A Visit to the Atelier
05-17-22, 04:44 AM
#26
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Replace the steerer with a taller English version. That CLB hanger is essentially the brazed on hanger to a serrated washer I had mentioned.
05-17-22, 08:42 AM
#27
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eBay tells me someone in Portland sold one of those less than a month ago. If only I knew then what I know now....
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05-17-22, 08:49 AM
#28
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Here is another possibility, although you would probably have to pay gugie in pizza and beer to get it done. Step 1: Remove the fork. Step 2: Cut a little off the end of the steerer tube, chase the existing threads and extend/cut more threads to as long as you need. Step 3: Cut the fork at the midpoint (aerospace precision not required for this measurement). Step 4: Braze a plug into one of the recently-cut middle-of-the-fork ends. Step 5: Braze the other recently-cut end onto the plug such that the resulting plugged steerer tube is the amount longer you want it to be. Step 6: Reinstall the fork with the headset, spacers and brake hanger you need/want. Step 7: Give gugie his damn pizza and beer.
Ed Litton suggested and did exactly this me for so that I could use a fork from a ~1960 59cm Cinelli frame on a ~1965 64cm Cinelli frame (not the blue one you saw at Eroica CA; the silver one that runs Campy 10sp triple that gugie saw at Fauxrica last September). Well, Ed didn't have to modify the threads and I gave him cash money instead of pizza and beer, but otherwise it was this process. I turned out great. It adds a little weight, but you've seen me - at my size, a few extra ounces on a bike are seriously insignificant in the overall scheme of things.
Oh, and if you want to add some extra height to the steerer tube to get the bars a touch higher, you can build that in to the calculations of how much you extend the tube. I did. Or should I say, I asked Ed to.
Ed Litton suggested and did exactly this me for so that I could use a fork from a ~1960 59cm Cinelli frame on a ~1965 64cm Cinelli frame (not the blue one you saw at Eroica CA; the silver one that runs Campy 10sp triple that gugie saw at Fauxrica last September). Well, Ed didn't have to modify the threads and I gave him cash money instead of pizza and beer, but otherwise it was this process. I turned out great. It adds a little weight, but you've seen me - at my size, a few extra ounces on a bike are seriously insignificant in the overall scheme of things.
Oh, and if you want to add some extra height to the steerer tube to get the bars a touch higher, you can build that in to the calculations of how much you extend the tube. I did. Or should I say, I asked Ed to.
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05-17-22, 10:57 AM
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Here is another possibility, although you would probably have to pay gugie in pizza and beer to get it done. Step 1: Remove the fork. Step 2: Cut a little off the end of the steerer tube, chase the existing threads and extend/cut more threads to as long as you need. Step 3: Cut the fork at the midpoint (aerospace precision not required for this measurement). Step 4: Braze a plug into one of the recently-cut middle-of-the-fork ends. Step 5: Braze the other recently-cut end onto the plug such that the resulting plugged steerer tube is the amount longer you want it to be. Step 6: Reinstall the fork with the headset, spacers and brake hanger you need/want. Step 7: Give gugie his damn pizza and beer.
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05-17-22, 11:00 AM
#30
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Not sure how brazing the hanger to the serrated washer would help, the stack height increase is the same whether it's brazed on or not.
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05-17-22, 11:53 AM
#31
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I've done that several times in the past. The problem is it'll ruin the fork paint, which Andy is trying to preserve. This frame has a really nice patina without looking ratty.
Not sure how brazing the hanger to the serrated washer would help, the stack height increase is the same whether it's brazed on or not.
Not sure how brazing the hanger to the serrated washer would help, the stack height increase is the same whether it's brazed on or not.
05-17-22, 12:44 PM
#32
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Another approach, used back in the day = drill a countersunk hole through the handlebar stem at the appropriate angle to route the front brake cable down to the caliper.
If you countersink the hole you do not need to use a cable housing ferrule.
This photograph is borrowed from Cyclocross Magazine to illustrate the concept:
If you countersink the hole you do not need to use a cable housing ferrule.
This photograph is borrowed from Cyclocross Magazine to illustrate the concept:
Last edited by cyclophilia; 05-17-22 at 12:45 PM. Reason: correct typographical error
05-17-22, 01:25 PM
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Maybe if you cut a slot in the toothed washer to slip the hanger into and brazed it in place.... It's starting to feel a bit like a bodge.
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05-17-22, 01:26 PM
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Oof, now I'm trusting that a butt-braze job will hold up when I grab the front brake on a curvy long downhill. No thanks!
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05-17-22, 01:49 PM
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I pulled the toothed washer to get a better measurement, and now I have a theory as to how the threads got broken. This thing just did not want to come out. It's got the French "flat" key, but it doesn't seem to fit the steerer properly. In fact, I'm not entirely convinced that the flat portion of the steerer wasn't created by forcing this thing on. Also, the teeth on this piece are worn flat, probably from someone turning the bottom piece while this was stuck in place. I had to work it up the steerer bit-by-bit first using a steel pick and then a small screwdriver. I can easily imagine breaking the threads by using too much force as this got near the top. It doesn't slide back on, and the standard MAFAC hanger with the same flat key also doesn't fit.
The more I look at this headset, the less I like it. It just doesn't look right with the flange on the lug. Would the P3 be flush with the flange?
