Less torque question
03-13-24, 04:45 PM
#51
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On my old bikes the only thing I really use the torque wrench on are the Crank Bolts. But if I was routinely working on some of these newer high cost bikes, made with proprietary exotic materials and alloys I would probably invest in a higher quality type wrench...
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03-13-24, 07:14 PM
#52
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For most bike things, you can get by without a torque wrench. But it helps, usually you are a convert if one time you strip threads, or something comes loose. People tend to overtorque small screws and undertorque big ones. My external bottom bracket cups, the kit had no torque specs, nor could I find any online (for any ISO External on BSA/English threading), and using the 4-in-1 cup wrench, I gave it a good umph, what felt right. A onesie cup wrench that took a square socket, would have allowed using a torque wrench, but even now with my search, can't find a torque spec online. Same for the clamping bolts on the left HT2 crank arm (which came loose, so I gave it harder torque, putting a small copper pipe around the allen wrench, not for more leverage, but wider grip area to protect my hand. What I should have done is looked up standard torques for that bolt thread size; Next time I loosen those to adjust out slack and impart bearing preload, I'm gonna do that.).
03-17-24, 01:58 PM
#53
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There's no need to get sarcastic. While there may be some jobs where close adhesion to torque specs is important, the reality is that most jobs are far more forgiving, and torquing by "calibrated hands" is fine.
We might also note that there are two types of published torque specs. Some may be critical with limited margin for error, while most are simply a way of offering guidance, since things like "hand tight" don't make the grade anymore.
There's also a cultural difference. For decades, mechanics learned hands on from more experienced mechanics, with knowledge passing from generation to generation this way.
Some time back, along with the creation of the internet, how we learn changed, and folks needed to communicate info like how tight is right in different ways, not dependent on the old one to one method.
So, I suspect we have s cultural divide based on when and how each of us learned. I, for one, am not invested in how anyone does any job, as long as they do it well.
We might also note that there are two types of published torque specs. Some may be critical with limited margin for error, while most are simply a way of offering guidance, since things like "hand tight" don't make the grade anymore.
There's also a cultural difference. For decades, mechanics learned hands on from more experienced mechanics, with knowledge passing from generation to generation this way.
Some time back, along with the creation of the internet, how we learn changed, and folks needed to communicate info like how tight is right in different ways, not dependent on the old one to one method.
So, I suspect we have s cultural divide based on when and how each of us learned. I, for one, am not invested in how anyone does any job, as long as they do it well.
03-17-24, 09:01 PM
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However, learning to work on bikes (or other stuff) is like navigating. GPS navigation. apps are fine, and super helpful for getting around in unfamiliar territory. But there are two ways to use them. You could simply n follow the turn by turn getting to your destination, but that's all you'll get. Or you could look around as you drive, noting street names and landmarks, so you not only get there, buy have a sense of territory to help you for bext time. Eventually, the unfamiliar becomes familiar, and reliance on GPS fades.
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03-17-24, 09:32 PM
#56
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Mine has lb-in on one side, metric in Kg-cm on the other, I think newer ones may be in N-m, differing by the grav accel. Looking now, digital torque adaptors are now $40. Don't see one for low torques, but I'm sure they will have eventually.
03-18-24, 02:36 PM
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No one, or at least not me, is arguing against torque wrenches or published torque specs. I thought my post, which you referenced, was clear on that point.
However, learning to work on bikes (or other stuff) is like navigating. GPS navigation. apps are fine, and super helpful for getting around in unfamiliar territory. But there are two ways to use them. You could simply n follow the turn by turn getting to your destination, but that's all you'll get. Or you could look around as you drive, noting street names and landmarks, so you not only get there, buy have a sense of territory to help you for bext time. Eventually, the unfamiliar becomes familiar, and reliance on GPS fades.
However, learning to work on bikes (or other stuff) is like navigating. GPS navigation. apps are fine, and super helpful for getting around in unfamiliar territory. But there are two ways to use them. You could simply n follow the turn by turn getting to your destination, but that's all you'll get. Or you could look around as you drive, noting street names and landmarks, so you not only get there, buy have a sense of territory to help you for bext time. Eventually, the unfamiliar becomes familiar, and reliance on GPS fades.
The GPS thing... and apologies for drifting... I agree totally. I love GPS when I'm in a strange place, it really works. But you never really get a feel for how you get there or how the area/city/whatever is actually laid out for general navigation.
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03-18-24, 06:41 PM
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Sorry if I misattributed that.
The GPS thing... and apologies for drifting... I agree totally. I love GPS when I'm in a strange place, it really works. But you never really get a feel for how you get there or how the area/city/whatever is actually laid out for general navigation.
The GPS thing... and apologies for drifting... I agree totally. I love GPS when I'm in a strange place, it really works. But you never really get a feel for how you get there or how the area/city/whatever is actually laid out for general navigation.
For example, if a crank bolt torque is published as 12nm, is that simply a guide, or does it have to be 12nm, with 13-14 being too high and 10-11 too low.
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An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.
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An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.
Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.
“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN
WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
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