ericlowney 

A friend sent me this link on EBay France, and it’s at least interesting… I’m considering making an offer but hard to figure out a price for this bike. Any help? I translated the ad to English below. I had been looking for an international or paramount, I think this would be much lighter.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/31414432418...emis&media=SMSRare no name high-end bicycle frame

inscription under CINELLI S.C FRANCE bottom bracket


it is provided with a clip to hang the runner's bib number (professional frame)

it was common in the 70s/80s for a rider to ride on a frame repainted in their team colors

Top of slim stays

it is stickered Columbus special steel (1975/80)

there is a Dogwood plug in the fork (idem Peugeot PY10 or Mercier)

it must date from the late 70s to early 80s (leg for water bottle holder, brake cable eyelets, rear derailleur cable eyelet, support for placing the chain when removing the wheel, etc.)
CINELLI S.C. FRAME made in France

Huret fork legs without eyelets for mudguard (therefore special race)
BOCAMA coupling (BCM)

SIZE 58 (bottom bracket axle / high seat tube)

frame serial number: 600 1743 5.9
fork serial number: 1743
original fork / to frame (1743)

STRONGLIGHT 650 bottom bracket with an integrated cup in light alloy and 118 axle in TITANIUM (see Stronglight catalog n° 26)

Warning: THE RIGHT CUP ON THE PEDALER SIDE IS DAMAGED (impossible to disassemble)

for Jdd French 35 x 1

the frame is in good general condition, there are a few scratches and some lack of paint.
A beautiful painting would be ideal

For its size, it is super light:
frame weight: 1965 grams
fork: 706 grams or 2671 kg

lighter than the PY10 Perthus (1900 + 0.640 g or 2540 kg in size 55)
Sending possible:

Metropolitan France: 17 euros

European Union and Switzerland: 28 euros

Europe outside the EU: 38 euros

Rest of the world (Japan, United States ...): 80 euros

juvela

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see nothing whatsoever to suggest a Cinelli origin

not many constructed with metric thread shells...


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3alarmer 

.
...Cinelli made and sold bottom bracket shells labeled "Cinelli". They got used by various frame makers. Maybe this is the source of the confusion here ?

ericlowney 

Yeah likely not a cinelli frame, just Bottom Bracket I guess. Assume a serious race bike due to the braze on for the race number. I’m not familiar with ‘Columbus Special’ tubing, or how it relates to SL or SLX, but appears very lightweight. Is this a ‘pass’ just do to the uncertainty?

beech333

I would not say it is a "pass", but I guess you want to be prepared for French quirks, like their threading and tube sizing. If you need the one cup off, I bet you could do it with the right tools. I'd let someone borrow it if they wanted to bring a frame by, or take it home if I knew them, but since you appear to be in FL and I am in IL...

I use one of these, and did not realize they sell for so much. I think I paid around $25 for mine.

https://bikerecyclery.com/kingsbridg...ch-flats-rare/

I think you might get lucky with the alternative that Sheldon Brown recommended, and I used until I got the proper tool.

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/tooltips/bbcups.html

FWIW, if that frame were a bit larger and if the listing had more information on some dimensions, or showed a set of wheels on the bike, I might have been interested. It looks like a nice mystery frame.

beech333

FWIW, I was looking at the weights last night. The frame is just slightly heavier than my Fuji Design Series from about 1986, which was their top of the line frame. I wondered how much the cup might have added, or if the whole bb was used in the weight.

The fork is just slightly lighter, so I bet that is a very, very nice frameset.

TugaDude

No expert here, but I'd be hesitant to call this a Cinelli just based on what I see. But I do see a quality build.

3alarmer 

...looks like a high quality frame, and that sort of sealed bearing bottom bracket cost something like a hundred bucks, just by itself, back when they first came out. I wouldn't pass on it just because it's not a Cinelli, but I like French bikes. They are quite different in feel and handling than the stuff Cinelli sold for frames.

ericlowney 

I reached out to the seller using google translate to ask for a top tube measurement, ask how they measured the seat tube (C-C or C-T), and to confirm if the dropouts are spaced at 126mm or 130mm. If everything sounds good I think I'll take the gamble for $260. I'll try to make the bottom bracket and drive side cup that is stuck work by sourcing a crankset that uses a 118mm spindle at first before going to extreme lengths to try to get the cup removed. Could be a fun project getting it repainted and building it up!

beech333

Save yourself the trouble. He/she seems to know English. "Reste du monde monde (Japan, Etat unis ...) : 80 euros

Je reste ŕ votre disposition pour tout renseignement complémentaire.


The frame is located in the France, Europe.
Shipping Worldwide"

Everybody except Americans seem to be bilingual.

bikingshearer 

Just to verify, and as I have said elsewhere about a different frame: The seat cluster says "not a Cinelli." I am 100% sure about that. The fork crown says "not a Cinelli SC." I am also 100% sure about that. I strongly doubt it is a Cinelli Model B, but I am only 98% sure about that.

ericlowney 

Received the below response from the seller, which I guess means it's a Motobecane frame with a cinelli BB. With the additional info, I think the price seems a bit high? From some additional pictures he sent, it looks like it is 120mm dropouts, 58cm frame (C-T), 56cm top tube (C-C)

"it is a Special Pro frame from the Motobecane la redoute team from 1980
(Alain Bondue, JL Vandenbroucke, Didier Vanovershelde....)"

zukahn1 

The Moto's from from there bankrupt years late 70's early 80's even top end tended to have so-so build quality I would pass on this one if your going to go to the cost and time of a full frame build up look for something a bit higher with no potential issues and a good id.

3alarmer 

.
...if it is spaced at 120 in the back, and has not been readjusted along the way, it's not late 70's or 80's in origin. I have a Le Champion frame here I repainted from sometime in the 70's. The brazing and construction are top notch. Far better than most of the other French major manufacturer frames I've reworked.

But if you are really worried about taking a chance on it, then save yourself the headaches and don't bother. Bargain frames have a tendency to go one way or the other as projects. Either yoiu end up with something you really like, or you and up asking yourself why you got involved in the first place. From the look of it, it's probably worth a couple of hundred bucks, just for the adventure. But maybe you don't need an adventure.

Ebay sellers are kind of notorious for undependable provenance.

ericlowney 

Appreciate all the input on this - I’m going to wait or pass on this one. If someone here picks it up I’d love to hear about how it goes though!