utoner34

This summer I will be touring Europe again for a few months, and I am looking for a fast and reliable tires. I ride mostly roads, so I don't need off-road grip 99% of the time.

I love gp 5000 and would like to use them but they dont last long. I know there is also gp 4 season, but they are more of winter tire.

How long do your gp 5000 last?

GhostRider62

I replace my GP5000 25 mm tires at 4,000 miles on my recumbent. F/R wear the same rate on that bike. On my upright, the rear wears almost twice as fast as the front. I rode a 28 mm GP4000 on the rear wheel from Colorado to the East coast and I reckon it was half spent.

I'd use GP5000 myself to tour on in Europe but also have a good boot just in case the casing goes (unlikely but cheap insurance)

pdlamb

I think tire choice is a "pick your poison" question.

If you know how much weight you expect to be carrying on your bike, and tire size, and how far you expect to travel, we'll have half the information we need to make informed recommendations. If you can then quantify (even roughly) how you want to make the trade between rolling resistance, expected tire life, and flat resistance, then we can get into a discussion about what tires might be best for you.

Until then, expect a flood of "I like X" and "No, I prefer Y" answers.

robow

I always view the idea of touring tires through the lens of "How much flat resistance/toughness do I seek and how much compromise to ride quality am I willing to accept" To my wife, she worships at the alter of flat resistance while touring and therefore selects Schwalbe Marathon Plus.

gauvins

I ride on Almotion. You can get an idea of the tire metrics here and compare to the 5000 there. The short version is that both tires do quite well WRT rolling resistance. The Almotion is a better alternative regarding puncture resistance whereas the GP 5000 is lighter (320 vs 610g).

Tourist in MSN

I have three different touring bikes, and for touring I prefer four different models of tires. My favorites vary by width and terrain. I think it unlikely that a consensus will be reached here.

gauvins

Could you elaborate? (Brand, specs) with perhaps a summary of your decision rules?

Tourist in MSN

This is in response to my prevous posted that stated:
I have three different touring bikes, and for touring I prefer four different models of tires. My favorites vary by width and terrain. I think it unlikely that a consensus will be reached here.

My point was that threads that ask what should I use for tires are like asking what to use for chain lube. If there was one best answer, everyone would use that and there would only be one product available in stores. But, for different tire widths, weight capacities, ground surfaces, etc., the choices are quite long. And now with tubeless vs tubed tires, more choices.

But to answer the question which is what do I use?
- Hutchinson Globetrotter (discontineud).
- Schwalbe Marathon with Greenguard.
- Schwalbe Dureme (folding, non-tandem) (discontineud).
- Schwalbe Extreme (folding) (discontineud).
I only ride with inner tubes, not tubeless.

My 700c touring bike, Hutchinson Globetrotter in 37mm is what I have always used. I am down to my last one in back. This is my "light" touring bike, mostly for pavement. When my last Globetrotter is shot, probably use Marathons with Greenguard. I have a front tire that I would not recommend that is on that bike, an old Marathon XR (discontinued) that I decided to use up front since I had it (this is not one of my four) but I have not used the XR on a tour due to high rolling resistance.

Schwalbe Marathon with Greenguard in 40mm width on my "medium" touring bike on trips that are mostly pavement, 26 inch. I like this tire for trips that are mostly pavement.

Scwalbe Dureme in 50mm front on my "medium" touring bike (26 inch) in front if I am mostly riding on gravel such as rail trail trips that often include some pavement riding too. And on the rear the Schwalbe Marathon Extreme in 50mm wide.

On my expedition or "heavy" touring bike (26 inch), 57mm width Schwalbe Marathon Extremes front and rear. It is a good compromise tire between rough off road and pavement, as it has big blocks of tread but also rolls well on pavement, but it is a compromise, not the best tire on or off road.

The Extremes and Duremes came in wired and folding version, I only use the folding version as rolling resistance was less. The Duremes also came in a Tandem version that has high rolling resistance, that is not one of my recommended ones.

When the Duremes and Extremes are shot, probably use the Mondials unless something else shows up that looks interesting for both on and off road. But I have plenty of tread left so do not need to decide yet.

If I carry a spare, it is a light weight folding tire that is good enough to get me to a bike shop, I do not carry a replacement tire if I carry a spare.

staehpj1

If you like the ride of the GP4000 and they don't flat excessively in your usage, I'd use them and just put up with the wear.

