Stosheroo

I've read hundreds of various cycling forum posts about what gravel bikes are and how they're supposed to be built and equipped. I've read just as many posts about whether MTBs or cyclocross bikes or touring bikes or road bikes can be made into or can serve effectively as gravel bikes. At this point, it seems to me that a gravel bike to one person is very often not a gravel bike to someone else. The term 'gravel bike' has been used to describe cycling in so many different riding environments that it's hard to know what it really means.

To some folks, gravel cycling is cycling on dedicated, hard packed gravel trails. To others it's cycling on what many would call mountain bike trails comprised of rocks, ruts, sand, mud and lots of elevation changes. To some, it's fast paced and to others it isn't. These cycling contexts are vastly different from one another. Wouldn't folks who typically ride on rough, rocky, rutted, hilly/mountainous trails be well served with a MTB with 26" wheels? Likewise, wouldn't folks who typically ride graveled rails-to-trails type bike paths and rural gravel roads be well served with a touring bike, a sport-touring bike, or a road bike with appropriately treaded 700c wheels? Perhaps the term 'gravel bike' evolved from a combination of cyclists who want to customize their bikes for the environments they typically ride in. Or, maybe it started with bike manufacturers pursuing increased profits through product differentiation. In any case, I'd be interested in others' thoughts.

Polaris OBark

This again.

mstateglfr 

It is a wide ranging category of bikes. Based on the synopsis of what you've read, you are already aware of this.

zandoval 

Well, a Gravel bike is not a Mountain Bike, or a Road Bike, or a Cross-X Bike, or a Track Bike, or a... Or is it?

10 years ago the bikes I setup to ride around my AO used to be called Gravel Bikes. Just sturdy old steel framed road bikes with heaver tires and maybe a larger freewheel. But now days a Gravel Bike is something different. Oddly they are now so specialized they look quite similar to what we called mountain bikes years ago.

And what about a RAVEL bike. The roads I ride were once paved with asphalt 50 years ago. So they are now mostly light gravel and pot holes. Yep... Now days I have Ravel Bikes... Ha

net-not my pic

https://www.roadbotics.com/2019/10/0...call-raveling/

SoSmellyAir

[Tenet] Gravel biking is riding a drop bar bike on unpaved surface.

Stosheroo

Thanks for confirming.

b88

That’s why I keep trying to convince myself of a need for a gravel bike. I do occasionally ride over unpaved surfaces. 😁

50PlusCycling

Basically a mountain bike disguised as a road bike. And "gravel" actually means "dirt," but since "dirt" is associated with MTB's, and the industry is trying to create a new and popular market to exploit, it's now called "gravel."

All that said, I built a "gravel" bike with a 1x12 drive line, drop bar, disk brakes, etc. And I like it. It's reasonably fast on pavement, smoother and more steady than a road bike, but it's excellent on dirt, sand, grass, etc. It's basically a go-anywhere bike which I use for bike-packing in mixed surface situations.

Noonievut

It depends where you live and the riding surfaces in you area.

Gravel biking, and gravel bikes, are not the same thing.

ScottCommutes

We all know the term was invented by the industry to sell bikes, but the need is legitimate. Mountain bikes have gotten so specialized and so good over the last couple of decades that they are now on trails previously not thought possible on a bike. This has opened up many thousands of miles of milder terrain between the road bike and the mountain bike. Thus, the "gravel bike". The term is actually pretty good because "gravel" implies off-road, but not incredibly steep or uneven. The surface you ride it on doesn't actually have to be gravel.

Edit: Kind of like the "Bridge ices before road" signs replacing "Bridge may be icy", a gravel bike is trying to explain something a little complex in just one simple term. The term by itself doesn't totally make sense.

Stosheroo

"It depends where you live and the riding surfaces in you area."

This makes complete sense to me.

I don't understand why someone would suggest a bike built to handle unique riding conditions is suboptimal or not a 'true' gravel bike if it doesn't conform to their idea of what a gravel bike is supposed to be. To me, then, touring bikes, road bikes, MTBs, and anything in between are gravel bikes if they get us comfortably, efficiently, and safely down the mostly or occasionally unpaved roads and paths we normally ride.

