roo777

My crank is the standard 53/39. I love riding this bike, it is like butter! @77Eric I agree the Flite is the most comfortable saddle I've ever had. I do see them from time to time on eBay. You might want to look there. I'm taking my bike into my LBS tomorrow. Sram's best are on it. I'm confident we'll figure it out.

roo777

Update:

My bike took a trip to Sram HQ in downtown Chicago yesterday. One of their road technicians looked at the issue. The verdict: The mechanic at my LBS forgot to install the wave washer on the crank spindle when installing the BB.

Kudos to Sram for all of their diligence and hard work during this process. They have a customer for life!!

rpenmanparker 

Glad you got it straightened out. Guess you need a new LBS/mechanic, huh?

roo777

I dropped that LBS/Mechanic shortly after the eTap install. The owner is not my favorite person. The mechanic was a really nice guy, but clearly not very good at his job.

I love my new LBS. They were awesome during this whole ordeal.

Poppiholla

@roo777: I have also some issues with the FD Sram Etap en dropping the chain on the big ring and some drive train noise on the big ring in combination with the 4 biggest sprockets. Can you tell me where the wavy washer should be installed on your BB? The Sram Rep find out that a wavy washer was not installed when installing the BB, but can you tell more about the BB and how the wavy washer should be installed? I want to check this out on my bike. I use C-Bear OSBB61 Fact-R BB30 cups but I believe a wavy washer is not needed for the BB. The Crankset only uses a preload adjuster and no wavy washer is used either. So I am a bit confused. Can you or somebody help me out? Thanks.

rpenmanparker 

Wavy washer goes on the non-drive side next to the crank arm. All other spacers go inboard of the wavy washer. You can look up SRAM diagrams online that show the assembly order.

Poppiholla

Ok.. so you use a Sram red BB30 Crankset with a wavy washer and the spacers? The new Sram Red Etap BB30 crankset uses a preload adjuster and no wavy washer and additional spacers. Do you mean you use the preload adjuster on the non driveside crankarm and the wavy washer????

roo777

The crankset is the new Sram Red eTap BB30 crank. I'm not certain of the configuration of the install of the crankset. I personally didn't install it. I am repeating what one of the Sram on-staff road technicians who work at the Chicago HQ told the owner of my LBS. He said the crank was missing the wavy washer. I've been on a few rides since my bike visited the HQ, and the FD works like a charm.

scott967

AFAIK, the "wavy washer" is part of the OEM crank setup. Aftermarket cranks that I have seen all are of the "IA" variety which use a "pre-load" adjuster instead (and seems to me 100% better solution).

I can see that if the wavy washer is not installed,or the pre-load adjuster not set, the crank could move laterally even with it tightened to spec. The wavy washer obviously can only provide so much adjustment, and you need spacers if it isn't "semi-squashed" when crank is torqued. I find it pretty difficult to determine how much it is squashed myself, that's why I'm glad I'm now on a Red BB30-IA crank.

scott s.
.

American Euchre

Nice, how do you like your etap now that it's working properly?

roo777

So far so good! Shifting is quick and smooth..

Poppiholla

@roo777: Can you make a picture (top view) of your crankset on the non drive site and the drive site? Maybe i can figure out by the pictures how your BB30 setup is.
Thanks!

Chi_Z

hmm those newer sram crank should include a threaded tension adjuster on the non driveside, no wavy washer is needed. So in the end, it is a chainline issue? With the correct limit screw I find it hard to understand how a 1-2mm increase in your chainline could solve your problem.

roo777

According to the Sram service manual. The exploded view shows a wavy washer

Chi_Z

that is a 2008 manual, new cranksets are different, the spindle is now attached to the non drive side

rpenmanparker 

I got tired of looking but didn't see where OP said what vintage his crank is. He mentions buying frame and eTap kit separately. The eTap might have been just the derailleur/shifter kit, no crank or brakes included. Then he may have bought a crank off ebay or similar that is quite a bit older. So unless I missed it, we don't know whether his crank is supposed to use the wavy washer or not. Indication from the resolution of the problem by SRAM staff is that the crank is an older, wavy-washer version.

OP, care to let us know?

bleui

he mentioned it in post #33

roo777

I bought the entire groupset as a single unit. I'm quoting what the owner of my LBS was told by the Sram technician. Maybe there was some miscommunication? Since I'm not familiar with preload adjusters, can someone help me out? Is it similar to a washer? Could it be forgotten during a crank install, or is that impossible?

Poppiholla

Pictures from the crankset from all directions would help. ;-)

velociraptor

SRAM doesn't sell groupsets as entire units, it's up to resellers/retailers to package the components together for sale if they choose.

It's possible that your LBS included an older crankset in order to save money on the entire purchase (speculation).

The cranksets with preload adjusters are discrete models from the versions that use the washers/shims.

The wavy washer is like any other washer in that it can most certainly be forgotten during install assembly.

That said, I would characterize any self-described bike mechanic that forgets to install it as either lazy or a moron.

Personally, I'd get the findings from SRAM in writing then go to the original LBS and demand compensation for all the trouble.

roo777

No. The crank is a 2016 model with eTap paint.

You wouldn't believe what I've been through with this original LBS. It has been a summer of drama and BS. I HATE posting negative reviews of locally owned shops. But, I've wrote this one up, and I'm seriously considering posting it to Yelp:




Let me begin by saying that I HATE giving negative reviews to locally owned shops. But, after the ordeal I've been through with The LBS this summer, I felt compelled to speak up.

