Disc brakes are great!
02-13-24, 08:26 PM
#51
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02-13-24, 08:37 PM
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It still isn't enough to put me off disc brakes, but it winds up costing considerably more than rim brakes. For a bike that cost me about $7K 10 years ago, it is noise on the signal, but it isn't completely insignificant.
The one on the top (and one other) aren't worn, but got contaminated on my daughter's bike. I sanded them down and they should have quite a bit of life in them yet.
Last edited by Polaris OBark; 02-13-24 at 08:47 PM.
02-13-24, 08:42 PM
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It’s generally implied in all of these arguments. When you make a comment like “In the last 5-6 years, I've been in two gravel races in which riders have broken their necks - literally - on such descents,” the implication is that rim brakes are dangerous and lead to bad bike handling.
Again, you've not gotten such comments from me, and I've not seen any such comments on bf. Hence I'm not sure why you're bringing them up in this discussion - they're irrelevant, if you read the initial post. They just make you seem a bit defensive.
Last edited by Koyote; 02-13-24 at 09:00 PM.
02-13-24, 08:48 PM
#54
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I've filled at least 3 of those cups in 10 years (along with my wife and 3 kids, but 90% are mine.)
02-13-24, 08:51 PM
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That's a vanishingly trivial amount of money to me, and I suspect to many others.
Whaaa? If you're going through that many disc brake pads, then yeah, you really DO need that much stopping power.
I've been riding discs on two of my bikes for a total of about 38k miles over the past several years. (7 yrs on one bike, 5 on the other.) I think I've replaced two rotors and perhaps 4-5 sets of pads, which is probably what...? A couple hundred bucks? I spent that much on a new pair of bibshorts that should arrive tomorrow.
Whaaa? If you're going through that many disc brake pads, then yeah, you really DO need that much stopping power.
I've been riding discs on two of my bikes for a total of about 38k miles over the past several years. (7 yrs on one bike, 5 on the other.) I think I've replaced two rotors and perhaps 4-5 sets of pads, which is probably what...? A couple hundred bucks? I spent that much on a new pair of bibshorts that should arrive tomorrow.
02-13-24, 08:59 PM
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It's obviously a non-issue. But even if I try to take it seriously, I still think it's a non-issue. I drove my last car 154k miles over 12 years and never touched the hydraulic brake system. I suspect a bike with hydraulic brakes would be just fine after forty years of storage.
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02-13-24, 09:05 PM
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If it has mineral oil. DOT fluid is hygroscopic.
I did notice something odd on my bike. I brought the bike without the rear wheel in the house and put it on the trainer for awhile. Then I took it for an outdoor ride (after replacing the rear wheel, which was hung up in the garage). The front brake squealed, and the back one was as silent as ever. Eventually the front one quieted down, but it makes me think something in the air in the house contaminated the rotor.
I did notice something odd on my bike. I brought the bike without the rear wheel in the house and put it on the trainer for awhile. Then I took it for an outdoor ride (after replacing the rear wheel, which was hung up in the garage). The front brake squealed, and the back one was as silent as ever. Eventually the front one quieted down, but it makes me think something in the air in the house contaminated the rotor.
02-13-24, 09:11 PM
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That's a vanishingly trivial amount of money to me, and I suspect to many others.
Whaaa? If you're going through that many disc brake pads, then yeah, you really DO need that much stopping power.
I've been riding discs on two of my bikes for a total of about 38k miles over the past several years. (7 yrs on one bike, 5 on the other.) I think I've replaced two rotors and perhaps 4-5 sets of pads, which is probably what...? A couple hundred bucks? I spent that much on a new pair of bibshorts that should arrive tomorrow.
Whaaa? If you're going through that many disc brake pads, then yeah, you really DO need that much stopping power.
I've been riding discs on two of my bikes for a total of about 38k miles over the past several years. (7 yrs on one bike, 5 on the other.) I think I've replaced two rotors and perhaps 4-5 sets of pads, which is probably what...? A couple hundred bucks? I spent that much on a new pair of bibshorts that should arrive tomorrow.