The reason I even posted here is because I'm in the process of building a bike to accommodate my specific riding preferences and conditions but I'm hard-pressed to characterize it with a name. A riding companion introduced me to the term 'gravel bike' only last year. I was confused about what the term meant, and wondered if that was what I wanted to build for myself. Based on responses here, I guess I'm building a 'gravel bike' but all I'm really doing is building the perfect bike for me.

My riding is done exclusively on paved and graveled local bike paths and rural roads. I generally don't ride on MTB trails or single tracks, and I don't race on any surface. The bike I'm putting together is built on a 1988 Trek 520 touring frame I had my LBS add a second set of rear eyelets to. It will have 35-38mm tires on 700c rims with Shimano 105 hubs. The drivetrain is 10-speed 105 with a triple crank. Brakes will be either Tektro Onyx or Shimano BR-CT91 cantis. The bar is a non-rising Jones H-Loop bar to give me a more upright position to accommodate some lower back issues. Shifters are Dura Ace 10-speed bar ends on Paul Thumbies. It isn't going to be an especially responsive bike but I don't need it to be given where I ride. It'll do perfectly for any day rides or shorter tours I might take given my specific riding conditions. It seems some would call it a gravel bike and some wouldn't, and that's fine with me.

stevel610 

It is basically a marketing idea used to sell bikes. The class could've been filled by what were called cyclocross bikes or touring bikes. But allowing more sensible wide tires allows a new classification and marketing campaign.

biker128pedal

Sounds like the perfect tool for your use. If I had your frame I would not be looking for a new bike. During COVID I picked up a Trek 1000C frame. I should have gotten something else for lite touring, gravel (multi surface) rides and smooth trails and road. Oh and bags to go pick up some groceries. My Domane SL6 is not quite here but does road, cyclocross and gravel ride. Alas the 1000C will only accept 30 mm wide tires. The limit is the frame and not the rim brakes. Soma fork added will accept 32mm wide tire. But is is useful on my old fluid trainer. So I need a better tool for my use. Yours would work but it is easier and cheaper for me to buy a new bike that will accept wider tires and has more mounting points and is efficient for the surface conditions.

mstateglfr 

...except it wasn't created by big bike's marketing machine. It really did grow from user demand. And currently, there is now a lot of bleed over between a brand's gravel bike and CX bike so the very thing you mention could have happened has happened in some instances.

mstateglfr 

the need is legitimate, but the industry didn't invent the term or create the demand. Demand existed, bike and component brands slowly offered up options, and those options changed heavily year to year as bike and component brands figured out the market.
Again, that is all happening because users were driving demand, not the industry. The industry was slowly reacting to a want.

Kapusta

“Gravel Biking”, is not a very common term. I almost never hear someone say they are going gravel biking. I would assume it means riding on gravel/dirt roads.

But that is a different question than what a Gravel Bike is, for which the definition is quite liberal. Some Gravel Bikes overlap into what could also be considered Endurance Road Bikes with large tire clearance, others could also be called drop bar mtbs.

Its like “Mountain Bike”. It covers a lot of bike types.

Some gravel bikes (the kind I find most useful) can also be called “All Road”. Meaning just that: good for anything loosely considered a “road” (paved, chip-seal, gravel, dirt)

mstateglfr 

good lord, more nonsense.
This forum used to be so valuable back in 2016-2020. It's a shell of its former self and easy to see why.

- gravel bikes are not mountain bikes disguised as road bikes. First off, what does that even mean? Secondly, some gravel bikes might have geometry and esig. Spec that largely mirrors a mountain bike, but a lot of gravel bikes don't. It's a wide ranging segment and your description misses big time on a lot of bikes.

- 'gravel' doesn't mean 'dirt'. It cam mean that, but it doesn't always or even usually mean that. It can mean gravel and frequently does. It depends on where the bike is ridden and how it's used, but a significant % of people ride gravel bikes on gravel.

- the industry isn't trying to create a market. It existed before the industry cared, the industry responded slowly to market demand, the industry changed its response many times ad it tried to figure out market demand, and the market grew as segmentation occurred.
You have it backwards.




