jet sanchEz

Yup, agreed. Great thread, glad those pics are now linked.

CicliItaliani

alfredo binda

papik

J.ANQUETIL Grand prix des Nations 1953 cycles LA PERLE

papik

Hugo KOBLET winner Tour de France 1951 on LA PERLE

CbadRider

Graphic photos are against the forum Vulgarity guidelines.

Vulgarity

As a community with a diverse variety of members and readers, we ask that our members to post without using vulgarity. Vulgarity not only includes vulgar language and pictures but also sexist, racist, anti-religious, images of graphic violence, political statements and homophobic language which may offend other members. In addition, the "masking" of vulgarity by inserting * or another keystroke in place of one or more letters in a vulgar term is unacceptable in most cases. It will also be impermissible to anagramize a word to bypass the filters. This applies to all content submitted by users including posts, PMs, avatars and signatures.

jimmuller 

I have no disagreement with DBR or anyone else over Forum rules. Good judgment in a society is a good thing. Without it there would be no society at all.

It is worth noting that bicycle racing is and has always been a dangerous sport. Photos in this thread, including some which have been removed, remind us how tough it can be and how tough the men and women who race must be to be competitive. They remind us that life itself is a serious business.

IIRC, Henri Desgrange once said of his TdF that the ideal race would be one in which only one rider survived to the end. He wanted spectacle and he got what he wanted, modern gladiators. Disturbing pictures from the disturbing thoughts which caused them into being. They show what the world might be like if we had no society. We need that reminder every so often, in the proper time and place.

JJScaliger

Less platitudes and more pics...

Gimondi and Merckx



I saw an interview once where Gimondi said in an effort to beat Merckx to the line he clenched his teeth so hard he dislocated his jaw!

jbchybridrider 

Don Allen, Where Are They Now? Don Allan | CyclingTips







Beating Merckx

jbchybridrider 

Vintage Cadel. Last stage race tomorrow 25/1/2015, here!!

Dolanarc1

Looks like a Kellogs city center race in GB around 1985

L-R Phil Anderson, Jan Raas, Phil Thomas in Yellow, Sid Barras

Dolanarc1

Danny Clarke, guaranteed

poprad

One of my lesser-known favorite riders: Luxembourger Francois Faber, TdF winner, WWI hero. I'd love to meet him and hear the stories of the early TdFs and the escapades that ensued:

François Faber photo gallery by BikeRaceInfo

Chombi

What disturbed me about those pics was it felt like we might not be respecting the deceased champion rider by viewing those pics of him all broken up, dead and bloody on the road. It is most likely that he and his family would have wanted us all to remember him as a champion and not a bloody casualty of bicycle racing, and rather not have those pics viewed constantly and gawked at, unfortunately, sometimes for shock value by the public.
Sure it's a free society, freedom of press and expression and je suis charlie....... but it is good if everyone could always temper that with as much civility when we can. Eventually, that's the only way we all can get along in this world......

Chombi

I also suspected that wasn't Phil, but the look on those eyes is very similar to Phil's when he's racing....

old's'cool

@Chombi,

marius

On You Tube:

Vive le tour

marius

Dear Icepick

You can find the film " Vive le Tour" on YouTube

Repack Rider

Lifted without attribution from my website. I see why they call you Lazyass. Probably thought I wouldn't notice.

Everyone here uses other people's photos, like, um, mine above. Seems like cheating to me. Didn't anyone ever go to a bike race?

Here's another of mine from the 1985 Giro, Francesco Moser in the Prologue, finishing in the Roman stadium in Verona. It's copyright but someone is going to steal it anyway and not mention who took it.

Force 

That Giro photo is very cool. It's pretty easy to pull images from a Google search, which I'm guessing people are doing here. You might want to imprint your name or website on your photos that you put on the internet. I would call the use of these photos on this thread fair use, not stealing.

gaucho777 

Sorry, but fair use does not apply. There are four criteria used to determine applicability of fair use. There is some grey area when determining fair use, but re-posting copyrighted photos on the internet, especially in the context of this thread, does not meet any of those criteria.

