Removing old tubbie glue down to bare rim
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Removing old tubbie glue down to bare rim
Kill me now, is there a good way to do this?
I'm putting new tires on my track training wheels, and I've had to switch glues from Panacement to Vittoria Mastik 1 as Panacement seems to have become unavailable in the US. I knew I was gonna have to do this sooner or later.
I have actually never done this job before, and **** me that glue does not want to leave! I started off by attacking it with a brass brush on a drill, but that was surprisingly ineffective and seemed to be taking as much of the rim material (Araya Gold's) as the glue. I then sat down with a rag and a can of acetone. If I continued that way I'd be elderly and divorced by the time I was finished.
Suggestions? I've assumed it's necessary to remove all the glue as I'm switching, but maybe it's not? Help.
I'm putting new tires on my track training wheels, and I've had to switch glues from Panacement to Vittoria Mastik 1 as Panacement seems to have become unavailable in the US. I knew I was gonna have to do this sooner or later.
I have actually never done this job before, and **** me that glue does not want to leave! I started off by attacking it with a brass brush on a drill, but that was surprisingly ineffective and seemed to be taking as much of the rim material (Araya Gold's) as the glue. I then sat down with a rag and a can of acetone. If I continued that way I'd be elderly and divorced by the time I was finished.
Suggestions? I've assumed it's necessary to remove all the glue as I'm switching, but maybe it's not? Help.
Last edited by Baby Puke; 02-08-14 at 04:22 PM.
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hollywood
Posts: 956
Bikes: Bianchi Pista, Bianchi Vigorelli
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I just did 4 sets of wheels last season- as I switched from Continental to Mastik 1..
The best thing I found was "Vm&P Naptha"
https://www.amazon.com/Klean-Strip-VM.../dp/B001G9TGQI
This stuff works better than all the other solvents I've tried (orange degreaser, acetone...)
The issue is they are not bringing it into California anymore. My Home Depot had some on hand- so once I realized how amazing this stuff was I went back and stocked up.. I'm on my last can now..
The way I got the best results was:
Put a lot of it on a rag- with the wheel in a truing stand turn the wheel while wiping with the rag.
I found it went better if I didn't scrub super hard in one spot- but just keep the rag soaked and apply pressure while spinning the wheel..
Once it starts to dissolve- focus on smaller areas....
You need to wipe the rim with acetone after, since the Naptha leaves a residue..
I'd say it takes about 25minutes a wheel- not really hard work... But it's time consuming.
The best thing I found was "Vm&P Naptha"
https://www.amazon.com/Klean-Strip-VM.../dp/B001G9TGQI
This stuff works better than all the other solvents I've tried (orange degreaser, acetone...)
The issue is they are not bringing it into California anymore. My Home Depot had some on hand- so once I realized how amazing this stuff was I went back and stocked up.. I'm on my last can now..
The way I got the best results was:
Put a lot of it on a rag- with the wheel in a truing stand turn the wheel while wiping with the rag.
I found it went better if I didn't scrub super hard in one spot- but just keep the rag soaked and apply pressure while spinning the wheel..
Once it starts to dissolve- focus on smaller areas....
You need to wipe the rim with acetone after, since the Naptha leaves a residue..
I'd say it takes about 25minutes a wheel- not really hard work... But it's time consuming.
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 149
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
On metal rims a heat gun can soften the glue so it wipes off. Then chemicals to do the final cleanup with chemicals. If you are just cleaning excess the remainder is usually a nice thin layer ready for new layers.
For acetone laying a soaked rag on the rim lets it soak into the glue before evaporating.
The heat gun and acetone soak are both questionable on carbon rims.
For acetone laying a soaked rag on the rim lets it soak into the glue before evaporating.
The heat gun and acetone soak are both questionable on carbon rims.
#4
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Thanks guys.
Any thoughts on combining the old Panacement with the new Mastik 1?
Any thoughts on combining the old Panacement with the new Mastik 1?
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hollywood
Posts: 956
Bikes: Bianchi Pista, Bianchi Vigorelli
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I look to Matchsprint@FGF for pretty much all technical/mechanical issues..
he recommended the Naptha and he recommends not mixing glue..
find the Naptha.. its the only way to go
he recommended the Naptha and he recommends not mixing glue..
find the Naptha.. its the only way to go
#8
Senior Member
Thread Starter
How about on carbon? The race wheels will need this eventually.
#9
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hollywood
Posts: 956
Bikes: Bianchi Pista, Bianchi Vigorelli
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
same
of the wheels i did last season- 1 set was aluminum the others were carbon
of the wheels i did last season- 1 set was aluminum the others were carbon
#10
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Seems like naphtha is basically gasoline. Anybody use that? This is getting fun. <eye roll>
#11
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Why didn't I think of this before? WD-40= 60-80% naphtha!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WD-40
Edit: Naphtha also seems to pretty much be lighter fluid. I think you'll be ok after your stash runs out, Quinn.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WD-40
Edit: Naphtha also seems to pretty much be lighter fluid. I think you'll be ok after your stash runs out, Quinn.
Last edited by Baby Puke; 02-09-14 at 01:42 AM.
#12
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 149
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Lacquer thinner works well but extended use will result in a second head growing. Tip is to get the slow thinner which evaporates a bit slower.
