Tight lockring, but loose sprocket ?
#1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2021
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Tight lockring, but loose sprocket ?
Hello!
I've recently installed a Shimano Deore m5100 11-51t 11speed sprocket to my mountain bike. My rear hub is a Shimano TX505.
I've tightened the lockring with the recommended 40nm, with a torque wrench.
After like a 5km ride on a bumpy road, I'm able to "rotate" the chain rings individually from each other on the hub, but just for like 1-2mm.
The interesting part is, my lock ring is still tight. I can't tighten it more with 40nm. If I tighten them with 50nm, it will be fine for another 5 kilometers, and then same thing.
I've allready tried to replace the included plastic spacers with steel ones, and looked all over the internet. The lock ring is not nesting on the top of the hub, it's pushing down on the sprocket. No broken rivets on the spider.
I dont have shifting problems, but I'm concerned if I keep riding like this, it will damage the hub and/or the sprocket.
Is it fine like this? Do anyone have an idea or a solution?
Thank you!
I've recently installed a Shimano Deore m5100 11-51t 11speed sprocket to my mountain bike. My rear hub is a Shimano TX505.
I've tightened the lockring with the recommended 40nm, with a torque wrench.
After like a 5km ride on a bumpy road, I'm able to "rotate" the chain rings individually from each other on the hub, but just for like 1-2mm.
The interesting part is, my lock ring is still tight. I can't tighten it more with 40nm. If I tighten them with 50nm, it will be fine for another 5 kilometers, and then same thing.
I've allready tried to replace the included plastic spacers with steel ones, and looked all over the internet. The lock ring is not nesting on the top of the hub, it's pushing down on the sprocket. No broken rivets on the spider.
I dont have shifting problems, but I'm concerned if I keep riding like this, it will damage the hub and/or the sprocket.
Is it fine like this? Do anyone have an idea or a solution?
Thank you!
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Mountain Brook. AL
Posts: 4,002
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 303 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 136 Times
in
104 Posts
One possibility is notching of the hub splines by prior sprockets such that the new sprockets don't properly seat on the hub.
Pull all the cassette cogs off and examine the splines on the hub for notching, file off any protuberances
and try again. Also examine the lock ring threads in the hub to be sure no cross threading occurred- did this
once and it is hard to fix and not initially obvious when it occurs. Fortunately with most lock rings now plastic
this is less likely than with aluminum lock rings.
Pull all the cassette cogs off and examine the splines on the hub for notching, file off any protuberances
and try again. Also examine the lock ring threads in the hub to be sure no cross threading occurred- did this
once and it is hard to fix and not initially obvious when it occurs. Fortunately with most lock rings now plastic
this is less likely than with aluminum lock rings.
Last edited by sch; 09-24-21 at 08:59 AM.
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Mission Viejo
Posts: 5,807
Bikes: 1986 Cannondale SR400 (Flat bar commuter), 1988 Cannondale Criterium XTR, 1992 Serotta T-Max, 1995 Trek 970
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1944 Post(s)
Liked 2,164 Times
in
1,323 Posts
Sounds like the lockring is bottoming out on the freehub body. You could be merely torquing the lockring against the freehub body. It tightens enough to hold things together, but not enough to keep the cogs from moving.
I see no advantage using steel spacers over plastic.
You might have to add a shim before or after the cassette on the freehub body.
I've unpin some of my cassettes for custom gearing and have no issues with movement.
John
I see no advantage using steel spacers over plastic.
You might have to add a shim before or after the cassette on the freehub body.
I've unpin some of my cassettes for custom gearing and have no issues with movement.
John
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Nor-Cal
Posts: 3,767
Bikes: lots
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1958 Post(s)
Liked 2,932 Times
in
1,489 Posts
One possibility is notching of the hub splines by prior sprockets such that the new sprockets don't properly seat on the hub.
Pull all the cassette cogs off and examine the splines on the hub for notching, file off any protuberances
and try again. Also examine the lock ring threads in the hub to be sure no cross threading occurred- did this
once and it is hard to fix and not initially obvious when it occurs. Fortunately with most lock rings now plastic
this is less likely than with aluminum lock rings.
