3alarmer 

.
... Robvolz , I wanted to let you know that there's an online group specifically devoted to SBDU bicycles, now that the origin of yours is clear. Here is a link. People are always listing frames and bikes they want to sell on there, so you might find someone interested in yours, because it's cheap enough that shipping is a possibility.

There's also a Facebook group, but I don't belong to it, so I don't know their selling policies.

As I stated earlier, these frames do have a following. But the Raleigh branded ones far outnumber the Raleigh USA ones.

zukahn1 

Yes the Raleigh USA Pro comp frames & bikes both road and MTB do have have a bit of a following a lot of the stuff like this one were basically the best commercially sold frames bikes one could actually buy from shop in the US or UK and a were a few hundred dollars cheaper than the more Flasher Italian stuff so most were actually raced road a lot. Rare to see one that is not beat half to death which is actually a good comment for these owners actually liked to race ride them so not garage queens.

Doug Fattic 

Let me give you my perspective as a framebuilder. This 753 Raleigh frame has some advantages for a knowledgable person. First of all many enthusiasts don't realize that almost every tube manufacturing brand makes tubes with different wall thicknesses and diameters (ø) and butt lengths. Those are what primarily determine the characteristics of the ride (all other things being the same like geometry) and not what brand made the tube. Most classic steel bicycles were made with .9/.6/.9mm wall thickness (like Columbus SL) or 1.0/.7/1.0 (like Columbus SP). In the 70's Reynolds came out with its 753 tubing. This tubing was heat treated so its thinner walls (sometimes but not always .7/.4/.7) would not get dented as easily. But also as a result of this treatment could not be cold set into alignment during the build process (like one could with 531). This makes building a frame with 753 much more difficult to do it accurate enough that it can be aligned within a high tolerance (there is no such thing as perfect alignment). Reynolds required that builders pass a test in order to make frames with 753. Otherwise there would be problems if made poorly and the reputation of 753 would suffer.

To put this 753 build difficulty into perspective, I was taking to Terry Bill at Reynolds in 1978. He told me that every single American up to that date had failed their test. None of them had built a frame that was either close enough in alignment or brazed with low enough temperature not to have hurt the steel. Eventually Americans did pass this test starting with Jim Merz. And Reyonlds eased off on the testing difficulty so they could sell more tubing.

I prefer the ride of a .7/.4/.7 frame over one with thicker walls. Their lighter weight is insignificant, the difference is in the feel of the frame. And yes I have made frames for myself with different wall thicknesses and I can tell the difference. Production manufacturers almost never made frames with 7/4/7 tubing. There is too much chance a fat person would ride and break it. So this Raleigh frame is one of the very few production frames made with very lightweight steel tubing. Most people that want to try one have to have them custom made. For another data point, I don't allow my framebuilding class students to build their frames with heat treated 7/4/7 tubing (unless I do the brazing of the main tubes for them). Building with it requires more experience.

I also would put the original fork back on this frame. Looking at the pictures, I think the black original fork is longer than the red fork. I'm speculating but I think that the owner wanted to switch brakes from a standard reach to a short reach. Nowadays people prefer using bigger tires and the original fork - with probably a 47/57 brake reach - can do that. The fork now on the frame i'm guessing is aluminum and put on to make the bike lighter. Also the red fork will change the geo of the frame a bit in a way its design was not intended.

I'd also lose all the parts and sell them separately. The bike equipped with that mishmash makes the frame appear to be cheaper than it really is. This frame is a chance for someone to try thinner walled tubing that for some will provide a superior ride (it sure does for me!). If the seller can explain to a potential buyer why thinner wall tubing is an advantage and hard to impossible to find in a production frame (some Japanese companies made some too), then that education can raise the value of the frame.

Doug Fattic 

I'll add one more factor to this discussion. Reynolds 753 steerers had a much thinner wall thickness at their butted end so they are lighter. If you measure the inside diameter of the steerer of the Raleigh fork at the bottom of the fork crown, there should be a significant difference between it and the red fork. This is a much less important place to remove weight. I don't remember now what the wall thickness was on 753 fork blades compared to 531 blades but there might have been some difference too. Like being.9mm thick instead of 1.0. Maybe.

cegerer

As a collector of race bikes, 753 is indeed very desirable! I think $500 is a fair price. But most collectors are going to immediately strip the bike and do a proper build-out with all correct parts. FYI: The number hanger is a desirable feature but does not always indicate an actual team bike. Example: I had a 1985 Gitane Professionnel. It was their top-of-the-line consumer race bike but was not a special-built team bike. All Professionnels came with number hangers and I suspect the same here but that does not detract from the bike's desirability.