#13
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Front wheel done. WD-40 is not a magic bullet. Used a screw driver to scrape off the majority (there was a lot of build-up), then it was a hand-held wire brush alternating with a scotchbrite pad between applications of WD-40 via rag. Finished up with three acetone cleanings, then applied base layer of glue. That took a good 3 hours. Much less build up on the rear wheel so hopefully that won't take as long. Jeez.Lesson to others: Start with Mastik from the get go!
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 261
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
My brother is a mechanic... I take the wheels to him and he uses a high speed air grinder tool with a soft (copper) brush head on it to get the glue off.
Comes off like butter! You have to be careful not to go down the side of the rim though... it'll take decals off or leave a good mark down the side.
JMR
Comes off like butter! You have to be careful not to go down the side of the rim though... it'll take decals off or leave a good mark down the side.
JMR
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hollywood
Posts: 956
Bikes: Bianchi Pista, Bianchi Vigorelli
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Front wheel done. WD-40 is not a magic bullet. Used a screw driver to scrape off the majority (there was a lot of build-up), then it was a hand-held wire brush alternating with a scotchbrite pad between applications of WD-40 via rag. Finished up with three acetone cleanings, then applied base layer of glue. That took a good 3 hours. Much less build up on the rear wheel so hopefully that won't take as long. Jeez.Lesson to others: Start with Mastik from the get go!
#16
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Seemed that way too!
I need this done now or I'd go hunt for legit naphtha. They don't have it at my local hardware store.
I need this done now or I'd go hunt for legit naphtha. They don't have it at my local hardware store.
#17
aka Tom Reingold
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New York, NY, and High Falls, NY, USA
Posts: 40,506
Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem
Mentioned: 511 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7351 Post(s)
Liked 2,478 Times
in
1,439 Posts
It is harder than it should be, but since that's the way it is, maybe it's fair to say that it should be that hard. Circular reasoning, I know.
I think removing glue isn't really important until the buildup is so thick that you fear that it will come apart under tension or pressure. I don't know when that is. Has anyone ever had that happen?
I think removing glue isn't really important until the buildup is so thick that you fear that it will come apart under tension or pressure. I don't know when that is. Has anyone ever had that happen?
__________________
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
#18
Senior Member
Thread Starter
It is harder than it should be, but since that's the way it is, maybe it's fair to say that it should be that hard. Circular reasoning, I know.
I think removing glue isn't really important until the buildup is so thick that you fear that it will come apart under tension or pressure. I don't know when that is. Has anyone ever had that happen?
I think removing glue isn't really important until the buildup is so thick that you fear that it will come apart under tension or pressure. I don't know when that is. Has anyone ever had that happen?
#19
aka Tom Reingold
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New York, NY, and High Falls, NY, USA
Posts: 40,506
Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem
Mentioned: 511 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7351 Post(s)
Liked 2,478 Times
in
1,439 Posts
Well, that's a scary thought. What happened with Soyo glue?
__________________
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
#20
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Nothing bad, actually. While living in Japan I was given a pile of basically new pro keirin take-offs, all of which had been glued on with Soyo. When I'd get a flat and put on another one, I noticed that the spots where the old Soyo had stayed stuck to the base tape had not stuck on well to the rim bed (I was using Panacement). But I never had an issue. The tires were on good.
Those keirin tires were sweet! Very light, no coating on sidewalls, fat and lively. I miss them. Funky old british valve was a pain, though.
Those keirin tires were sweet! Very light, no coating on sidewalls, fat and lively. I miss them. Funky old british valve was a pain, though.
#21
aka Tom Reingold
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New York, NY, and High Falls, NY, USA
Posts: 40,506
Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem
Mentioned: 511 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7351 Post(s)
Liked 2,478 Times
in
1,439 Posts
It sounds like you're saying the glue could have separated from the rim if you had done something, but I don't completely follow. Do you think it could have happened if you had used a continuous coating of the glue?
So far, I haven't seen any reports of glue coming undone due to a thick buildup. Has anyone?
So far, I haven't seen any reports of glue coming undone due to a thick buildup. Has anyone?
__________________
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
#22
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Again, different issue.
#23
aka Tom Reingold
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New York, NY, and High Falls, NY, USA
Posts: 40,506
Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem
Mentioned: 511 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7351 Post(s)
Liked 2,478 Times
in
1,439 Posts
Maybe I didn't word my question well. Who has had a problem of any sort from excessive buildup?
__________________
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
#24
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hollywood
Posts: 956
Bikes: Bianchi Pista, Bianchi Vigorelli
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I said "it sounds harder than it should be"
because with an optimal solvent this job took me 30min and not much muscle.. As apposed to 3hrs..
as for combining different glues-
the issue is not about "build up" it's about the glue on the tire not adhering to the glue on the rim..
because with an optimal solvent this job took me 30min and not much muscle.. As apposed to 3hrs..
as for combining different glues-
the issue is not about "build up" it's about the glue on the tire not adhering to the glue on the rim..
#25
aka Tom Reingold
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New York, NY, and High Falls, NY, USA
Posts: 40,506
Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem
Mentioned: 511 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7351 Post(s)
Liked 2,478 Times
in
1,439 Posts
If you apply glue to both tire and rim, won't the two layers stick together?
__________________
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.