JWK

I have a Surly Disc Trucker. I have no racks or panniers for it yet. I have worked up my rides to 50 miles comfortably and of course now want to go more. The problem is water and food. I can put a sandwich in my old ascent saddle bag from the 90s, but it's really a pain and not a good saddle bag at all. I need some rack arrangement.

I did 32 miles last week. It was high 80s and very high humidity. I had three 27 oz. water bottles with me. It wasn't enough. Luckily I've got a convenience store 2 miles from my house. I stopped and got a giant gatorade and was able to make it up the very steep 1.5 mile hill. I was staggering in the store like I was drunk and feeling very dizzy. I don't want that to happen again.

I live very rural. A lot of the loops I ride don't even pass a store. I mapped out a really nice 60 mile ride I want to try and there is a store 15 miles out. Some loops I haven't taken at all because There are no stores at all and I just can't carry enough water and food. So I want to be able to go 100 miles without having to rely on stopping to get water and food. I have three 42 oz. SS water bottles (kleen kanteens) and three 27 oz. bike bottles. I'm thinking of getting one more 42 oz. SS bottle. I think all of that will get me far enough to hit something.

I'm looking for my equipment to do two things:
1. Go any 80 - 100 mile distance without having to stop for food or drink.
2. Do self supported touring for 2 - 4 days. Moderate base weight of 35 - 40 lbs.

So I'm wondering about the best way to carry all that water for a long day trip with probably a rack pack for the food. Then switch over to some kind of pannier setup for any kind of touring.

Any ideas or suggestions?

Thanks.

RoadTire 

That seems to be an awful lot of water for 32 miles. Is it possible you need more electrolytes in the water you are carrying? The first thing on the list in Gatorade is sucrose syrup (sugar) and it has lots of sodium and potassium. This thread might have 2 components: better nutrition and elecrolye management plus the touring package. I don't disagree with carrying more water than you think you need - it's what I do cycling or hiking, it's the amount you are drinking and still were dizzy until you had the Gatorade.

JWK

Well, it depends. A few days before that I went 43 miles and only used two of those bottles. I never touched the third. It was 72 degrees and low humidity. It is more water than I usually need for 30+ miles, but it was around 88 degrees and above 90% humidity. That changes things. Also, maybe I do need more electrolytes. BUT - I still want to go at least 80 miles without support of any kind. I want to be able to carry plenty of water and food. I can't do that now.

RoadTire 

Google "bike racks and top bags" and look at images. You can go as little at $20 rack and $10 bag (it's what I use on my mtb for winter trails) or as much as you want to spend. That will give you a "day ride" capacity. Also look at handlebar bags, but I prefer to keep the weight in the back.

bikemig 

If water is an issue, it's hard to beat a camelback. Camelbacks have 2 huge advantages. The first is obviously capacity. The 2d is that you can fill that sucker full of ice. It is a near religious experience to be drinking cold water 4 hours into a ride. It will do wonders for lowering your core body temps. Plus you can then fill the bottles on your bike with 1/2 gatorade and water.

For a 3-4 day trip, you have a choice to make between full panniers, tent, cooking gear, etc. or latch onto the lightweight camping philosophy. Both are perfectly good ways to go camping touring but you'll want to decide which one is the right one for you before you buy your bags obviously.

fietsbob

4 panniers and 4 bladder bags, 1 in each, will let you carry Gallons if you wish ..


I like the racks made out of 10mm 4130 (steel).. Tubus makes popular ones..

irpheus

Hi ... Depending on the amount of gear you want to bring (as bikemig says: tent, cooking gear etc.) I might use a couple of not too big panniers in the back and four bottles on the bike (3 on the frame and if possible one on the handlebars), possibly combined with a bladder water "tank" like platypus from cascadedesigns Platypus® hydration packs, hydration systems, water bottles, water treatment and wine preservation..

I have Tubus steel racks in the front and back of my bike (Thorn Sherpa) and are thoroughly content with them (solid, works) although for lighter weights I suppose an aluminum rack would do as well.

Cheers, Jesper

dellwilson

If you have streams or creeks nearby, you can carry a backpacking filter, which will give you unlimited range. My Sawyer Squeeze weighs only 108g, easily fits in a jersey pocket, and works great. It only takes a few minutes to fill a couple of 20oz bottles from a stream.

While it will filter particulate matter and most biological pathogens, it won't help with chemicals so you wouldn't want to drink water downstream from a factory that might be emitting some nasty chemicals.

Cyclebum

Lots of good ideas. Be aware that you can stick bottle racks in a lot of places on the bike using nothing but cable ties. For long, sweaty riding, V-8 is a good electrolyte/vegetable replacer.

J.C. Koto

V-8! Never thought of that, and I even like the stuff.

Thanks for the tip!

headloss 

A great cheap rack is the Bontrager BackRack Deluxe which has a second set of lower tubes to lower the panniers... it's basically a knockoff of the Tubus design, for 1/4 the price (part of that price difference being aluminum vs. stainless steel). Surly makes a nice rack too, as does Axiom and a few others.

Aside from bottle mounts, a rack is the best way to carry extra water. In the mean time, you could always consider a camelbak. You can also get handlebar mounted water cages, or cages that attach to front fork mounts, throw a bottle in a jersey pocket, etc. You have a LHT so you already got three bottle cages, right? You can carry larger bottles.

If budget is an issue, it's not hard to make a workable pannier from cheap scrap. I have a couple of perfectly sized bags with a hard back that I bought at goodwill for $5 each... a bungee cord and a couple of hooks later, I have two workable panniers for city commuting (I use my more expensive fully waterproof ortlieb's for actual touring).

