xuwol7

I have heard and read many accounts of how dangerous they are and that they will break.
Has anyone here personally had one break, know of someone who has or known anyone who ever died?
Urban myth or fact?

I recently acquired a PX-10 with the AVA stem.
I have tried to remove it but it is stuck bad, so I am keeping it lubed with penetrating oil but plan on still riding it.

Thanks for any help

XU

JPZ66

Heard about it, but no personal experience or firsthand accounts of breaking.

Joe

3alarmer

The stems I've seen on PX-10's, although they resemble the AVA
"death" stem, are a different casting.......I've used quite a few,
(the genuine AVA death stem) and none of them broke.

But I was concerned enough on several of them to shim them, because
as received they were in headsets that were too big, so they flexed
a little if you pulled on the bars much during climbs.

There are other threads on here about them, and I think there's
a whole thing on them in Sheldon Brown's website.

I replace them mostly now, when I can, but still have a few on
bikes that i ride occasionally (PX-10's).

oddjob2

I have bought and sold upwards of 20 Peugeot U-08s, various Carbolites, and Motobecane Mirages and have yet to see a bad quill stem or an obvious replacement.

3alarmer

There were some issues on some of the lower end Raleighs
in particular IIRC. The stem diameters were actually incorrect for
the headsets they ended up in (i.e. stem a little on the smaller side.)


I dunno, it was a long time ago.

https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...eath-Stem-quot

https://www.bikeforums.net/archive/in.../t-833803.html

https://www.bikeforums.net/archive/in.../t-708084.html

I have had the bars they come with fail on one occasion. so I
would never ride very far on the original bars without the
more modern steel sleeve reinforcing at the stem clamp.

ftwelder

No but I was working on a bike that had one and once dismantled I discovered it weighed about 1/2 of a typical Cinelli off the shelf. That did it for me.

big chainring 

I think this urban myth all started with a young French boy by the name of Jacques Anquetil. When leaving the house one morning to take a bike ride his mother, not fond of his obsession with cycling, shouted out, "You'll break your neck!". The young Jacques looked down at his neck/stem, an AVA, and pondered, "maybe I should upgrade before it breaks".

VeloBrox

Sheldon Brown's page wields enormous power in the C&V world - he decided that Crescent's were bad bikes, Helicomatic hubs were losers and that AVA's were death stems. Probably helps that Sheldon was an unbiased, extremely knowledgable man basing his statements on real-world experience.

gmt13

I had one on my commuting bike that was probably 40 years old and had no problems. Because of the scary threads on BF, I decided to replace it with a Kalloy. The new one started creaking within a few months and then started allowing the bars to slip. Upon tightening, I apparently damaged the bars because they broke shortly thereafter. End of story is that I am now using the AVA stem again.

-G

xuwol7

Thanks everyone,

The AVA stem on my PX-10 does appear to be different than those on my UO-8's.
I replaced 1 AVA stem on 1 of my UO-8's along time ago with a Pivo, but it seems they can be as bad.
I am going to ride my PX-10 today with the AVA stem as is, it does look very sturdy and clean.

Riding my newly acquired PX-10 is wonderful, I love the ride of my other Peugeots' but this puppy rides like a dream.
It is so quick and responsive and climbing hills is a breeze, amazing for a bike that is 40years old...wow

XU

dddd

It's important to remember that while there are notable differences in stiffness and strength between different brands/models of handlebars and stems, that there is perhaps an even bigger difference in the loadings that different riders will apply to their handlebar stem.

AVA stems are pretty flexy, but one typically notices this only when sprinting (or perhaps "heaving" on the bike during a steep climb).
So, it depends on usage: If you will be treating your handlebars like a piece of equipment in the weight room (as some riders do), or if you are on the stong/heavy side, then at some point these stems become a poor choice and should be replaced.

rootboy 

Reynolds 753

Probably due to it's dominance during the '70's when regular joe's where buying bikes at a lower price point and french brands were the main supplier, the stigma of inexpensive and cheap has remained to this day. Gitane, Motobecane, and Peugeot all obliged. At the time, other european manufacturers where too proud of their products (and brand) to produce low-end components to meet US consumer budgets. That being said, there are very well designed and made french components (ATAX being one of them) just not as common place in the US market.

Hate the model, not the make.

Rodion R

Dental work and hospital bills are a lot more expensive than a replacement quill stem.

I don't think it takes a lot of failures to develop a poor reputation. Stems shouldn't fail.

peter_d

My Peugeot came with an AVA stem and it was/is fine. The breakage problems with these stems occured at the top of the longitudinal expansion slot in the part that slides into the steerer tube. I suspect that breakage may have been more common on bikes set up with the stem high in the steerer tube or perhaps where the stem and steerer tube weren't a perfect fit. To the OP, when you get your stem out of the steerer use a magnifying glass and check carefully for any sign of cracking at the top of the expansion slot.

uncle uncle

I just pulled an AVA stem from a very small Carlton (Raleigh) frame today (26 inch wheels/a juvenile ten speed model). There was not a lot of stem showing. It was cracked at one of the top corners of the aft slot (the one nearest the rider) about 1/8 of inch. It was the AVA model with two slots, one aft and one forward. I gave the stem to the local coop owner, who had never seen one. He kept it as a learner tool to show others what they need to be looking for.

Tuc

I was surprised how light the AVA stem was on my U08, from what I have read I will replace it but there appears to be nothing wrong with the quality of the casting on a 1974 bike that has seen little use since then.

Captain Blight

I suspect the actual problem is the stress riser caused by the very well-machined slots having a very sharp inside corner. I further suspect that drilling out the top of the slot with a bit just large enough to erase the corners would fix the problem neatly. I did this to both my PIVO stems and it seems to be working so far.

OrangeHorse

Totally agree, and this is exactly why I swapped out my Pug mixte's stem. It just wasn't worth it to me to take the gamble.

Plus, it gave me a good excuse to get some new Velo Orange bars. Safe and stylish. Win, win.

realestvin7

This thread needs more pics.

rootboy 

I'd add some pics, but I can't seem to upload them from beyond the grave. You see ...I once used an AVA stem.

Chombi

Death Stems, Death forks, Death frames, Death cranks, Death brakes, Death derailleurs........what's life without some excitement anyway???.....I think a lot of folder riders take more chances with their bikes than anyone on bikes with these "death" components anyday...

PHT

My Mercier mixte came to me with a broken AVA stem. It was broken at the clamp. Maybe it was overtorqued.

jimmuller 

I'm still riding my UO8 w/AVA stem after 40 years. But I don't stress them so much, and I don't have it pulled all the way out either.

chune

My 72 Gitane Grand Sport De Luxe came with a broken AVA stem. Took it for a few rides before I noticed it was wobbly. Pulled it out and it had snapped part way down the straight part. Glad I caught it before I did any serious rides