Debusama

That is kind of where I started. When I am able to shift onto the large chain ring without having it fall of most the time (there is no point where it is100%; given enough tries it will always fall off) there is no amount of cable tension that will have any effect on how it shifts from the other half of the cassette. In fact, if you look at the first picture you can see how shredded the the shifter cable is from pulling so hard on it with my 4th hand tool in an effort to so exactly what you described (I have since replaced the shifter cable).

Debusama

I turned it in some, and although it seems like it might have helped some, it still drops every now an then.

ColinL

You should loosen the barrel adjuster, then pull not-so-ridiculously-hard and screw down the shift cable. Now tighten the barrel. It should be very possible to get all the tension you need this way.

Any cycling buddies that could stop by and give you another set of eyes on it? Even if they haven't used SRAM it could help. If they have... of course that helps even more.

Debusama

Oh, believe me, that was the first course of action. it wasn't until that didn't work, that I started pulling unreasonably hard. As I mentioned, I have a teammate who is having similar troubles and both of our bikes have been subject to many pairs of eyes and screw drivers at the trail-heads and parking lots after rides. I appreciate everyone's suggestions and the time you've put into trying to help. I'm leaving on my trip soon though and I have a 105 derailleur I can put on for now just to get me going for the weekend. Maybe I'll try the Force when I get back (although if the 105 works flawlessly, I don't see myself rocking the boat) for round two.

GDA

FWIW - After about 6k miles on my SRAM Force/Red groupset I also started having shifting problems on the front and sometimes would encounter a drop to the outside of the big ring. After about 2 months I finally solved the problem - my drive side bottom bracket bearing had started to collapse and was very worn. New bottom bracket and all is good.

danvuquoc

I'll be hauling ass home today to install this on my 2011 SRAM Red group equipped bike. My initial impression is that the cage is noticeably beefier, ignore the gratuitous use of an iPad as a backdrop, I was just really pleased with WKYC's ability to get me the FD really quickly.

WestMass

I've thrown the chain from my 105 fd and it's generally less smooth than my other bike with rival. I've been amazed so far with how fast and smooth. The SRAM is.

Debusama

Well, I just installed my 105 FD. It's working great on the stand. It still has the quick snappy shifting it had before when when the chain wasn't falling off or getting jammed (that must be thanks to the shifters more than the derailleur), but I didn't have any trouble getting it adjusted. Maybe it's because I'm used to working with Shimano, but I didn't see anything from Sram, or anything anyone told me here indicating that there was anything special abut the installation procedure for a Sram vs any other front derailleur. I find it interesting that I can so easily adjust one but not the other.... maybe there was just something wrong with that particular derailleur; something got bent out of shape in the manufacturing and/or shipping process? I don't know. incidently, the Derailleur+clamp weight of the 105 was 5g less.

Mansram01

Let me know how it goes. Thinking about doing the same with my old Red FD.

Inertianinja

Guys, this reminds me. Check out this post by another user re: setting up a FD without a barrel adjuster - it has helped me tremendously with FD setup on my last few bikes:

danvuquoc

Well, things are good, I have it installed and fine tuned and rode it into work this morning. Here are my thoughts, in some random order.

- The FD COMES with an inline cable tension adjuster and both the video and install sheet. This didn't come with the previous FDs, and honestly I think this solves 95% of the real issues people have with the SRAM FD. I'm betting most people that complain about the FD have no ability to fine tune the cable tension and it causes most of the FD shifting issues.
- The FD is noticeably stiffer and solid when shifting, I think I'm still breaking in the FD wound spring as it is a bit stiff right now, it'll loosen up just like the previous FD did.
- Sure the Yaw thing is cool to market, and I don't get any chain rub at all except for small chain ring to smallest cassette ring. But who actually cross chains those? The big chainring of course works over the entire rear cogset, front lever trim or not.
- I wish I could modify the front shifter mechanics to get rid of the trim option.
- If you use a FD clamp to mount your FD to your bike, your old FD clamp will not work with either your old FD bolt or your new FD bolt. The new FD bolt has a wider base which prevents it from being seated correctly into the old clamp. The old bolt fits, but is too long and bottoms out within the FD's mounting body.
- The chain catcher does not work with clamp-on style bands, only with most braze-on mounts, the reason for this is that they include a curved plastic washer with an adjustment stop on it that is made specifically for the chain catcher. Since it is curved, it doesn't work on the flat mounting surface of the clamp-on bands. They COULD have included two different mounts... but they didn't. Sucks.
- I solved my FD clamp/chaincatcher/bolt issues by using the old clamp, the new bolt, and sanding down the mounting surface of the plastic washer for the chaincatcher until it was flat.
- The front shifts back up to the big chain ring under reasonable power now. Standing up and climbing, not so much.
- The in-line cable tension adjuster included with the FD blows. Go buy yourself something more heavy duty like one of the Jagwire ones. The included one broke on me just by playing with it.

ColinL

dan,

so you had a 1st gen red braze-on FD with a clamp-on adapter, and you bought only the new 2nd gen braze-on FD?