Northwestrider

The ( Salsa Anything Cage ), I have one on my Surly LHT's down tube. On it I strap a 64 oz stainless steel water bottle, convenient and assessable .

Walter S

I have the same bike. 5 water bottle holders. 3 on the frame and two on the front rack. My Bicycle | Walter's Little World

andrewclaus

Years ago I found some decent panniers at the REI "Attic Sale" (this was actually at the original Seattle store, in the old attic). I found a cheap aluminum rack somewhere else. When I go out all day, I pack lunch, water and a jacket in one pannier. When I go out all summer, I pack some camping gear in the other. I've used those old panniers nearly every day for errands or commuting. I guess my point is, if you have a good set of panniers you might use them for a lot of things. As long as you don't mind the dorky-looking rack.

If you have a pannier, a Platypus 2 liter bladder is a good light durable container that collapses to nearly nothing when empty.

You can get a little more capacity in your bike bottle carriers, and save a little weight and money, by using re-purposed 1 or 1.5 liter soda bottles. They're free along every roadside, and sometimes you can even find one with a handy squirt cap.

Nick The Beard

This is the way to go. Check out maps to get an idea of what kind of natural water sources you'll be passing. If you're getting that far out there that you aren't passing convenience stores I'm guessing you're some where wild.

JWK

Negative. While it is logical to think that might be true, it does not happen to be. There are no stores because the area has become so economically depressed. 20 years ago every little hamlet had their own little store. Little towns, villages, hamlets are broke and now have nothing. A couple of weeks ago I made a 40 mile ride and planned on getting resupplied with drinks at the halfway point in a small little village where I knew there was a general store. Nope. All boarded up.

Then there is the matter of water from streams. This is dairy country. Lots of chemical runoff pollution from farms. This is one of the things that really suck about the northeast US. No matter how far "out there" you go, everything is still polluted. I miss Oregon in that way (but not other ways). You go out in the middle of the Cascades or coastal range and the water is CLEAN.

So filtering water is a good idea, but not here. Not for me, anyway.

saddlesores

got milk?


1. get one of them el cheapo front racks that bolt to the brake mounts. (see recent threads)
2. get a seatpost mount rail rack. (good enough until you know what ya wanna tour with)
3. add two 2-liter soda bottles (pop bottles for those in the middle kingdom)
4. stick 'em in the freezer overnight (leave some expansion room!)
5. bungee your ice blocks to the racks. or use a velcro-strap beer cooler if you want
the ice to last longer.
6. carry a couple extra soda/pop bottle screw on caps with holes drilled for a shower.
(a sewing needle heated in a flame will go right through them plastic caps)

bradtx

JWK, Now is perhaps the time to buy a quality rear rack and a top bag.

More importantly is the need to stay properly hydrated. You should feel the need to pee at least once an hour. You can supplement the three bottles on the bike with a couple of liters in the top bag.

Brad

JWK

Brad, I think you're right. Once I stopped fretting about the pannier situation, I realized getting set up with Tubus racks seems best. They don't weigh any more than the better aluminum racks, so I'll cry once. I'll figure out the panniers later. Right now I need to figure out how to carry water and food and I don't need a full Ortlieb set to do that. I might even buy some Lone Peak pannier hardware and try converting a bunch of cordura shoulder bags I have from a previous project. I think I have about 16 of them, so plenty of room for experimenting.

Any suggestions for a top bag?

fietsbob

sewn , not waterproof, or seam welded , and made to be waterproof? How Big?

MichaelW

You can mount extra bottle cages on the bars and saddle rails.

bradtx

I have an old Nashbar top bag and haven't looked at what's currently available. Two features I like are that it is at least water resistant as it's never leaked water inside and it's expandable. The bag has seen a lot of both bicycle and motorcycle duty. My panniers are also Nashbar branded and have served me well.

Brad

pamaguahiker 

Pa is the same way. You can sometimes ride through dozens of towns with no convenience stores...BUT while passing through those same little hamlets...you run into tons of friendly country folks who will easily refill a water bottle for you. Also, If you are passing by a cemetery, go investigate. They usually all have a spigot, or water source for watering plants. likewise with churches, parishes, etc. There are lots of country churches and most have water sources.

Like you, all my streams around here run iron red/orange and are now horribly contaminated due to improper disposal of fracking, wastewater, well drilling, coal mining, etc. (or within 5 miles of me, NPL Site Narrative for Jackson Ceramix | National Priorities List (NPL) | US EPA ) Like you said...they were all thriving little villages at one time before some economic dilemma hit.

veganbikes

I like to carry CocoHydro with me on tour. Coconut water is just great for you and a perfect more natural electrolyte boost. I also sometimes carry Nuun tabs but I prefer CocoHydro.
Big Tree Farms Bali

For racks the Surly Nice Rack is nice but I think Tubus is a lighter option with good strength and quality. I am planning on doing the Tubus Duo at the front when they are back in stock where I plan on ordering them. For panniers I like my Arkel GT-54s plenty of space and the tent/hammock accessory tube is great and really keeps things organized. If you wanted to just do a rack top setup, the Topeak DXP trunk bag is great because it has fold down panniers for carrying a little extra. If you were trying to carry a lot of water you could get MSR Dromedary/Dromelites or Sea To Summit PackTaps put some Camelback bladders in them. Though I might try what I mentioned above and see if that makes a difference in your hydration.

Medic Zero

Alright, that is just genius. So copying this! Where'd you get the giant size steel water bottle? Got any pictures of your set-up?

For rides like the OP describes, I usually use my minimalist Camelback type bag. I usually don't like riding with a bag, but with a very minimalist Camelback one isn't tempted to put too much gear in there along with the water. Also helps with staying hydrated, as the mouthpiece is right there. I often bring this bag with me on my tours as well.