K'Tesh

My recent experience with a terrible driver went like this:

I'm riding in the bikelane, on the beachside road in Yantai, China (Shandong Province). The bikelanes are really wide, and I've found that if I ride to the right, cars will routinely pass other cars on the right (driving in my lane), danger close to me. So, I've taken to taking my lane, to its fullest. That didn't work so well, so I add a "drunken" weave to the mix when I see (in my rearview mirror) cars approaching. Drivers typically then won't try to pass me in my own lane as they don't know if I'm drunk, stoned, or disabled somehow, but then exceptions occur.

I'm riding along, and I see two buses slowing a long chain of cars down in my rearview, and I begin my drunken weave. Sure enough, ASSHAT decides to try to pass other cars by going in my lane. He hits the horn, and I slow down. He hits the horn again, I slowed to a crawl. Then another car joins in behind him, adding to the din. All the other drivers close ranks locking these two turkeys in behind me. I kept riding as if I couldn't hear the horns of the trapped drivers, and watched as they lost their hard won lane positions to cars that didn't try to pass on the right. Those drivers were so pissed, and I was all smiles.

I wish more cyclists would stand their ground here.

I'm tempted to get a shirt that has a message on the back that reads (in perfectly grammatical Chinese)

"Bicycle is equipped with two speeds.
Honk to see slow."

Or

"The louder/longer you honk
the slower I go"

Daniel4

Every once in a while someone honks at me. When hundreds of other motorists are able to change lanes or pass me with plenty of room I know what this honker wants to do when I'm already on the right half of the lane.

I don't slow down. Instead I move towards the middle sometimes going to the left of the lane. Message is conveyed. Honking usually stops. He's not going to squeeze by me. He has to follow or properly change lanes to pass.

Chuck Naill

I've found myself doing the same. By blowing the horn I know the driver sees me.

BBassett

Behaviour like this will very often lead to an escalation on the part of the aggressive drive. I would guess that most of us have done it at one time or another... Know that we are in the Right! Absolutely in the Right. And then do something that can end up testing our "Cosmic Right" against the weight of a car and it's idiot driver. I say, idiot because I can only see him or her from my perspective Yes! there are crazy chics out there too! I don't care why he is being aggressive. Recently deceased wife, dropped a 12-pack at the Quik-e-Mart, lost a multi-billion $ deal at work, her puppy pee'ed on her Unicorn collection, yadda, yadda, yadda. I don't care. All I care about it not getting injured. The rider ALWAY loses. A Huge Win is to not be hurt when dealing with an aggressive human driving a car. Taking a "corrective action" like slowing down only makes thing worse. Wave a hand to let them know you are aware of them, and then follow the laws of the area you are riding in while you continue on your way. Take possession of as much of the road's surface (within the law) as you need to ride safely and ride as predictably as possible. Follow the law. There are places in the world that flipping someone off can get you cited, or worse. If someone brushes up against you while riding and you chase them down finally, a knock on the back window with a fist-sized rock from 20 feet away will probably turn into a losing he-said-she-said thing with a cop that only sees the last few seconds of the encounter. Regardless of your Cosmic Right. It can be hard to ride smooth and straight sometimes. Winds, bad weather, riding surface, heavy loads, Sharps and Debris lining the roads, dead skunk. Lots of things will make a rider dart in some apparently random direction. We riders do everything we can to minimize that and be consistent. Hopefully being more predictable to the driver. He's the one in control of the lethal weapon. If the person actually seems dangerous then stop and let them leave or ride away where they can't follow. Personal vid cameras are great for determining fault and for use during litigation. But it's best to stop it before an injury occurs. An outer jacket with large lettering stating, "You are being videoed" might even work better. But that may just enrage a woman that just lost her entire Unicorn collection, who knows?. Doesn't matter she's an "idiot".

Daniel4

In terms of K'Tesh, the OP and myself, we were all following the law. In K'Tesh's situation, the motorists illegally entered the bike lane to illegally pass on the right the slow moving traffic.

What you are recommending is for cyclists to yield to bad driving - thus encouraging bad drivers to continue this sort of activity. Why is bad driving an acceptable norm?

In all three cases, the bad drivers see the cyclists and are following or harrassing. The collision scenario is when the drivers don't see the cyclists or the drivers are maniacs determined to run us down. In this latter case no cyclist would stand a chance even after taking your advice and getting completely off the road.

acidfast7

Or, leave the US and that gun-toting nonsense behind.

Also, the cycling infrastructure is better over here.

BBassett

Yes Daniel, I am recommending you yield to an unpredictable and/or aggressive driver operating a multi-thousand-pound potential weapon. If you can't understand; follow the local road laws, defuse the situation, take possession of whatever amount of the road surface as necessary to ride safe, document/report incident to local authorities, then it seems to be you that is encouraging this type of behavior to continue.