Also, while we're discussing 753 and Doug is 'here' I wonder how many have heard of Columbus KL? I had a frame built by Matt Assenmacher in 1979. We had discussed using 753 but for some reason decided to use Columbus KL (this was supposedly Columbus's version of 753). Maybe Matt was not yet certified for 753?? Or more likely, I chose the KL because it was more obscure Anyway, the tubes took months to arrive and there were only 5 sets of the tubing sent to the USA at that time. I remember also that the frame was silver soldered. Turned out to be an awesome frame and I put a LOT of miles on it. I was at the shop when we opened the box of tubes and I was disappointed that there was not a special frame decal proclaiming KL!! It was just a generic Columbus decal. So today, it would be near impossible to identify a frame with KL unless the build history was known.

Doug Fattic 

Matt Assemmacher and I are both from Michigan although his shop in Swartz Creek (near Flint) is/was 220 miles north/east from mine in Niles just above the Indiana border near Notre Dame University. He learned at Bob Jackson located in Leeds, Yorkshire in 1972 (i think) after graduating from Central Michigan University. I also learned in Yorkshire in 1975 at Ellis Briggs in Shipley after I had gotten all the necessary state certifications to teach high school. The 2 shops are in the same metropolitan area only 17 miles apart but you had to wind around city streets to get from one to the other so they seemed much further apart. Matt recently retired if I understand correctly.

To get certified to build with 753 tubing, one had to spend £45 to buy the tubing and build a complete frame to send to England for testing. That is quite a commitment. I never took the test at the time because 2 early Raleigh 753 frames came into my shop for repairs with broken chain stays. They had either made them too brittle or too thin. Eventually Reynolds got it figured out right but by that tike I was using heat treated Tange Prestige. Any of these complications could have derailed Matt from sending in a 753 test frame. Eventually Reynolds test kit was just a few short stubs and a bottom bracket shell so it was easy for me or anyone else to pass the test.

I did make a frame for a customer out of Columbus KL tubing. Maybe more than one. It was a lighter version of their SL set. Nice stuff.

jdawginsc 

I don’t think I have ever seen a frame made from KL?

bikingshearer 

And that, children, is why Grandpa will never own a 753 frame. At better than 18 stone, it would be, shall we say, ill-advised. I don't know that I would break a 753 frame, but I bet it would feel whippy as hell to me.

sbarner 

An SB-prefixed serial number does not necessarily indicate that the frame was from SBDU Ilkeston. The SBDU serial numbers were not date-coded, but SB8438 is thought to be the last known frame from SBDU Ilkeston, after which production was moved to a section of the Nottingham operation in early 1987. I believe that at some point, RaleighUSA was importing the 753 frames from Raleigh England in primer, then painting them in the US to match the US models.

This makes the situation a bit like that of Masi USA where, to collectors, a Carlsbad frame is more desirable than a later version, even though the latter may be arguably a better frame, and a '74 or early '75 frame may command a much higher price than even a later Carlsbad frame. I've read screeds from Masiphiles who disparage anyone who values a us-built Masi frame over an Italian one, even if we all know that no one could tell the difference in the ride. Original paint SBDU frames command the highest prices, while Nottingham frames may generate little interest, and bonded 753 frames only yawns. BTW, the RaleighUSA 753 frame I have is was built in Nottingham sold with a painted-to-match bonded aluminum fork and there is a bit of a sawn-off number tab under the top tube that is covered by the original white paint.

La Brea Bike

This is the SBDU Source. SBDU Blog » My TI-Raleigh SBDU Blog » Denton Cycles

zukahn1 

Not sure it matter's much but I'm pretty sure the paint fit and finish on this one were done in the US finish but there was a lot of Kaos at Raleigh could be built US UK or Italy. As many have said not much difference value wise.

Robvolz 

there was a SBDU Ilkeston sticker.
Bike sold. I know the value now.

Thank you all.

Gary12000 

I think this frame as a true SB serial number is worth more than $500 on its own assuming no dents or damage.
i am surprised no one has mentioned Neil in the UK he has much knowledge on SBDU bikes...


https://www.youtube.com/@MyTIRaleighSBDU

iv'e found him to be very helpful in the past.