I have used gatorskins and been happy with them. I'd rather use the GP4000, but figure they'd probably flat more often where I ride (thorns).

utoner34

I used those ties years ago when I started touring. They were the most slowest, most uncomfortable and the heaviest ties I have ever seen. In the end of the day I still got a puncture after a while. I dont know if anything changed but I wouldn't use them on the road ever again. One day when I decide to go to Africa, thats a different story.

rider 100kg
luggage 25kg
distance 10000km

Yes, I know, I see a tire change somewhere in there


I do like them and on my last euro trip, I havent had a flat after 3000km.

But the wear will be an issue

staehpj1

How so? Is the tour longer than a set of them will last? So change them mid tour. I often have to do that. I don't generally carry a spare tire, but when I get close to end of life for the tires I might pick up the new tires and carry them for a while just in case. I also may have bought them ahead of time and have them mailed from home via general delivery, but usually rely on finding them when I need them. That last can be a mistake as I have sometimes had trouble finding a tire I liked when I did that.

robow

Don't tell my wife this. She at one time was a heck of a tri-athlete and I want her riding these tires so as to hopefully slow her down a little. We won't tell her I leave her brakes rubbing just a touch either, so that I can keep up : )

pdlamb

So, you're touring Europe. If you check your tires when you pump them up, I bet you can catch incipient tire wear-out in time to find a bike shop or order a new tire (or two) and have them shipped to where you're staying night after tomorrow. If you can take four months (or more) off work, I assume you're sufficiently solvent to handle minor but unexpected expenses like a new tire. The only question, then, is whether you have to do that twice or three times.

Ride what you like! If you like the GP 5000 ride, go for it.

Tourist in MSN

If it is a light weight folding bead tire, bring one new one as a spare. When the rear looks like it is about shot, put the front tire on the rear, then put the new spare on the front. Keep the one you wore out, that is your new spare until you find a replacement for it when you ride past a bike shop. For that distance, you might want to plan on buying at least one along the way.

Side note: I am well aware that a lot of people rotate their tires in an attempt to wear out both front and rear at the same time. But I have never heard of anyone doing a tire rotation mid-tour. I do not rotate, instead I prefer to put my best tire on the front. The rear often wears out twice as fast as the front, so my front tire has very little wear when I move it to the rear.

imi

FWIW Gator Hardshells 32mm, fast and tough.

Some find them too harsh, but I like to feel the road.

As to replacing tires, I’ll start a long tour with new tires and put the old ones on my commuter if not too worn.

Otherwise, yeah two rear tires to one front, so no rotation… and marathon plus are tanks! But bombproof 😊

Jeff Neese

Unless I missed it, you didn't say what kind of bike you'll be riding, or how much load you'll be carrying. If you're talking fully-loaded, self-supported touring, the idea of a tire being "fast" goes out the window and reliability reigns supreme. Ride comfort is important too, but the best tires for touring (reliability and comfort) are going to be heavier and definitely not fast. In other words, you can have fast, comfortable, and reliable - pick any two. If you're riding a loaded touring bike, you're not going to be going fast anyway. For me, having to stop and change a flat while touring is a real PITA, especially when you've got panniers and rear rack and you're doing it out in the middle of nowhere.

I don't know what size you need, but Continental makes some excellent touring tires and their Contact series are tough as nails. Also look at Panaracer.

GhostRider62

I have found that the GP5000 last a little longer than GP4000. In 10,000km, you might use two sets of tires. I know that would work for me and we are similar weight.

Increased width will get you more miles and more comfort. If you can fit 32mm GP5000 and run them at 55-70 psi depending on your total weight, they will last a long time. 28 or 30 mm are also made. You can carry three spare tires for the weight saved from running Marathons or similar. How long does it take to change a flat?

Go with the fast tires.

staehpj1

Yep. That is exactly my thoughts. I'd add that you could pre buy them and have them sitting at home ready to be mailed to you via general delivery or shipped to where you will be staying. Also depending on how worried you are about a spare vs how light you pack a spare can be carried pretty easily if you want to for a tire like that given that they are light and fold small.

As far as rotating. While the best tire is usually put on the front. I am likely to just change the rear tire when it wears out on tour if the front isn't too bad. At home I am fussier about such things. If the front is pretty badly worn I might just change both and keep the front to be worn out later on the rear. The only problem is that when I do that they usually never get used. After they sit around unused for a couple years I give them to the local co op.

