Schweinhund

I'll be honest, I've been ticking people off my whole life. If Bill wants to be offended by the way I choose my words, then that's his choice.
Same with Ignore.
I am who I am and I don't ignore anyone. Yes, some people annoy me, but they bring something to the table anyway.
I appreciate intelligence, and some people who are intelligent sometimes say things that aren't but that doesn't make them any less of a resource.
I've been known to fight people, and then turn around and defend them.
I have haters and fans, pick a side.
Either way I'm going to keep doing what I do, I'm too old to change now.

Schweinhund

Perspective my friend, perspective. If someone hasn't bought a hand machined product before, it can seem pricy.
That is until you realize you never had to buy another.

Dave Mayer

At the Co-op I wrench at, we see at least one broken axle per week, but then we deal with a lot of old and abused wheels. But recently, current bikes are showing up with axle breaks, such as cheap suspension MTBs with disc brakes. Or last month, a new tandem. And about the same time a 7-speed E-bike that must have weighted 100 pounds. Seriously?? Are bike manufacturers so cheap and short-sighted that they are spec'ing cheap freewheels on cheap freewheel hubs on bikes with high loads and now high torques plus loads? Rhetorical question: clearly they are.

So for the mechanics out there: prepare to see a new rush of broken axles and subsequently mangled up rear hubs as the riders continue on with broken axles until the rear wheel seizes-up solid. We see the aftermath of this regularly: you open up the rear hub to find metal slurry that used to be ball bearings. Cones and cups are destroyed.

BTW: Campagnolo vintage axles have a different threading than almost everyone else, so your cones and locknuts would not even thread on.

smd4

I spent $100 on a titanium rear axle. So yeah, from my perspective, $40 is cheap.

Dave Mayer

Go to your local bike Co-op where they will have a bucket-o-axles in every weird size and length possible. We do. We sell them for $1 used and $5 for new fancy ones. Make sure the used ones roll straight.

We have dozens of 145mm long 10mm hollow axles for rear quick-release hubs, the most common size. If 145mm is too long, then 5 minutes with a hacksaw fixes it.

No Co-op? Then beg and scavenge the parts from the wrecked wheel collection at the back of you local shop. This is one of the reasons why Shimano hubs are so great: spare parts everywhere.

abdon 

I guess you missed the part where I said garden variety ones sell for under $10 all day long on Amazon. So yes, $40 is more expensive than $10.

maddog34

Got any Sansin RE-50 Sealed Bearing QR axles in stock?? because, without further information from Albon, that would be a safe bet on what Axle and Hub we should be speculating about here....

personally, i'd whack that bent toad with my 3 lb. deadblow a couple times and slip it back in the hub.

oh, and the Alyeska is a much loved 1984 Touring bike with 6 speeds.. any guess as to the O.L.D. on that hub?

my guess is 126mm, most likely.

smd4

Sorry. Guess I was confused by the part where you said you wanted something better than a $10 axle.

Schweinhund

My good sir, not to offend, but he's right. The 40 dollar axle is cheap.
I GAY RON TEE you you're going to bend your new axle. and probably another.
Each time you have to disassemble, reassemble, adjust.
The 40 dollar axle isn't just an axle, it is a defacto superior product.
You will most probably never have to replace it once done.

abdon 

You really seem to struggle with this whole reading comprehension bit. Yes, I would expect a $40 part to be better than one that costs $10. But because we live in a world where $10 parts are just beefed up with $30 worth of branding I figure I would ask people that play with vintage equipment.

smd4

Are you not comprehending what people are saying about the higher quality of the more expensive axle?

abdon 

I am. Do you see me needlessly arguing with them? So far, as pointed out here, the better manufacturer of freewheel axles is Wheels Manufacturing. Which based on people here and other places do use better steel, better heat treatment, and better thread cutting, for a better product.

smd4

Yeah, I kinda do. Seems like you’re spending a lot of time coming up with reasons not to spend the $40 bucks.

abdon 

Your lack of reading comprehension strikes again. I'm the one looking to pay more for a better quality axle, not the other way around.

smd4

So have you ordered one yet?

oldbobcat

I rode nothing but freewheel bikes from 1970 until 2005. Never broke and axle, but I bent a couple, especially when using Normandy hubs. These were all with 120 and 126 mm hub spacing. If yours is 130 mm or wider, then yeah, a freehub wheel might be a better idea. But I've replaced many broken axles on inexpensive hybrids and never had one come back. The trick is to make sure the drive-side locknut is good and TIGHT. And just to be safe, check the wheel for wobble once in a fortnight or two.