Part of this is because I grew up in suburban Chicago and never saw a significant hill before riding in the Coastal CA range. My normal local rides are > 100 ft/mi climbing. I descend like a clinically paranoid grandmother.
02-13-24, 09:12 PM
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Sure, mineral oil.
But what Mr. icemilkcoffee hasn't considered is that rim brake pads would probably dry out and be worthless after forty years in a shed. But again, it's irrelevant since his scenario is ridiculous.
But what Mr. icemilkcoffee hasn't considered is that rim brake pads would probably dry out and be worthless after forty years in a shed. But again, it's irrelevant since his scenario is ridiculous.
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02-13-24, 09:28 PM
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02-13-24, 09:32 PM
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It's obviously a non-issue. But even if I try to take it seriously, I still think it's a non-issue. I drove my last car 154k miles over 12 years and never touched the hydraulic brake system. I suspect a bike with hydraulic brakes would be just fine after forty years of storage.
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02-13-24, 09:35 PM
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02-13-24, 09:41 PM
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...in fairness, Koyote lives in the frozen North. There wasn't a lot of topography in MN when I lived there. But still, that's quite a feat, if true. I've changed out a lot of disc pads on cars, and if there's a way to do it without touching the hydraulic system, I'd love to hear about it. I will pass the tip along to my maintenance staff.
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02-13-24, 09:47 PM
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...in fairness, Koyote lives in the frozen North. There wasn't a lot of topography in MN when I lived there.
02-13-24, 10:07 PM
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The First World bike industry is in trouble. Post-pandemic inventory overhang and dropping sales. Competition from Asia for direct sales to customers, and new groupsets such as Sensah and LTWOO. Internet sales, on even expensive items such as bikes are becoming ubiquitous and accepted by customers.
What the First World bike industry needs to do:
What the First World bike industry needs to do:
- Make bikes difficult to work on for a weekend warrior. Introduce complex proprietary tools for undertaking basic maintenance. Hydraulic discs and electronics are great because they lock most riders back to a shop for what used to be simple maintenance. Internal cable routing: a windfall! It looks kewl and saves 0.001 watts on the road, but it allows a shop to hand a $300 bill to a customer for a stem swap.
- Introduce new transitory ‘features’ on bikes, like aero fins on 1950s cars. Like suspension elements on road bikes. Or discs, which are heavy, fussy and unnecessary.
- Change over the fleet: Introduce different dimensional standards which will render the previous generations of bikes obsolete and useless. Like wheel sizes and widths and attachment standards. Plus different bottom bracket standards and cassette systems. Note the success of how the 26” MTB wheel standard was replaced by the 29-er through a rare coordinated and concerted effort by the entire First World bike industry. Then the 27.5” standard had to be introduced because the 29er was a mistake for many riders. Of course, the industry could never ever go back to 26”. Nope.
- Introduce an integrated supply chain direct from manufacturer to retail customer. Buy up the independents and lock customers into one single brand, particularly for servicing, where the money actually is. There is no money in selling $300 hybrids, but there is profit in selling an expensive bike to a platinum card holder. Then, due to difficult to service proprietary parts, the weekend warrior is locked to you for frequent ‘servicing’ - forever. Basically, a subscription service.
- In addition to changing the bike fleet over frequently by introducing new ‘standards’, also choke off the supply of replacement parts for bikes over 5 years old. Customer walks into a shop looking for a 10-speed derailleur… “This hasn’t been made in 10 years! We cannot source this. Let me show you some newer bikes!”
- Hire a cadre of social media sycophants and influencers to rag on anyone or entity who challenges the above strategy.
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02-13-24, 10:12 PM
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02-13-24, 10:20 PM
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Because it was decided to run the front calipers behind the fork so when you brake, the disc and hence the hub is forced down. And out of traditional dropouts. Not entirely rational engineering. (Sophomore engineering students have the force mapping skills to see this. The bright ones got this by 10th grade on their own.)