BTW, riding with a tire like a Marathon Plus just isn't an option for me. I tried going that route once. I really hated the ride feel. I just missed the supple ride that flexible sidewalls give too much. I think maybe I could have convinced myself to live with the weight even though it is pretty extreme. The speed hit I am sure i could have lived with if that was all there was to it. I took them off after a few hundred miles and eventually sold them to someone who would appreciate them.

utoner34

Yes, I do use gp 5000 in 32 mm width. Tire indicators on my current tires have not gone, but I will see how much I can ride them before something happens It hard to say how many miles I have done to this point since I dont measure that but I would say 3000-4000km.

utoner34

Reading the reviews it appears tire has no feel at all but I havent tried it personally. I only use gp 5000 and gp four season in the last years. Even gp four season compared to gp5000 you can feel the difference in speed and feel.

I would say:

gp5000:
speed, riding feel 5/5

gp four season:
speed, riding feel 4/5

staehpj1

It isn't in the category of the likes of the Marathon Plus or other really flat proof at all costs type tires, but yeah a stiff sidewall due to the extra puncture resistant stuff under the tread and in the sidewall. Somewhere in between it and the more performance oriented tires is the regular gatorskin. It has the belt under the tread but not the extra protection in the sidewall.

Since my touring is most often at least partially in thorn country I have been running the regular gatorskin, but long for a more lively tire. The gatorskin seems to be the closest to a performance tire that I have found with some flat resistance for my existing wheels. Solving the thorn problem with tubeless and sealant seems tempting to me and if I ever buy a new bike or new wheels I may go that route. I have had wonderful results with tubeless on my mountain bike.

zacster

I use GP5000 in 25fr/28rear on my road bike but I can't imagine using those on a tour with any kind of load. They just wouldn't last. I use Gatorskins in 26"x1.25 on my commuter and even those I'm going to remove when I use that bike for a tour this summer and replace with Schwalbe Marathons, which I already have. The good part about that is I can give them a try before I go and if I hate the feel on the road, no loss. In fact, I should try them now since I have them.

GhostRider62

100 kg and 25 kg luggage is a lot. 10,000 km in 2 months is also a lot. I doubt any reasonably comfortable tire will last that long. You will need to buy tires.

I've ridden Conti 4 seasons. I gave them away.

I rode a Gator hardshell touring for about 500 miles until I could put a 28 mm GP5000 on. It was the most uncomfortable tire I ever rode and I got a flat with it.

utoner34

Its not 2 months. Its 4 - 6 months. I am not Jonas Deichmann.

Tourist in MSN

With:
rider 100kg
luggage 25kg
distance 10000km

Add 10 to 15kg of bike weight, you are at 135 to 140 kg total. Probably at least 60 percent of that on rear, or about 80 plus kg on the rear tire. If you were using 35 or 37mm tires with a 15 percent tire drop, that is roughly 80 psi or more in the rear tire. I do not think a tire narrower than 35mm would be a good idea with that weight. I usually use less pressure in my front tire than the rear, if I was using 80 psi in back, would likely have 55 to 60 psi in front.

If you tried to run 32mm or narrower, you would have even more tire pressure, possibly too much for the rim rating. And that skinny of a tire could start having pinch flats with that weight.

If the concept of 15 percent tire drop is new to you, more info here:
https://www.adventurecycling.org/def...SIRX_Heine.pdf

That article is one persons opinion, I usually run a higher pressure than the 15 percent tire drop calls for. But I would use the calculated 15 percent tire drop as a minimum, as I do not want my tire to be more compressed than that.

There are lots of times in this thread where the word comfort appears. But with that much weight on the rear tire, I would not put too much emphasis on a comfortable supple tire. I think you need to think more about a tire that will hold up to the stresses on the rear with that much weight.

I mentioned above that my light touring bike has 37mm tires, that is what I have in the photo below:



I am roughly 80 kg, bike weight about 15 kg with racks, water bottles, etc., panniers and handlebar bag probably add up to 20 kg, or 115 kg total. I probably had 80 psi in the rear tire which likely was higher pressure than 15 percent tire drop calls for, thus a bit harsher ride. But with that weight on a 37mm tire, the width provides some extra comfort too.

If you focus too much on comfort, you might have durability problems.

But, if you really want to bring thin supple tires, as I noted before, I think you should carry a spare.

In one of my previous posts, I said if I bring a spare it is usually a light weight one that will get me to the bike shop. But if I was doing 10000 km, I would probably bring a spare that is the same model as the tires I am riding, as I would plan on using it later as a replacement.

Good luck with your trip, sounds like a grand adventure.