+1 to that Giro photo being very cool. Thanks for sharing Repack Rider!

Force 

Please elaborate. Isn't a factor whether it is for commercial use or not, as here? So, your conclusion is that these posts are actionable copyright violations?

gaucho777 

U.S. Copyright Office - Fair Use

Factors used in determining fair use:

1. The purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes
2. The nature of the copyrighted work
3. The amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole
4. The effect of the use upon the potential market for, or value of, the copyrighted work

----

1. The fact that the images were re-posted without profit motivation does not then make it fair use. (See LA Times vs. Free Republic) Further, this website does generate revenue, from advertisers and member subscriptions. People come here because of the content, and that traffic drives revenue for Internet Brands. Also, there is no context or argument being made. If a blogger wanted to make an argument about the history of bicycle technology, or some other topic, and wrote at length and used selected images to support these arguments, that would help support a case for fair use. The images in this thread are just for gawking, with almost no captions, citation information provided or educational arguments being made.

2. Nature of the copyrighted work. Photographs or professional athletes in a specific time & place are highly protected. A table of data freely available from the U.S. Census, not so much.

3. A photograph is the whole copyrighted work. Fair use entitles an author to use a brief extract from another author's work for the purpose of supporting their argument. But it does not entitle one to use another's work in its entirety. Poetry, for example, is treted more strictly than prose, in part because quoting a stanza from a poem often copies a greater portion of the work (i.e. the complete poem). In this case, photos are being reproduced in their entirety, and the copyrighted photo comprises the entirety of the post/copyright infringement.

4. The effect of the use on the potential market. By posting copyrighted photos, especially without proper citation or credit lines, it devalues the assets of the photographer. Let's say a publisher of a Moser biography is looking for a cover image. They want to find an image that is striking but not over-used. The image above may be a great candidate. But if 5 years from now, every internet thread on Moser has a copy of that image re-posted, and all cycling fans come to know that image, then it loses it's impact, and potentially, loses its value to the photographer. This last criteria can also be used to prohibit use which would vastly increase the value of the new work (bikeforums.net). Let's say someone wanted to write a book about the fashion style of the Beatles. If the author wrote 100 words about the Beatles questionable fashion sense and then filled the pages with copyrighted photos of the Beatles, they would have a had time claiming fair use. People are going to buy the book because of the photos, and those photos greatly increase the value of the Beatles fashion book. Some of these traditional fair use criteria start to break down in the free internet environment, but I do not believe there is potentially significant change in value (both increasing the value of Internet Brands by generating traffic & ad revenue, and decreasing the value of the photo for the photographer/copyright holder).

FWIW, I am a rights manager at an academic publishing house, so I regularly assess applicability of fair use.

Edit: And, just so I don't come across as too high & mighty, I'll admit that I have occasionally reposted images without proper permission. I do try to provide source/link and credit if possible. I have really enjoyed looking at all the wonderful photos in this thread, but I wish more of the photos had at least included proper credit lines or links to their original sources.

crank_addict

Bloody good pics posted at McGann's Publishing (of Torelli Imports) - Bike Race Info
Photo and video galleries by BikeRaceInfo

Personally, I don't get the arguments of viewing and reading any and all on the net, links, repost, uploaded copyright content. 100% of the sites are spambot adverts anyways. Who's the profiteer?

Repack Rider

It's not about "fair use." The bloody crash photo has made it around the world several times.

For me, it's only about attribution. Who took that photo? Where did you find it?

Force 

gaucho777 - Yikes, didn't mean for you to take so much time to respond. Are you an attorney? If so, can you point me to a case more on point than LA Time v. Free Republic? There were some bad facts in that case. I'm genuinely interested in the topic, but, with all due respect, not entirely convinced in this instance. Feel free to PM to avoid further distraction.