BBassett

When mankind becomes civilized enough to control himself... the only thing guns are good for besides hunting food is protecting himself from his own government. Being English you can't even begin to understand this, but your great great grandfather would have. It was 1919 when the English government started it's crackdown on privately owned weapons and passed its first sweeping anti-gun laws (under the smokescreen of crime control) even though gun-related crime was almost nonexistent in the England of the day. But I am sure that the 100,000 cameras you have recording your every move make you feel safer. England is really good at being able to find out, after the fact, who was responsible for an incident.

As far as thinking England has a better bike infrastructure than the U.S., lol, keep telling yourself that. But, we all agree that you live in a really cute passive little shoe box.

no motor?

"Knowing" Ktesh from previous posts where he mentioned being highly visible due to lights, reflectors and bright colored clothing I would guess he was pretty obvious to the drivers.

BBassett

One aspect that makes things difficult in discussions like this is that we are comparing apples to oranges. Riding a bike in China is hard to compare to riding in the U.S., or any other country probably. Same as trying to compare riding in the city, or suburbs, to rural riding, or open country. We all have different environments and obstacles to deal with that are unique to our locations.

acidfast7

I was born in America, went through a Ph.D. there, and became faculty over here, by choice, not by necessity as I had offers (and still have) in the states. Thanks for the history lesson. Based on your penchant for firearms, you made a wise decision; unless you've only lived in one country, in that case I feel sorry for you as you have no baseline for comparison ... but as they say, ignorance is indeed bliss.

The UK has excellent cycling infrastructure.

Also, I'm quite happy with the drivers over here even compared to Germany, CPH and Sweden. Noticing cyclists is quite important during the education of a driver.

Also, after getting some of your personal history, I see why you hate me so much.

Happy New Year / Gott nyt aar / Guten Rutsch

BBassett

I'm not really sure why it matters where you were born for the frame of this conversation, but.... ok. Congrats?!?! Ditto on your education and need to feel desired or sought after, or at least your need to let us know that you think you are. <wink wink> You are perfectly welcome for the lesson. I can go into much greater detail but I figured you wouldn't have bothered to actually read it all anyway. I have resided in 4 different countries (multiple years in each) so far, and feel comfortable with my "baseline" when discussing bike riding. As far as ignorance, I will have to bow to your knowledge on that topic and to the bliss you derive from it. Not sure what scale you are using when you say Excellent in describing Great Britain's biking infrastructure. Non-existant, to Bad, to Average, then Excellent? I have seen and ridden some of it while visiting and it's just fine. But then GB is the size of Oregon. America's biking infrastructure is fine too, eeeeerrrrr, I mean, Excellent... just not confined to a such a small footprint.

Two things that you have (also) gotten completely incorrect is that I don't have a love or passion for firearms in the least. I am extremely adept at their operation and employment, however. Akso your mildly paranoid feelings of "hatred" from me are misplaced. I don't know you. How, and Why, would I possibly harbor feelings of hatred against a non-entity? I agree wholeheartedly that drivers need to be able to see bike riders and understand our rights and needs, to become better educated. Just not sure why you stated the obvious.

Oh.... yeah! What was the "wise decision" I made? And should I feel sorry for you for only living in two countries, if that's the case?

acidfast7

At least you're conversing now. Four countries for multiple years is still somewhat low on the spectrum but I'm willing to engage with someone that has that experience.

Why give me the UK history lesson? It's condescending.

BBassett

Willing to engage, how terribly terrible kind of you... ahhhhhhhhhhhh, nah. But when you want another lesson ring-me-up Chap.


Number of Rohloffs ridden every day 1

mcours2006

Sheesh! Such hostility!!!

alan s 

Trouble finds those who seek it.

He that diligently seeketh good procureth favour: but he that seeketh mischief, it shall come unto him.

https://www.biblestudytools.com/prov...7-compare.html

BBassett

That's what I thought! And on This topic to boot.

acidfast7

Cool. I had one in Germany, when I moved the the UK, I decided to slum it like the rest of the peasants in the British Empire.

At least you're conversing in a pleasant manner rather than attacking me.

Keep it up and we could be friends.

PatrickGSR94

If that's the case then why do the huge majority of cyclist videos of bad drivers on YouTube seem to be coming out of the UK?

acidfast7

Selection bias by the viewer.

And, if you can only type bicycle in English, you're going to the get the most dense English-speaking country resulting in the "majority" being from the UK.

Also, YouTube isn't the most used video sharing website on the planet.

So, again, selection bias by the viewer.

Bike Gremlin

Why are you defending them?!?! They even drive on the wrong side of the road!

mcours2006

You mean they drive on the right side of the road?

Bike Gremlin

If left side is the right one, then what's left to those riding on the right side?

mcours2006

The right side is still the right side.

Bike Gremlin

Not in England!