Pull all the cassette cogs off and examine the splines on the hub for notching, file off any protuberances
and try again. Also examine the lock ring threads in the hub to be sure no cross threading occurred- did this
once and it is hard to fix and not initially obvious when it occurs. Fortunately with most lock rings now plastic
this is less likely than with aluminum lock rings.
#5
Full Member
Another possibility is that your highest/smallest sprocket is not correctly aligned. Is the small sprocket tight, and the rest are loose?
Likes For cuevélo:
#6
Sr Member on Sr bikes
Here’s another possibility that I’ve had to deal with on varying cassettes. And sorry…the picture below is the only one I could find to explain it. Sometime on the back side (or spoke side) of a cassette the bolt or rivets holding the gears together may not be flush, or flat. Depending on the hub…you may or may not need a spacer if the rivet/bolt is flush/flat. If I don’t insert the spacer, the lock ring bottoms out and doesn’t completely tighten the cassette onto the hub. I was able to purchase spacers of varying thickness at an LBS. If this is in fact your issue…remember that the spacer can go either before the cassette, or before the lock ring. And, it will likely require the shifting to be adjusted. — Dan
#7
I'm good to go!
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 14,992
Bikes: Tarmac Disc Comp Di2 - 2020
Mentioned: 51 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6196 Post(s)
Liked 4,811 Times
in
3,319 Posts
Are you certain about the rear hub model. I'm not certain a 11 speed cassette will work with just any 9 speed Shimano rear or what ever yours is.
A FH-TX505-8 is a 8 speed free hub that is compatible with 9 speed cassettes, but I'm not sure if that moves on up the road in compatibility with 11 speed cassettes.
A FH-TX505-8 is a 8 speed free hub that is compatible with 9 speed cassettes, but I'm not sure if that moves on up the road in compatibility with 11 speed cassettes.
Last edited by Iride01; 09-24-21 at 10:44 AM.
#8
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2021
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Here’s another possibility that I’ve had to deal with on varying cassettes. And sorry…the picture below is the only one I could find to explain it. Sometime on the back side (or spoke side) of a cassette the bolt or rivets holding the gears together may not be flush, or flat. Depending on the hub…you may or may not need a spacer if the rivet/bolt is flush/flat. If I don’t insert the spacer, the lock ring bottoms out and doesn’t completely tighten the cassette onto the hub. I was able to purchase spacers of varying thickness at an LBS. If this is in fact your issue…remember that the spacer can go either before the cassette, or before the lock ring. And, it will likely require the shifting to be adjusted. — Dan
Are you certain about the rear hub model. I'm not certain a 11 speed cassette will work with just any 9 speed Shimano rear or what ever yours is.
A FH-TX505-8 is a 8 speed free hub that is compatible with 9 speed cassettes, but I'm not sure if that moves on up the road in compatibility with 11 speed cassettes.
A FH-TX505-8 is a 8 speed free hub that is compatible with 9 speed cassettes, but I'm not sure if that moves on up the road in compatibility with 11 speed cassettes.
Also to answer some:
There is no wear on my hub, it's almost brand new. I've checked the threading on the lock ring and in the hub before, it appears to be fine.
Thank you for all your answers. I've made a video of the problem.
Please note that i'm pushing down on the pedal so the hub is tightened.
At the moment the casette is also tightened way above the recommended torque range, between 50-60 nm.
At 40 nm the movement is about the same, but it requires less force to jiggle.
youtube .com/watch?v=jDuhRjfeIOM
(please remove the spaces, I can't post links, new account)
Last edited by cb400bill; 09-24-21 at 07:16 PM.
#9
Full Member
Are you certain about the rear hub model. I'm not certain a 11 speed cassette will work with just any 9 speed Shimano rear or what ever yours is.
A FH-TX505-8 is a 8 speed free hub that is compatible with 9 speed cassettes, but I'm not sure if that moves on up the road in compatibility with 11 speed cassettes.
A FH-TX505-8 is a 8 speed free hub that is compatible with 9 speed cassettes, but I'm not sure if that moves on up the road in compatibility with 11 speed cassettes.
#10
Senior Member
Are you certain about the rear hub model. I'm not certain a 11 speed cassette will work with just any 9 speed Shimano rear or what ever yours is.