This is a long tale, so bare with me as I go through the entire experience.

It all started in April of this year. I purchased a frame and groupset from an online bike shop. I brought it in to The LBS to finish the build after I didn't have much luck building the bike myself (I'm a novice mechanic). I received a call a few days after saying that they were weary about building the bike because the brake mount holes were too small to mount the brakes. The owner stated they could drill out the holes, but were unsure if it would affect the structural integrity of the frame. After hearing this warning, I decided to scrap the entire project, and return the frame to the online store where I purchased it. I spoke with the online bike store, and told them about the issues with the brake mount holes. They had their mechanic check it. The brakes installed without any issues. Sigh. Anyways, moving on...

I purchased a different used frame on eBay (I kept the same groupset) and brought it in to The LBS to build it out (I didn't attempt to build this bike myself). It was a Specialized frame. Upon showing the frame to the owner, after I told him I purchased it on eBay, his first response was "well, whoever sold you that frame is in violation of their Specialized dealer agreement". Okay, just build the fricking thing.

After a few days in the shop, I got a call from the owner. He stated the bottom bracket bearings were so worn, that they needed to be replaced. I spoke again with the online bike shop I bought it from. He reiterated there was less than 1,000 miles on the frame (most bottom brackets last 10,000 miles or more, and the frame was 1 year old, so I was a bit confused).

Okay, go ahead and replace the bottom bracket, I told them. They told me it would be a week or so because they had to order the part directly from specialized. Okay. Two weeks later I received a call my bike was ready. hooray!!!

The bike looked great. They did a great job on the bar tape, the brakes and the brake routing. I thought all was well. Until I started riding the bike.

Almost immediately during my first ride (4 miles in), the front derailleur began throwing the chain onto the crank arm when shifting from the small chain ring into the big one. I almost fell off my bike the first time it happened. At this point, I had lost my faith in the LBS, so I took my bike to a different bike shop to have the problem looked at. The mechanic at the new shop said it seemed to be an issue with the front derailleur adjustment. A Sram tech (the manufacturer of my derailleurs) happened to visit their shop while my bike was there, so I had a professional adjustment by a Sram employee. Sweet!

On my first ride after the first adjustment, guess what? The exact same issue started happening again. At this point, I reached out to Sram customer service to explain my issue. They stated it could be an issue with incorrectly sized limit screws. So, they sent new limit screws to the different bike shop to install. I figured all was well at this point.

On my first ride after the swapped out limit screws, guess what? The exact same issue continued to happen. When I shifted my front derailleur from the small chainring into the large one, the chain overshot the big ring and went onto the crank arm. Back into the different bike shop! At this point, I was pretty livid with Sram, and was blaming their equipment. Sram sent out a brand new front derailleur to install. They apologized profusely, and hoped this would fix the problem. The mechanic at the different bike shop installed the new derailleur, and I hoped this was the end of this terrible debacle.

On my first ride after the install of the new front derailleur, guess what? The exact same issue continued to happen. At this point, I was ready to scrap my entire group set, and install something different. I reached out to Sram again. I was quite frustrated. Sram customer service called the different bike shop, and told them to tell me they would do "whatever it takes" to fix this problem. Awesome news. I took my bike back in to the different bike shop, and waited.

I received a call several days later. The owner of the bike shop told me a Sram rep came to the shop, picked up my bike, and took it to Sram's headquarters in downtown Chicago. One of their on staff road technicians was going to take the bike apart, and figure out what was causing the problem.

The Sram tech figured it out. The mechanic neglected to install a wave washer on the crank spindle when the initial install took place.

5 months of this because the mechanic forgot a washer.

Ughhhhhhhhh.

I can't recommend this shop.

velociraptor

Sorry to hear about all your pain.

Some shops have truly talented techs and others don't. Honestly it's kind of a crap shoot, especially during Spring/Summer when you're more likely to get a temp worker.

I've had some good LBS experiences and some bad LBS experiences... sometimes both from the same shop.

I think most shops are just set up to move pre-config'd products, period. That's the most efficient business model for them.

Once you start moving into more bespoke requests, you risk putting your faith in someone who may not actually know as much (or be as careful) as you think they should.

scott967

The 2016 Red BB30 exogram crank should be SRAM part no 00.6118.386.nnn for standard or part no 00.6118.387.nnn - 00.6118.389.nnn for compact (depends on chainring variation) with nnn denoting the crank length.

This is the "preload adjuster" version and I never heard of putting the wavy washer in there, as I see no point to it. If you need a spacer to achieve chainline then a normal spacer would suffice.

The SRAM manual does show install of a "SRAM Red cranks with integrated spider" and a wavy washer which I have never seen offered for sale in the after market.

scott s.
.

velociraptor

You missed the part where SRAM HQ said the LBS incorrectly installed the crankset by omitting the wave washer.

Or maybe you're saying that you don't believe SRAM HQ?

scott967

I'm saying I haven't seen a Red 22 2016 crankset that uses the wavy washer. I see no reason why a wavy washer would be used with the preload adjuster, regardless of what SRAM HQ says (and since OP never provided any image we are just guessing any way.) My guess is there exists an OEM version of the crank that lacks the preload adjuster and that's what OP has (and the LBS I assume never saw one either and that's why they didn't pick up on the need if my guess is correct).

scott s.
.