The more I look at this headset, the less I like it. It just doesn't look right with the flange on the lug. Would the P3 be flush with the flange?
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05-17-22, 02:17 PM
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Pull the fork and check the steerer diameter down below the threads. I'm wondering if Peugeot didn't accidentally use a few 1" steerers insead of 25mm
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05-17-22, 03:10 PM
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It turns out, the locknut won't screw down all the way even with the spacer removed. The threads are just too munged up part way down, which I suppose might suggest an alternate theory as to how the threads broke. I can thread the lock nut part way on, but then it sticks. The upper race piece threads off easily until it hits this point, a few millimeters from the top, and then it stops. I've applied as much force as I can manage with my bare hands and a cloth for grip, and it just will not pass. Any suggestions? Should I use the lock nut and a long wrench to try to force the threads open? Maybe apply vice grips or a pipe wrench to the knurled piece that's stuck? I'd hate to have to cut wrench flats into the stuck piece.
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05-17-22, 03:59 PM
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Second, they sort of look like the same width combined and separate...but could be deceiving.
The CLb item probably will kill Andy’s budget...
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05-17-22, 04:27 PM
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The budget is pretty open for the PX-10. It's my wife's 25th anniversary gift to me. I'm just hoping to get it finished before our 26th anniversary. Even so, I would like to avoid spending $100 on a cable hanger if I can.
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05-17-22, 05:42 PM
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That would require getting the remaining threaded piece of the headset off, which is looking like it may require a destructive method. Whoever thought it was a good idea to make this piece simply knurled didn't consider what would happen when the threads are damaged.
It turns out, the locknut won't screw down all the way even with the spacer removed. The threads are just too munged up part way down, which I suppose might suggest an alternate theory as to how the threads broke. I can thread the lock nut part way on, but then it sticks. The upper race piece threads off easily until it hits this point, a few millimeters from the top, and then it stops. I've applied as much force as I can manage with my bare hands and a cloth for grip, and it just will not pass. Any suggestions? Should I use the lock nut and a long wrench to try to force the threads open? Maybe apply vice grips or a pipe wrench to the knurled piece that's stuck? I'd hate to have to cut wrench flats into the stuck piece.
It turns out, the locknut won't screw down all the way even with the spacer removed. The threads are just too munged up part way down, which I suppose might suggest an alternate theory as to how the threads broke. I can thread the lock nut part way on, but then it sticks. The upper race piece threads off easily until it hits this point, a few millimeters from the top, and then it stops. I've applied as much force as I can manage with my bare hands and a cloth for grip, and it just will not pass. Any suggestions? Should I use the lock nut and a long wrench to try to force the threads open? Maybe apply vice grips or a pipe wrench to the knurled piece that's stuck? I'd hate to have to cut wrench flats into the stuck piece.
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05-17-22, 06:55 PM
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No need. Vice grips did the trick and don't seem to have left any marks. I had to open them as wide as they'd go, but I was just able to get them locked on.
The steerer is 25mm (plus a little extra where it's painted).
The steerer is 25mm (plus a little extra where it's painted).
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05-18-22, 05:22 AM
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I think Bulgie's idea of shaving a bit off the faces might be the best bet. That said, at least you don't have to agonize over a shade of Celeste!
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05-18-22, 07:36 AM
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In order to make sure it goes back together cleanly, I have a thread file you could borrow. I’m *assuming* the file has the proper thread pitch which I understand can be problematic on old French bikes, nest-ce pas?
05-18-22, 08:51 AM
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Oops. I was thinking it was a clunker thing...But now that I say it out loud, made no sense that you brought a clunker to Gugie...
I think Bulgie's idea of shaving a bit off the faces might be the best bet. That said, at least you don't have to agonize over a shade of Celeste!
I think Bulgie's idea of shaving a bit off the faces might be the best bet. That said, at least you don't have to agonize over a shade of Celeste!
And, yeah, I am already overthinking the steerer/headset problems as much as I did the shade of Celeste. I found an old Gitane frame on Craigslist locally that could provide a donor fork. The crown matches and it's white with the same chrome socks, but I'd need to do something to match the patina of the paint.
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05-18-22, 08:54 AM
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05-18-22, 09:34 AM
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Yes, the threads on this should be 25x1. I'm hoping @gugie has the tap to chase the threads and possibly cut some new ones. If not and you have the tool for 25x1, I'll be in touch.
Pic of a thread file:
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05-18-22, 09:39 AM
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Hey, just because it makes no sense doesn't mean I didn't do it. In fact, I did take this year's clunker to Gugie for bottle cage bosses -- two different frames in this thread.
And, yeah, I am already overthinking the steerer/headset problems as much as I did the shade of Celeste. I found an old Gitane frame on Craigslist locally that could provide a donor fork. The crown matches and it's white with the same chrome socks, but I'd need to do something to match the patina of the paint.
And, yeah, I am already overthinking the steerer/headset problems as much as I did the shade of Celeste. I found an old Gitane frame on Craigslist locally that could provide a donor fork. The crown matches and it's white with the same chrome socks, but I'd need to do something to match the patina of the paint.
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05-18-22, 09:42 AM
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No tap in this size, but I do have thread files as @RustyJames suggested. You probably just need to clean the threads, not cut new ones.
Pic of a thread file:
Pic of a thread file:
05-18-22, 10:00 AM
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05-18-22, 10:51 AM
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