LarsD

Hi there,

I've been looking for a classic CX Aluminium Alan bike in my size (60) and at last found one. the bike is ok, it's been used but the frame and lugs are fine.
I started taking it apart, and encountered 3 issues:
the stem is blocked in the fork
the seat post is blocked in the frame
the Cranck axle is blocked. this must come out to fit a new one. one side is already damaged (prior to me). the tool doesn't fit very well.

My obvious question is how to get everything our and not damage the fragile construction.
what thread is the Cranck Axle? Left or Right?
I am ready to put quite some work and some budget in, because I did not pay a lot for the bike and I've already fallen in love with it.

any other suggestion is welcome. (except "throw it away and buy a new one")

Greets and thanks
Lars

thook

1) Flip the frame over and spray penetrating fluid down into the opening of the steerer in the fork crown. Let it soak overnight or however much longer it takes to loosen the stem. Be careful trying to wrench the stem loose so as not to strip the head of the bolt, assuming it's a quill stem

2)What kind of bottom bracket do you have? A cup and cone style or cartridge? Getting the bottom bracket out will be necessary to start soaking the seat post to get it loose. Were the bottom bracket out, you can spray penetrating fluid down into the seat tube....or some freeze off (google that one) that works sometimes as well

LarsD

Hi Thook,
thanks for the reply.

I've done the penetrating oil thing for the stem yesterday. I'll put some more today and see what happens. I've also heard about doing it with ammonia, which would dissolve the oxidation of the aluminium between stem and fork. any ideas on this?

The bottom bracket, don't know what type. I see the typical bolt/screw with inside teeth, to be used with the typical Shimano tool with outside teeth (like freewheel remover but bigger size). This is identical at both sides. Not sure if its left or right threaded.
I think it's the original Shimano equipment, since all of the group is Shimano except the brakes.
I can't post a picture yet, need to do 10 posts first.

greets and thanks
Lars

nomadmax 

I'd move on. That's a lot of work for a frame that's known for cracked lugs.

JohnDThompson 

All AlAn frames I've encountered have used Italian thread for the bottom bracket: 36mm x 24tpi right hand thread on both sides.

Sounds like you have your work cut out for you dealing with seized components.

LarsD

hey John,
so counter-clockwise to release at both sides, right?
thanks
L

LarsD

that would be the sensible thing to do, but I'm not a sensible man when I'm in my basement to release the stress in my mind. Doing un- sensible things works really well.

himespau 

Yeah, seems like a lot of effort. On the other hand, if you've been fixated on getting one of these frames for a while (and are not likely to find another soon), go for it. I'm in the midst of a PB Blaster soak to hopefully get out a siezed BB on a frame I really like - it's also Italian thread and I'm hoping someone just overtightened it because they didn't know which way to turn and didn't damage the threads and that there's no galling between the alloy bb threads and the Ti frame.

JohnDThompson 

Correct.

LarsD

aha! got the BB out. I used a 70cm pipe to get more leverage, pressed the Shimano tool in as hars as I could, took a deep breath and it cracked loose and started turning.
now I 've put WD40in so soak the seat post. Is there a better chemical for the aluminium post?
greets
L

Rolla

Sheldon Brown's "14 ways to unstick a seatpost" might be helpful if you haven't already read it: https://www.sheldonbrown.com/stuck-seatposts.html

thook

I"m assuming you're not in the US, so not sure what's available to you. But, if PB Blaster, Kroil, or WD40 "specialist" penetrant are available, then those work well for ferrous metals. Aluminum is not ferrous, so perhaps try "Freeze Off". It's not a penetrant. It freezes the components to cause expansion and "attempt" to break loose the surface tension. I've used it before with success. BTW, regular WD40 isn't the best of penetrants. It doesn't creep into the parts like other products.
Oh, and some have used auto tranny fluid mixed with acetone with excellent results. I don't remember the mix percentage, so you'll have to google that

Crankycrank

+1 and Acetone-ATF is used with a 50/50 mix.

himespau 

Huh, so that might explain why a 3 day soak in PB Blaster didn't help free up my alloy BB cup stuck to my Ti frame. I'm hoping the bike shop I dropped it off at has more luck.

LarsD

got a freezing oil penetrant thing... and it worked well for the seat post. I got it out with a lot of force and stress. I now have a new blister on my handpalm. started using the glove when it was too late evidently. but hey, 2 of 3 stuck things are out. next is the stem. I've turned the bike upside-down and sprayed lots of penetrant oil in the hole of the fork.
It seems hard to get a decent grip on the fork without damaging it. I'll get back to it tomorrow.

thook

it's a regular quill stem, right? penetrant will work well with that since the bolt and wedge are (should be) steel. be patient with it. tap on the wedge with something long like a screwdriver to set up vibration and break the tension. if the bolt will then come loose and yet the stem is still stuck in there, then you have more work to do...lol.
btw, is the steerer tube aluminum or steel?

thook

try the freeze off (at o'reilly, i think) and tap it. keep tapping, too. it's really part of the whole process that's important to get anything like freeze off or pb blaster, etc to really work the best

edit: yes...at o'reilly. crc is the brand name. about $7.50 a can

LarsD

Hi,
it's a regular quill stem, yes. I got the bolt out, so that's fine. I put deblock oil on both sides yesterday evening, so i't been soaking all night.
I think the threaded tube of the fork is steel.
should I apply the freeze-off ont the stem, the part that comes out of the frame? or inside, through the hole of the bolt? seems more logical to get the cold inside the stem and wedge.

I really appreciate you help. I got 2 of 3 problems solved without breaking anything.

greets
Lars

LarsD

I'm in Belgium, so there's no o'reilly. well, there is an Irish pub in Brussels, but I guess Freezoff is not in their taproom.
I found something else though, put ice where you spray.

thook

that reply was directed to himespau

ice where you spray? what do you mean?

LarsD

I meant It makes ice where you spray it.

Geepig

If it is a quill I first loosen the bolt about half a turn and then tap it smartly with a weighted rubber mallet, copper hammer, or a standard hammer and a brass drift / piece of oak.

(and if I am working in someone's barn then just a sharp tap with just a hammer, because if I don't then then they will - generally with much less precision

thook

don't know what deblock oil is. i'll have to look that one up.

so, the bolt came out but not the wedge? how far down into the steerer is the stem? iow's, how much stem is exposed outside/above the steerer tube? if you have plenty, soak the wedge and tap some more with the oil. then, go to the top side of the stem with a wood block and tap on that. that wedge will eventually come out. and, the stem should begin to loosen so you can grab and twist it out with the handlebar installed...hopefully without marring the stem up

dedhed

Whatever they call auto parts stores in Belgium (Auto M&M?) may carry CRC Freeze-off.
​​​​​​https://www.crcindustries.com/produc...-oz-05002.html

himespau 

My bike shop has it now. They called me last night and asked if I wanted the BB back because they hadn't been able to get it loose and might need to use destructive methods. I told them that was fine as long as the frame was safe. Haven't heard back.

I'll keep a look out for that stuff so the next time I get a stuck bolt I can try it.

I did a 1 day soak with PB Blaster after removing the NDS cup (so I could spray from that side and down from the seat tube), then used the Pedro's tool to secure the BB tool to the DS axle/cup, grabbed it with a 16" pipe wrench, tapped it with a mallet, had no movement from that or from really leaning on the wrench, sprayed in more PB Blaster, waited 2 more days, then repeated the wrenching and whacking.