Wire bead failure on Schwalbe Marathon tire that's five years old. What's the cause?
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Wire bead failure on Schwalbe Marathon tire that's five years old. What's the cause?
I have a buillitt front loader cargo bike and today the rear tire failed - Schwalbe Marathon Winter Plus thats about 5 years old. The wire bead failed. Suddenly I felt the tire bottom out and I looked behind me to see that the tire had come off the rim. It had been inflated to 50psi - a very reasonable amount. I weigh 160 lbs and my 5 year old son was in the front but that certainly shouldn't be too much weight. The tire otherwise looked to be in good condition and I expected many more years out of it. When I went to put the tire back on so I could push the bike home thats when I noticed the broken bead.
Is there something I should keep my eye on to catch or prevent this?
Is there something I should keep my eye on to catch or prevent this?
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What was the failure exactly? Bead severed, sidewall torn, etc? 5 years is a pretty good run for a tire that gets used regularly on a cargo bike, I wouldn’t sweat it.
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+1. How much does your cargo bike weigh? Those tires have a 95kg/210lbs limit which may have caused it to fail after 5 years but contact Schwalbe and see what they say.
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You could reach out to Schwlabe but at this point I would just get a new tire and move on, the effort on a well worn 5 year old tire is not really worth it. Brand new tire failing yes 100%.
It is an old tire that probably got quite a bit of usage over the years and finally after years of use and abuse said I am done. You might look at the Pick-Up or Super-Moto-X which might serve you well for another 5 years!
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agreed if you got 5 years of service out of a tire, just replace it and move on
/markp
/markp
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Crankycrank said the weight limit is 210 and by your numbers you would have been well over it by 50lbs 160+40+60≠>210
I'll pay more attention to weight rating in the future. I guess there is some variation depending upon configuration of the bike. Otherwise its pretty common to ride the bike near the weight limit of the tire. Of course, the intersection of studded winter tire, 26x2.0, and the weight requirements might be difficult.
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I goofed on the load limit of the OP's tires. I didn't specify a "26" tire in my search so Schwalbe have 3 widths in a 26". 1.75 is 100kg, 2.0 is 105kg, 2.15 is 115kg That's a big difference. Marathon Winter Plus | 55-559 | SmartGuard | Winter | Black-Reflex | 11159241 (schwalbe.com)
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Maybe half your weight, 40lbs of the bike weight, and all, or almost all, of your kid’s weight. You don’t have 100% on one tire.
Cars and trucks have axle loads and high capacity trucks run dual rear wheels for hauling heavy loads and towing 5th wheels and the like. The weight is spread out over the tires.
John
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I'm left to be the contrarian today.
Weight limit? Probably not excessive for the tire. It's all about distribution. Even if you add OP's weight to half the bike weight, that didn't grossly exceed the tire max load. And really, when was the last time anybody besides Cranky looked at a tire's weight limit? Given the robustness of Schwalbe Marathon Whatever tires, there's probably a safety factor on top of a margin etc. that OP never got near the engineering (not the legal department's) load limit.
Age? Again, probably doesn't matter. What might matter is how often the bike is used, and the total mileage on the tire. Bead failure is not a normal sign of aging tire failure; those would be tread wear and, perhaps, dry rot and flaking sidewalls.
Time for my entry into the guessing game: User error fixing a flat. Excessive enthusiam using a tire iron to lever the tire off the rim without manhandling the tire to create sufficient slack, or perhaps kinking the tire while it's off the rim. Second guess would be underinflation, perhaps in concert with finding a nasty pothole. That could have started as a puncture that the rider didn't notice, so the 50 psi at the beginning of the ride was 20 psi when you found the pothole.
From potholes to potshots! Comments/responses?
Weight limit? Probably not excessive for the tire. It's all about distribution. Even if you add OP's weight to half the bike weight, that didn't grossly exceed the tire max load. And really, when was the last time anybody besides Cranky looked at a tire's weight limit? Given the robustness of Schwalbe Marathon Whatever tires, there's probably a safety factor on top of a margin etc. that OP never got near the engineering (not the legal department's) load limit.