A FH-TX505-8 is a 8 speed free hub that is compatible with 9 speed cassettes, but I'm not sure if that moves on up the road in compatibility with 11 speed cassettes.
A FH-TX505-8 is a 8 speed free hub that is compatible with 9 speed cassettes, but I'm not sure if that moves on up the road in compatibility with 11 speed cassettes.
https://www.lightbicycle.com/newslet...ty-Manual.html
If that's indeed the case, he may need the 1mm spacer normally required to use a 10-speed cassette on a 8/9/10-speed hub to take up the extra space.
#11
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2021
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I've tried to reply to you all, but it's awaiting some moderator approval. It's a mountain bike sprocket, on a mountain bike hub, on a mountain bike.
The shimano website lists the hub compatible with 11 speed. Should I try to install an 1mm spacer behind the casette? I've tried it with a 2mm spacer, but the lockring will not quite reach the hub to thread in.
I've already checked the thread on the hub and the lock ring, it appears to be fine. Also, the hub is almost brand new, no visible damage or wear on the splines so far.
The shimano website lists the hub compatible with 11 speed. Should I try to install an 1mm spacer behind the casette? I've tried it with a 2mm spacer, but the lockring will not quite reach the hub to thread in.
I've already checked the thread on the hub and the lock ring, it appears to be fine. Also, the hub is almost brand new, no visible damage or wear on the splines so far.
#12
Sr Member on Sr bikes
I've tried to reply to you all, but it's awaiting some moderator approval. It's a mountain bike sprocket, on a mountain bike hub, on a mountain bike.
The shimano website lists the hub compatible with 11 speed. Should I try to install an 1mm spacer behind the casette? I've tried it with a 2mm spacer, but the lockring will not quite reach the hub to thread in.
I've already checked the thread on the hub and the lock ring, it appears to be fine. Also, the hub is almost brand new, no visible damage or wear on the splines so far.
The shimano website lists the hub compatible with 11 speed. Should I try to install an 1mm spacer behind the casette? I've tried it with a 2mm spacer, but the lockring will not quite reach the hub to thread in.
I've already checked the thread on the hub and the lock ring, it appears to be fine. Also, the hub is almost brand new, no visible damage or wear on the splines so far.
Dan
#13
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2021
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Also I made a video of the problem, please note that I'm pressing on the pedal to tighten it.
It's on youtube, but I cant post links yet. watch?v=jDuhRjfeIOM
It's on youtube, but I cant post links yet. watch?v=jDuhRjfeIOM
#15
Method to My Madness
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: Orange County, California
Posts: 3,664
Bikes: Trek FX 2, Cannondale Synapse, Cannondale CAAD4, Santa Cruz Stigmata GRX
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1948 Post(s)
Liked 1,472 Times
in
1,020 Posts
This is the most likely explanation. The smallest rear cog only sits halfway on the end of the freehub, so it is easily misaligned during installation.
#16
Full Member
#17
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Mission Viejo
Posts: 5,807
Bikes: 1986 Cannondale SR400 (Flat bar commuter), 1988 Cannondale Criterium XTR, 1992 Serotta T-Max, 1995 Trek 970
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1944 Post(s)
Liked 2,164 Times
in
1,323 Posts
You know, an 11t will not slide all the way onto the freehub body. So you could probably torque it without even using the rest of the cassette.
For this reason you might need a thin spacer behind the cassette, which has already been suggested above, so you are actually torquing the cassette and not just the first cog.
John
Edit added: While a bit OT, I’m running a 14t 11 speed 1st position cog with an 8 speed setup. It appears to be designed to interlock with an 11 speed 2nd position cog and an 11t lockring is also required since it sits off the freehub body.
For this reason you might need a thin spacer behind the cassette, which has already been suggested above, so you are actually torquing the cassette and not just the first cog.
John
Edit added: While a bit OT, I’m running a 14t 11 speed 1st position cog with an 8 speed setup. It appears to be designed to interlock with an 11 speed 2nd position cog and an 11t lockring is also required since it sits off the freehub body.
Last edited by 70sSanO; 09-24-21 at 08:32 PM.