I pre-ordered a 2012 Red FD from competitive cyclist and if you chose clamp-on (either size) they included a new clamp-on adapter with the braze-on FD. In other words, I think you needed the 2012 clamp-on adapter rather than modifying your existing one.

Mine won't ship until the 31st or something like that, so I won't have any hands-on until early April.

danvuquoc

Correct -- All Red FDs are braze-on from my understanding.

When you selected the clamp style @ Competitive Cyclist, they are sending you the same box I got with the FD, and then a little SRAM baggie with a clamp adapter. You paid $22 extra for that clamp adapter. I just didn't figure the clamp would be different and I could re-use my adapter but was mistaken either way, I made it work.

Sucks you have to wait, be sure to use the install video SRAM provides on YouTube, because the FD install instructions on paper are horrible compared to the video.

Debusama

I think the force was the same way; a braze-on derailleur + clamp&adapter, which is why the total weight was actually more than the 105 clamp-on FD. I also wonder if that might have had something to do with why it was so hard to get adjusted properly. I would be interested to know if all the people who said their force FD worked great had a braze on or clamp on setup. Either way, it shifted perfectly through 150+ miles of riding this weekend, so I'm keeping it the way it is.

Werkin

Force FD with Problem Solvers brand clamp.

foresthill

My force FD has a built-in clamp

adriano 

that barrel adjuster is sweet! i wonder if my rival speen umlenker will let me use this as a top pull.

Dancing Skeleton

I had endless problems with my Force FD dropping the chain & having rough shifts. Several attempts by different mechanics did almost nothing to help. I finally put on an Ultegra 6600 myself, and had no issues, except that I lost use of some of my rear cogs.
I then had a new Force FD replaced under warranty, and so far it has been fine.
The only remaining issue is the cosmetic damage to my crank, it looks like a dog chewed on it.
My feeling is that Sram should replace it.

There have been many threads about problems with Sram FD's.

Try the warranty replacement route. It worked for me.

Debusama

The guy who built my bike just traded my Force out for the 105 he happened to have in his shop to get me going, and said he'd get a new Force derailleur so we can try again if I wanted (I'm sure he'll probably go through the Sram warranty to get it). As it is, its shifting as quickly, quietly and smoothly as anything I've ridden, so I might just let him keep the Force derailleur, and leave my bike as it is.

c_bake

I've used Force the last couple years, last season I constantly tinkered and fiddled with the FD attempting to get it to shift correctly. It was 50/50, slow shifts or dumping the chain on the outside, rediculous...I lost all confidence when shifting...its a bad feeling when your riding fast in a group and when its time to shift your thinking "oh please don't dump the chain"

This year I took it to a shop that claimed they knew alot about adjusting SRAM...I have 1700 miles on it and so far so good...it shifts on a dime, very precise. I don't know what adjustments they made, I didn't ask, all I know is they got it to do something that I couldn't. I can now run the 34 with the 12 without chainrub, something SRAM claims their FD is meant to do.

Dancing Skeleton

Do you use a 11-28 or 12-28, or I should ask "What's your smallest rear cog? Is the 12t the outermost cog or do you have an 11t?"

I have had no problems with shifts or with chain rub on the FD cage using the 12t (I run a 11-28) since my warranty replacement Force FD was installed.

Peter

c_bake

Its a 12-28.

Mansram01

Thanks for the feedback. Been meaning to thank you before. Of course, when I tried looking for the new Yaw FD to order, it seems to be out-of-stock everywhere. I'll resume my search tomorrow morning.

Steve90068

email andy@speedgoatbikes.com

zigmeister

This I found to be very important. Basically on the inner/outer limit, when in the gear that is furthest on that same side, like Large Ring/Smallest ring, I set the FD limit so the chain is basically barely touching the outside portion of the FD cage. Same as the inner, but not as close. On the inside, I'm just not as aggressive, I've never had the chain go up into the spokes unless you have too short of a chain and it pulls the RD too close to the spokes. Or the limit was way off. Same with dropping the chain on the inside where it is almost touching the inside portion of the cage.

Also, I would ensure you set the height of the outer portion of the FD cage so it is literally 2mm above the tallest big chainring tooth on the ring. Some teeth are slightly taller than others, find the tallest, ensure the outer portion is literally 2mm above that., no higher. If you leave a larger gap on that outside cage, the chain has too much room to pass over the chainring teeth and under the steel cage and drop off the big ring.

I would also like to add, I switched from Sram Red with a titanium cage to a steel cage. Shifting is much quicker/snappier, particularly when jumping up onto the big ring. I never had a jumping issue off the big ring with the titanium cage. Shifting was good with the titanium cage, and I wondered why the Pros would run the steel cages, but until I ran one myself, you just don't know. It really is much quicker/responsive with the steel cage.

Hence, I had my chain jumping a few times off the big ring onto my new cranks too!! A few quick adjustments, and I think I got it to not do that anymore. Plus, slamming the shifter can make it jump to hard/fast to the upper ring. I also find just slowly/methodically pushing the lever for it to move up helps with inadvertent chain jumping over the big ring. I try not to just slam a lever anyhow and be smooth.