Bike Gremlin

In my experience, oil-lubed chain that I don't clean on the inside (just wipe with a cloth and re-lube) lasts just as long as a wax-lubed chain. Even in dry weather with a lot of dust and sand. That came as a surprise.
I think that's because wax is not as good a lubricant (doesn't flow back when sheard off a point) - while oil has the extra grit grinding paste. They seem to even out in terms of chain durability.

I don't bother to remove chains and wash them thoroughly. Especially the modern bicycle no-bushing chains, where lube easily gets out and dirt easily gets in between the rollers and pins.

For those who prioritize having a clean drivetrain for the sake of having a clean drivetrain (nothing wrong with that preference), you have a point, wax may save some time (at least the liquid drip-type one, I'm not convinced about the one you must "cook").
In terms of drivetrain durability and performance, I haven't noticed much of a difference (muddy and very dusty rides require a wash either way, while on paved roads, dirt doesn't build up too quickly even with oil-lubed chains).

Having said that, I'm still using wax for my gravel bike (though I am considering to switch back to oil for that bike as well). It's used for weekend rides that are not longer than 200 km per day, and I don't bother to carry any lube in case of a heavy rain, so I can just wipe and re-lube the chain when I'm home and leave it over night to cure (the "drip wax").
But, for my commuter bike, which is my main & practically only means of transport, that's impractical (it's not really practical, at least for me, even for the gravel bike, but that's less "critical" so to speak).

Fair points for wax to note:
- The stains from a waxed chain are easier to wash from clothes compared to oiled-chain stains.
- Winter salty road, and rain cycling - both oil and wax get washed out and neither will save the chain from rust of the "salty" slush winter roads. I haven't been able to notice or measure much difference between wax and oil in such riding conditions, to my surprise (I was expecting wax to perform very poorly). Oil just seems to hide the rust until you clean the chain thoroughly enough to inspect it (very thick oil does seem to resist water washout better, but it builds too much dirt, too quickly, so it's pointless IMO).

I also wish to note that there's nothing wrong with prioritizing a clean drivetrain. I'm just not convinced it saves any time (I'd also argue that it costs more).

Relja

Duragrouch

Alright... stand back... what someone needs to create is an on-bike hot-waxer. That would give all the benefits, be clean, and be quick. Problem is, hot liquid wax, cold chain running through, it would quickly solidify. There could be a preheat stage with just hot air that heats up the chain, then throw a lever to push the chain down in the wax, but it would also need to not get hot enough to damage plastic derailleur pulleys. Also, chain will get stiff due to solidifying wax, making it impossible to crank chain through, so chain would need to stay at melt temp until done cranking, I think that is possible, based on my memory of how long pot-waxed chains stayed hot after pulling out. Either that, or wax dissolved in a solvent and just use typical on-bike chain cleaner. But then the area inside the rollers is not full of hard wax, and I think that is critical to wax lifespan. So I think like a normal on-bike cleaner, but made from stainless steel and not plastic, with aluminum or stainless rollers, a small heating element to keep the wax melted, and an attachment to a typical heat gun to preheat the chain just forward of the derailleur pulley, just aft of the wax dip, so heats it right before the wax dip as you crank backwards. I think total time to preheat the wax and then do the job, would be ten minutes. Dang, I wish I still had access to a machine shop, I'd make this bad boy myself. I'll probably have to settle for buying three chains and pot-wax all at the same time, for fast changeover when one squeaks.

choddo

I would love to see the state of the chainrings after using that beauty

Duragrouch

Good point. But wax flakes off really easily when not captured, like inside the chain rollers. It sure doesn't last long on the outside of the chain.

You watch, in a decade, they're have nano-ball-bearing assemblies at each pin, the outer race constituting the roller.

elcruxio

I'm curious. Which drip wax are you using?
I ask because there are ones which do not seem to bring chain wear advantages (White lightning clean ride) and there are ones which work great but need a bit of a process in order to get them to work (squirt). Then there are ones which just work but become useless if they aren't flushed every once in a while (Mariposa flower power).

