BTinNYC 

R8000 Ultegra 11 speed comes mechanical/rim brake. I recently bought a 8000 mech/rim mini-group, shifters and derailleurs only, for about $400.

choddo

In my opinion, that is “best value for money” which is a tossup between 105 and Ultegra for me. “Best” is something different.

choddo

Same experience. Had DA9000 and DA9100 mechanical for a good price on 2 bikes. Sublime. At full price for the group alone I’d find it hard to justify. And at 3100 vs 1600 GBP for the Di2 vs Ultegra, not a chance.

choddo

I think they changed the manufacturing process didn’t they? So if you buy new 11speed today you are not getting the issue.

veganbikes

But the best is not the third place offering. Again you don't go to say the Saudi Arabian GP for Formula 1 last night and here over the announcements the best driver was Charles Leclerc who came in third place, Max Verstappen was just OK only coming in 1st.

I hear what you are saying in terms of value for money 105 is an excellent groupset and I agree it is fantastic in what it is but Ultegra is better in the looks department and Dura-Ace is top performance and lower weight and is where it is for a reason. You don't see the pro peloton riding with 105 and they want to ride with the best for a reason because they want to be the best and the best is #1 not #3

Some definitions of "best":
of the most excellent, effective, or desirable type or quality.
to the highest degree; most.
that which is the most excellent, outstanding, or desirable.

Again 105 is great it is a solid groupset with zero frills but excellent performance for the average rider, it looks average but punches above its weight. However again it is not the best or Shimano would not make Ultegra and then Dura-Ace above that. You would have had the 105 25th Anniversary groupset and not Dura-Ace.

Mikebike12

I am sorry but I think I may have chosen my words incorrectly. I did indeed say the “best” but if a recent 105 is nearly as good and the only thing different is the weight, then I’ll be ok with 105. The thing I was getting caught up on was the number. Is 7000, 6800? That is where I am getting lost.

i do have a budget (rather the wife has the budget) and she’s not going to go for $1000

I would have written this earlier but the system wouldn’t let me post more than 10 posts in 24 hours.

icemilkcoffee 

With the latest R9200 Dura Ace crankset they gave up on the glued construction for the left crank arm and went back to the 105 style welded construction. So that tells you they don’t have all that much faith in glued construction any longer.

icemilkcoffee 

R7000 is the 2nd generation 105 11 speed groupset. The latest 105 groupset is the 12 speed R7100- but that one only uses hydro disk brakes.
6800 is the 1st gen Ultegra 11 speed groupset. It was succeeded by the R8000 generation 11 speed. The current Ultegra is the R8100 12 speed- Di2 only, no mechanical option.
you never mentioned what your problem is with your existing groupset but frankly spending $1000 to gain one extra cog is big waste of money. If anything it will probably perform worse because you’ll have to trim more due to the wider cassette.

Do you have tubeless wheels? How about power meter? Those are much bigger bang-for-your-bucks upgrades.

choddo

He said he’s NOT going to spend $1000 :-)

choddo

Exactly. And the revved Ultegra FC-08 & DA FC-09 11 speed stuff the same now.

Which of course does mean to get the 11speed “fixed” construction, it looks a bit weird with the hybrid 12speed/11speed thing going on which makes 105 R7000 actually probably the best option. I’ve changed my mind.

smd4

I hear you. Sounds like 105 will be fine for your needs.

Mikebike12

Think that probably settles it. 105 7000, unless I can get a great deal on the Ultegra 6800 or 8000.

choddo

And the 6800 has the recall issue. I still have it on a bike and it’s fine but if I was buying new I would probably avoid. The problem seems to occur in wet conditions causing galvanic corrosion so if you live in a desert you’d probably be ok.

8000 is 12speed but FC-08 is the frankenstein job they did to fix the issue by mating the 12speed 8000 crank to custom 11speed chainrings. And they don’t quite look right but most people would never notice.

Why you can’t just use a vanilla 12speed crankset with an 11speed chain and cassette is one of those “not quite optimal” Shimano things imho.

kommisar

IMO the xtr 900 group of the early-mid 90s was the pinnacle of mechanical parts.

zacster

I never gave it a thought when I put an 11sp 105 7000 crank on an otherwise 9sp setup. It works absolutely fine. Is 12sp any different that it wouldn't work with 11sp?

choddo

Supposedly it matters. I personally reckon no human would notice the difference.

zacster

Maybe it matters to Shimano's accountants. They of course want you to upgrade everything at once.

BTinNYC 

I have an Ultegra 12 speed crankset working perfectly with a 9 speed group.

squirtdad

Ultegra 8000 is 11 speed, not 12

8100 is 12 speed

choddo

Sorry!

and 8000 is also part of the recall (if its batch numbers match I guess)

So FC-08 is a frankenstein 8100 then.

squirtdad

yep r8000 is part of recall, my crankset apparently built after production fixes and was not part of the recall. I am trying to remember when I bought it (I was stashing parts in anticipation of pulling trigger on a custom build) 2021 I think

zymphad

Would agree if want best its Dura Ace obviously.

Sub $1000 would be Ultegra R8000.

I am running R7000 with Ultegra direct mount brakes and loving it. But then I upgraded from 5800. For me its the hood shape is most improvement so I know I would be just as happy with R8000, my impression R7000 and R8000 have same hood shape.

Or simply IMO go with whatever groupset is most comfortable to you.

Hondo6

You got a 2x11-speed Santé groupset?That I wanna see!