And yeah, you can order axle-cone-locknut sets directly from wheelsmfg.com, or if you're unsteady about taking things apart and measuring, your local bike shop can measure and order for you.

abdon 

I don't foresee having any issues, I don't plan on loading this bike all that much nor riding it all that hard. All I was asking about was for a quality part mostly out of principle, I'm happy with the Wheels Manufacturing axle I just got.

For my Trek 720 I built a wheelset with Velocity Dyad rims, 36 spokes laced 4 cross, rear on a Shimano XTR hub, front on a Son dynamo hub. The Velocity Dyad is an incredibly strong rim, this build is as bulletproof as it gets; If I have to carry a heavy load that's the bike I would use. I don't think I'll get around to load this Raleigh all that much.

icemilkcoffee 

If axles are always bending right behind the cone, then why don't they make the cone longer? ie. extend out the nose of the cone? It's such an obvious solution I'm surprised nobody came up with it except me,

smd4

Well, that would make one of you…

Schweinhund

That would b one long assed cone and wouldn't help because the fulcrum point essentially remains the same. the inside point of the cone.
Free hubs spread the bearings wider, less drive side leverage. making a longer cone leaves the bearings located inward, same problem..

Hondo6

Pretty sure it actually makes the problem worse.

In the case of a hub cone, I'm reasonably sure the fulcrum points are the edges of the cone (the rest of the cone provides support to the axle). For a freewheel or Shimano freehub cone, this should produce a significant bending moment at the nose of the DS cone (see this linked article by the late Jobst Brandt for discussion of four-bearing design hub variants, which he assessed to have a weak spot issue in virtually the same place). Since the threads almost always will extend at least slightly past the inboard nose of the cone on a cup/cone bearing, you also have a coincident stress riser due to the threads.

A longer nose on a freewheel cone would thus move the fulcrum point inboard further. This would seem to me to be a Very Bad Idea.

gna

Yes.

They were made for Raleigh USA, most likely by Giant in Taiwan. Not a BSO or box store bike.

I have a Wyoming that I have been bringing up to higher standard (triple, better brakes, better wheels) and it does handle a load well.

OP, I had a problem with my rear hub, so I built up some new wheels. If I saved the axle you're welcome to it. I'll look for it this weekend.

abdon 

No problems with the rear hub. I just like rebuilding vintage bikes and as such using better components is just a nice touch. I don't know why so many people choose to assume that I wanted the impossible or the very least the unrealistic.

Here's a picture of the work in progress:



You should have seen it with the nasty purple handlebar tape, rubber seat, and dollar store watter bottle cage... I added turkey wing brake levers, sewn leather handlebars, matching leather seat baggy, smooth Honjo aluminum fenders (still fitting them), and bar end shifters. I still need to fabricate the matching leather pedal straps, mud flaps, and other leather bits. I also need a new Brooks saddle so I can match the color, I borrowed this one from another bike so I could ride it for now.

This is not the rack configuration I'm going to end up with, I'm going to set it up more as a randonneuring bike but I want to test it fully loaded. I want to see how it handles compared to my Trek 720. Heck if I was going with this rack I would have to chop the mounts so I could get it about 1.75" lower in the front

I'm also going with a TA Cyclotouriste crank, an Acorn tall rando front bag, and the Japanese market Dia Compe bar end shifters that Rivendell sells.

icemilkcoffee 

Of course the fulcrum point would remain the same. The fulcrum point being the bearing. What is changed, with a long nosed cone, is that the bending point would be moved inwards. When you move the bending point inwards away from the fulcrum point, there is now less leverage to bend the axle.
In other words, you are reinforcing the axle (with a threaded sleeve), right where it is most likely to bend.


The fulcrum(pivot) point is the ball bearing. The F is where the frame drop out is. The W is where the bend occurs. When you move W out further away from the pivot point, guess what, it takes more force to bend the axle.

smd4

Why would anyone ever want to add these to a bike??