When riding in winter salt every wax needs to be flushed regularly because the wax does not displace salt. Then again the same goes for oils too, because the oil doesn't displace salt either.

For immersion waxes pretty much anything works ok, but there are waxes which work extremely well (Rex Black Diamond).

Bike Gremlin

I've used "Pedro's Ice Wax 2.0" (wax-based) and "Joe's Eco-Nano Dry Lube" (PTFE-based).

elcruxio

Neither of those are familiar to me.

The pedro Ice wax performed really poorly in friction facts testing but I suspect it was the 1.0 version. Not sure what the differences are with the 2.0 though.

Is the Joe's actually a wax? From the marketing it seems it's just ptfe powder in a water based carrier (the "eco friendly" labeling seems pretty ironic...)

How much chain life are you getting when using said waxes?

Bike Gremlin

The Joe's isn't really a wax (but it is a modern, locally available & popular "clean and dry" lubricant, so I wanted to give it a test as well).

cyccommute 

There is a reason for this. Wax sits on the fibers of the clothing while oil, due to its ability to flow, seeps into the fibers where it is harder to remove. The wax flakes off while the oil doesn’t.

Chemically, this is wrong. Wax is just as waterphobic as oil. Neither one is water soluble. Wax does not “get washed off”. It is a solid and will stay in place in the presence of water. Oil, because it is mobile and less dense than water, will “float” off but it will not dissolve in water any better than wax does.



I also wish to note that there's nothing wrong with prioritizing a clean drivetrain. I'm just not convinced it saves any time (I'd also argue that it costs more).

Relja[/QUOTE]

himespau 

Since KMC advertises the reusability of their quick link (as opposed to some other manufacturers who call them single use links), I go with KMC even though a lot of people claim it's got the hardest manufacturer lube to remove. Also, they're usually the cheapest, and I buy like 3-4 at a time.

13ollocks

I've been waxing a three-chain rotation of KMC 10sp chains for the last ~9k miles. By my estimation, each quick link has been fastened/unfastened 8-9 times. While I accept that no quick link will last forever, I still need the tool or a decent lean on the crank to reengage them. As soon as I'm able to fasten them by hand, I think it'll be time for new links, but they're still pretty solid in my estimation.

himespau 

For me, since I do almost all my riding indoors after being hit by a car a couple of years ago, it comes down to the fact that the wax flakes that come off my chain can be easily wiped/vacuumed up off the trainer/rocker plate/carpet and don't really get on my cats when they rub up against my bike because they're getting jealous. Chain oil on the other hand, is the devil to get out of carpet and cat fur. Water/road dirt/salt exposure aren't really concerns to me. Since I have 3-4 chains in rotation on each bike, I wait until I mount the last chain with fresh wax, and then go wax the other 2-3 chains. Turn on the crockpot, come back, through the chains in. Swish them around a bit, turn off the crockpot, hang the chains above the pot so any drips fall back in. Come back later, put the lid on the pot, and come back in a month or so when I need to grab one of the chains hanging there to put on my bike.

Ryan_M

I use (mostly 11s) SRAM, KMC, and Shimano chains. I haven't noticed much, if any, difference in the quick links. I use the exact same discrimination process as you as to 'go/no-go'. TBH unless I pooch it not having things perfectly lined up puting a link together, the links easily last the lifetime of the chain, and I'm probably in the dozens of operations range.

Ryan_M

I think you're theorizing about fixing a problem that doesn't exist. Realistically what's it take to drop a chain.... 10 seconds tops if gravity doesn't take over getting the chain through the RD? And if the chain's not co-operating going through the RD and the quick link is being a bit finicky, maybe 2 minutes tops to re-install? The crockpot is hard to beat. I got a cheapie off amazon for $12 (Canadian pesos) on the Prime promotion. Even if you could produce said product, figure out a way to keep excess molten wax off everything, and turn a profit to make it worth while selling them for <$15 a unit, I'd argue you're wasting your time.