02-13-24, 10:28 PM
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Note, to avoid misunderstanding that runs rampant in these threads: I have nothing against disc brakes, and I'm absolutely sure they work better for some riders. No question. I do have two disc brake bikes - one hydraulic and one cable. Both work great, but no better than the rim-brake bike V brake bike that they replaced. Same goes for my wife. I would have gladly bought another rim brake bike for our gravel riding, but I never saw one new.
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02-13-24, 11:01 PM
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02-13-24, 11:37 PM
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To be fair to discs, no. Some disc cost more. Pads last a long time. Personally, I’ve had discs for many years and I have yet to replace a pad set. I don’t even recall having to adjust the pads on any of my disc brake equipped bikes. But I don’t wear out pads on rim brakes either.
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02-13-24, 11:38 PM
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...in fairness, Koyote lives in the frozen North. There wasn't a lot of topography in MN when I lived there. But still, that's quite a feat, if true. I've changed out a lot of disc pads on cars, and if there's a way to do it without touching the hydraulic system, I'd love to hear about it. I will pass the tip along to my maintenance staff.
02-13-24, 11:51 PM
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I neither stated nor implied that those riders were on rim brakes or that rim brakes are dangerous; you may have inferred that, which would be your mistake, not mine. I stated that those incidents reinforced my concern with safe and strong braking power. If you cannot understand the difference between my statement and your confabulation, then I can't help you any further.
Again, you've not gotten such comments from me, and I've not seen any such comments on bf. Hence I'm not sure why you're bringing them up in this discussion - they're irrelevant, if you read the initial post. They just make you seem a bit defensive.
Here is an example of where that bike gets used and it was carrying an extra 40 lbs of gear.
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02-13-24, 11:55 PM
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To be fair to discs, no. Some disc cost more. Pads last a long time. Personally, I’ve had discs for many years and I have yet to replace a pad set. I don’t even recall having to adjust the pads on any of my disc brake equipped bikes. But I don’t wear out pads on rim brakes either.
02-14-24, 12:02 AM
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The First World bike industry is in trouble. Post-pandemic inventory overhang and dropping sales. Competition from Asia for direct sales to customers, and new groupsets such as Sensah and LTWOO. Internet sales, on even expensive items such as bikes are becoming ubiquitous and accepted by customers.
What the First World bike industry needs to do:
What the First World bike industry needs to do:
- Make bikes difficult to work on for a weekend warrior. Introduce complex proprietary tools for undertaking basic maintenance. Hydraulic discs and electronics are great because they lock most riders back to a shop for what used to be simple maintenance. Internal cable routing: a windfall! It looks kewl and saves 0.001 watts on the road, but it allows a shop to hand a $300 bill to a customer for a stem swap.
- Introduce new transitory ‘features’ on bikes, like aero fins on 1950s cars. Like suspension elements on road bikes. Or discs, which are heavy, fussy and unnecessary.
- Change over the fleet: Introduce different dimensional standards which will render the previous generations of bikes obsolete and useless. Like wheel sizes and widths and attachment standards. Plus different bottom bracket standards and cassette systems. Note the success of how the 26” MTB wheel standard was replaced by the 29-er through a rare coordinated and concerted effort by the entire First World bike industry. Then the 27.5” standard had to be introduced because the 29er was a mistake for many riders. Of course, the industry could never ever go back to 26”. Nope.
- Introduce an integrated supply chain direct from manufacturer to retail customer. Buy up the independents and lock customers into one single brand, particularly for servicing, where the money actually is. There is no money in selling $300 hybrids, but there is profit in selling an expensive bike to a platinum card holder. Then, due to difficult to service proprietary parts, the weekend warrior is locked to you for frequent ‘servicing’ - forever. Basically, a subscription service.
- In addition to changing the bike fleet over frequently by introducing new ‘standards’, also choke off the supply of replacement parts for bikes over 5 years old. Customer walks into a shop looking for a 10-speed derailleur… “This hasn’t been made in 10 years! We cannot source this. Let me show you some newer bikes!”
- Hire a cadre of social media sycophants and influencers to rag on anyone or entity who challenges the above strategy.
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