole once myself. But yes, every patch that has ever failed on me was because I did something not quite right. Silver Sharpie is a great idea.

cyccommute 

Let me put it a different way. Would you suggest to someone that they just go and buy a bike a Walmart because the bike is just as good as the bike you purchase at a bike shop? Would you suggest people use Sunrace rear derailer instead of a Shimano because it works the same way and is just as good? Or even suggest that they buy a Shimano Tourney as a replacement for Dura Ace or XTR because they are both “just derailers”? The reason we use Shimano or SRAM or even MicroShift is because the companies have built reputations based on durability that make the extra cost worthwhile. Rema sits in a similar place. The patches work. The patches work well and consistently. They have build a reputation based on that. Other patch kits simply are as consistent.

jadmt

I have used both Rema and Park (with the tube of vulcanizing fluid) with equal success 100%. I have never had a patch fail but have never used the peel and stick ones.

urbanknight

Apples to oranges. You specifically said "long lasting" and I specifically said that every patch I properly applied has lasted for as long as the rest of the tube was useable. Like I said, it still sounds like Rema is a better product, but claiming others will fail, or peel, or otherwise don't last long, just doesn't sound right to me and what I have experienced. YMMV.

urbanknight

I had peel and stick ones fail after about a year of being fine on the bike, then someone on this forum mentioned that I wasn't burnishing them properly. That seemed to solve it for at least a couple of years before I stopped using tubes. Just to be safe though, I carry a brand new tube in my seat bag just to avoid any surprises should I need it.

jadmt

I don't think it would be possible to peel this patch off without tearing the inner tube. could be wrong I guess.

daviddavieboy

I am going to assume this is NOT road tubeless ? What kind of sealant are you using? I have one bike set up as tubeless now (650x 45 tires) but recently switched one of my road bikes to tubeless using stans sealant.

I have had those peel and stick patches fail just on the ride home after a flat and NEVER had one successfully work for an extended time on a road bike. I always carry a tube as well on my tubeless bike. I had a tire blow off the rim on a very hot day 100km from home and the spare tube saved my ride.

tomato coupe

Your opinion on patches is analogous to there being only one good brand of bike, period.

Trakhak

Opinions on patch kit reliability from a guy who deals with a hundred or more patching jobs per year in a co-op are statistically meaningful. Opinions from people who patch tubes maybe five times a year, somewhat less so.

tomato coupe

1. Not relevant to my comment.
2. The total number of patches applied by all the other people also makes it statistically meaningful.

urbanknight

FWIW I am at 5 months on Orange Seal Endurance after having regular Orange Seal dry up in about 4 weeks on my road bike.

cyccommute 

If all bikes were like HellMart bikes and there was only one brand that was significantly better, your analogy would hold. But bikes aren’t like that so it doesn’t.

tomato coupe

That was your analogy, not mine.

cyccommute 

It’s somewhat relevant to your comment. But, more importantly, how much have you studied the chemistry of cold vulcanization? I’ve been responding to these kinds of posts since at least 2008. I started looking up the chemistry of the process since I first started responding. That’s the better part of 20 years of studying the process. Vulcanization can occur in natural rubber without accelerators but it can’t in man made polymer part. That needs sulfur and even with sulfur, the process is slow. Adding accelerators makes the process much quicker. The accelerators are listed in SDS documents and, as part of my studies, I’ve looked at a lot of SDS documents for various patch kits. The only SDS that lists an accelerator is Rema. There is a difference.

Additionally, a whole lot of people don’t patch tubes because they have had a high rate of failure of the patch. They feel that the process is a useless exercise. I haven’t looked at every single failure for the millions of punctures out there but I’m reasonable certain that the vast majority of people who have failed to get a tube patched properly aren’t using Rema’s system. They may have made other mistakes, of course, and Rema isn’t immune to that problem. However, the chances of success are vastly increased using Rema’s two part accelerator system.

tomato coupe

The majority of patches sold are not Rema, therefore you would expect the majority of patch failures to occur with brands other than Rema.

cyccommute 

So, I take it your silence on the chemistry speaks volumes. When you’ve done a little bit of study on the cold vulcanization, come back and we’ll talk. Right now all you are saying is “you are wrong because you are Cyccommute.”

tomato coupe

I'm saying that I, like many others, have had very good success with many brands of patches. Accelerants may be useful, but I think you're obsessed with a detail that makes little practical difference.