Kai Winters

You're supposed to run the chain over something round to loosen it up and break the links free before installing it. I use a piece of pvc pipe I had laying around. At the bike shop we use an old mtn bike handlebar.

Kai Winters

I prefer Shimano Ultegra and Dura Ace 12 speed chains. I have four in rotation. Two of each and can't tell the difference between them when they are on the bike.
When I'm on my last chain I start the cleaning and waxing process. The system works great when you include a cold beer in the process...just sayin'...

Duragrouch

I think you're right. My memory is more fresh with regard to pulling off a filthy oiled chain with oil sludge. 20-30 years ago during my waxing period, it was faster, and that was using a chain tool instead of the quicker master links now used on narrow chains. It's the oily sludge that slows things down.

smd4

Thanks! It’s a pretty neat looking chain. I’d get one, but don’t want to spend the money to take the chance that it shifts as nicely as a Shimano chain.

smd4

If your chain was that coated in oil and “sludge,” you weren’t lubricating your chain properly.

Duragrouch

So, I lube with 75W-90 gear lube, which seems to have the viscosity of a much lower viscosity motor oil. A drop of oil at each roller is enough lube, I don't need to add more, that is durable. After about 500 miles, I see the consistency of paste and that indicates to me that it is time for an on-bike solvent cleaning, and reoiling. Until I see the paste, it's plenty wet with lube. The lube doesn't deplete, it just turns into a colloid(?) with all the metal particles, which is then "lapping paste", and I promptly remove and relube. I could do like some and wipe the outside and relube, but that does nothing for the paste inside the rollers, which is what I most need to remove.

smd4

Yeah, completely how I wouldn’t do it. Did you ever wipe off the oil you applied?

Duragrouch

No, but no need. One drop penetrates the rollers and capillary action holds it in place. I get no formation of oil drops on the bottom. Now, this is dependent on my lube-drop size. I use a covid test dropper container, it dispenses a perfect drop size with this lube. (Unfortunately, it also seems to slowly degrade the semi-flexible plastic, but it lasted over two years before cracking.) As long as the lube stays liquid, it all stays inside the rollers and between link plates, etc. Only when it turns to paste from metal particle saturation, does it get squeezed out, the perfect sign for me to clean and relube. I'm sure it wouldn't hurt to clean and relube the chain before that. I just figure (and I could be wrong), as long as the lube is liquid, the metal particles tend to get pushed out of the way at metal-to-metal contact, they can move, or at least, there's less metal particle content, that part is for sure. It's not a perfect system, but OK until I have a way to quantify results easy, like if I was doing a long tour.

choddo

Maybe your roads are a lot cleaner than mine but that ends up being contaminated with a lot more stuff off the road than with metal particles.

I use a similar application method.

Duragrouch

I ride typical paved roads. Not much blowing dirt, but I'm sure some constantly being kicked up behind the front tire, no fenders currently. If I get caught in the rain, drivetrain gets full of grit, period, until hosed off or cleaned, so I watch the radar and avoid rain like the plague. But if kept dry, not bad; The rain tends to rinse the streets clean of finer dust; when I look closely at the chain when it's still oily looking and not pasty (which is most of the time during an oiled "cycle"), I don't see or feel grit. When I dip a magnet in the solvent after a chain clean, it comes out stuck with a magnetic black sludge, and that's all "chain dust". But then the solvent is still not clear, it's pretty black; Could be dirt. Either way, whether it's dirt (silicate) or metal dust, once there is enough to make the lube pasty, I clean the chain.

I wonder what would happen if I made the rear derailleur idler pulley a mild magnet? Might collect the metal dust, better, or might just magnetize the chain, worse.

I rarely use the 11T cog, I wonder what would happen if I positioned a toothbrush so that when the chain was on the 11T, it constantly got brushed, just for a short period, then switch back to the other cogs?

choddo

Toothbrush between the spokes at some point, probably.