It's 2024- the industry isn't trying to create a gravel market- it already exists and is quite established. Again, this board used to contain actual good discussion. It's littered with basics and ignorance now.

Polaris OBark

We need the obligatory cliché: A gravel bike is a road bike that doesn't suck.

Kapusta

That’s lame. Who came up with that one?

Oops, never mind

Kapusta

That’s lame. Who came up with that one?

Oops, never mind

Kontact 

The industry created the gravel bike in 2013. Before that, people rode all sorts of stuff on gravel - especially hybrids and CX bikes. But those bikes had different geometry, and the CX bikes wouldn't take real large tires. So while you can make lots of older style bikes into gravel bikes, what we call a gravel bike is a combination of geometry and components that didn't really exist before someone started building frames for this purpose, like the 2013 Tripster.

It's a bike. You can do whatever you want on it until something breaks, it won't perform or you get hurt. And that's what people do with gravel bikes, road bikes, CX bikes, MTBs, etc.

mstateglfr 

Salsa Warbird not being mentioned and the Kinesis bike cited is always interesting to me. I don't actually care since I dont have anything vested in one being 'first', but it's still interesting to see when Kinesis is randomly cited.
For what it's worth, the Warbird was being sold before 2013 and various itrrations had been ridden for multiple years in challenging gravel races.
But which was first is really quite unimportant.

More important is the claim that gravel bike geometry didn't exist before purpose built frames were created in 2013. Once again- gravel bikes vary widely in geometry. Given that, which geometry are you referring to? You seem to claim there is a single geometry for gravel bikes, but there clearly isn't. Further, geometry has evolved significantly in the last decade so was that initial feometry what 'gravel' geometry is, or is a modern gravel bike with different geometry a gravel bike?

Reality is that gravel bikes vary widely in purpose and geometry. There is no single bb drop, or hra, or sta, or chainstay length, or trail number that is 'fravel'. Companies have all sorts of different takes, and it's been that way this entire time.

SoSmellyAir

While one does not necessarily need a "gravel bike" to go gravel biking, there is overlap between the two.

justin1138

What if... now here me out... we started calling them monstercross bikes again?

Spoonrobot 

The Tripster ATR metamorphized into a gravel bike well after the first USA gravel bike(s).

Unfortunately, a "Gravel Bike" has to be called a gravel bike to count, the Tripster ATR was like a lot of precursor bikes that were named something else - it was a Kinesis mainline badged bike of designs they were already making and selling for other companies. Performance Bike was selling CX bikes in 2011/12 with the same geometry including the leading indicator BB drop greater than the CX standard 60-65mm. Their Scattante bikes for recreational cyclocross had BB drop 70-72mm, similar HTA 72° and so on.

https://web.archive.org/web/20130813...e/tripster-atr

No gravel mentioned, early 2010s "this isn't road or MTB" copy editing - Adventure, touring, cyclocross.

Earlier press release with the same messaging:
https://www.bikeradar.com/news/2013-...kes-first-look

Compare to the press release for the Raleigh Tamland:

https://www.cxmagazine.com/raleigh-t...sc-brake-steel

And of course, the Warbird, which hit Salsa website sometime late 2012:
https://web.archive.org/web/20120902.../bikes/warbird

Gravel geometry precursors were around much earlier in limited form, there are CX bikes from the mid-60s-70s that had the same basic format - @70mm BB drop, 430ish CS, 71-72° HTA, 50ish fork offset, but with more "French" style fit to get stack appropriate, and so forth. By the time the late 1980s and early 1990s rolled around the geometry-type was somewhat common on drop-bar Hybrids. Bianchi did a trial run of gravel bikes that meet all the same goals and messaging in the 1990s called Cross-Terrain - right around the time they were inventing the 29er MTB. The switchover to compact frame design obviously gave rise to much higher stack eventually but the basic geometry features did not change much for what became the basic gravel geometry in 2012/13/14 as the industry gained momentum.

These don't compare, bc one doesn't mention gravel at all.






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