Age? Again, probably doesn't matter. What might matter is how often the bike is used, and the total mileage on the tire. Bead failure is not a normal sign of aging tire failure; those would be tread wear and, perhaps, dry rot and flaking sidewalls.
Time for my entry into the guessing game: User error fixing a flat. Excessive enthusiam using a tire iron to lever the tire off the rim without manhandling the tire to create sufficient slack, or perhaps kinking the tire while it's off the rim. Second guess would be underinflation, perhaps in concert with finding a nasty pothole. That could have started as a puncture that the rider didn't notice, so the 50 psi at the beginning of the ride was 20 psi when you found the pothole.
From potholes to potshots! Comments/responses?
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Crankycrank said the weight limit is 210 and by your numbers you would have been well over it by 50lbs 160+40+60≠>210.
Last edited by Trakhak; 02-01-24 at 01:15 PM.
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Five years is about right for a wire bead tire, sure some will last much longer, but there are several factors involved (I don't think weight is one in this case). See if there is a manufacturing date code on it, it may be older than five years.
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Actual wire bears breaking is a fairly rare cause of a flat. Far more common (and still no way near the usual reasons) with beds is the casing fabric is worn away from a brake pad not being well aligned and was rubbing the tire's side wall just above the rim. This acts much like a lathe tool cutting into a workpiece. Not what the OP describes at all.
After 5 years and what's likely many miles i agree with most here and will say the tire owes nothing. Well past any stated or unspoken warranty period. This is why it is the rider who bears the responsibility to monitor their bike. Had this tire been replaced after 4 years we would not be having this thread and the OP would still be happy. Andy
After 5 years and what's likely many miles i agree with most here and will say the tire owes nothing. Well past any stated or unspoken warranty period. This is why it is the rider who bears the responsibility to monitor their bike. Had this tire been replaced after 4 years we would not be having this thread and the OP would still be happy. Andy
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Actual wire beads breaking is a fairly rare cause of a flat. Far more common (and still no way near the usual reasons) with beds is the casing fabric is worn away from a brake pad not being well aligned and was rubbing the tire's side wall just above the rim. This acts much like a lathe tool cutting into a workpiece. Not what the OP describes at all.
After 5 years and what's likely many miles i agree with most here and will say the tire owes nothing. Well past any stated or unspoken warranty period. This is why it is the rider who bears the responsibility to monitor their bike. Had this tire been replaced after 4 years we would not be having this thread and the OP would still be happy.
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FWIW steel wire beads should last sometime shy of forever. But stuff happens, including minor damage to the tire at the bead during mounting. This can directly damage tire plies causing the tire to part from the bead, or it can allow water entry, rusting the bead leading to it's failure.
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FWIW overloading wouldn't cause a bead failure.
Overloading a tire would manifest different ways; pinch flats from bottoming or tread delamination and cracking from excess wall flex.
It would only cause blowouts or wall failure at the bead if you try to compensate with overinflation.
As noted above, tire liad ratings are per axle, so someplace between 30 and 70% of total weight depending on weight distribution.
However, all things considered, 5years service life for a tire isn't unreasonable, so replace and hope to do as well next time.
Overloading a tire would manifest different ways; pinch flats from bottoming or tread delamination and cracking from excess wall flex.
It would only cause blowouts or wall failure at the bead if you try to compensate with overinflation.
As noted above, tire liad ratings are per axle, so someplace between 30 and 70% of total weight depending on weight distribution.
However, all things considered, 5years service life for a tire isn't unreasonable, so replace and hope to do as well next time.
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Nevertheless, as you and others have said, the wire itself rarely fails. While there's no need to perform a full fault tree analysis, if (as I suspect) the tire was damaged by something the user did or didn't do, it's worthwhile to point out Things Not To Do Next Time. Changing tires every 3-4 years might prevent the problem, or might not. Better care changing tires can prevent a recurrence either next year, or five years from now.
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Op expected "many more years of service" from that tire. I wouldn't normally get irate over how obtuse people can get sometimes but o.p. had their kid in the suicide seat on the run where the tire shook off this mortal coil. That should attract some unwanted attention.
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