Polaris OBark

I've had a Berthoud Aspin saddle for about 4 years. It looks like this:



I use either it or my B17 (a slightly fancy one with copper rivets that I have had for about 10 years). Both have thousands of miles on them, so I assume they are broken in, whatever that actually means.

In general, my B17 is quite comfortable, but the Berthoud's form-factor, which is slightly narrower, actually feels better, until about mile 25 (with hard climbing. On a flatter ride, 50 miles is still ok.) My left leg and hip start to hurt.

I do get a somewhat similar sensation from the Brooks, but less pronounced. My hope was that the "open" version of the saddle would help, but I worry it (or something else) has the opposite effect.

The pain, BTW, isn't bruising or anything that persists in the sense that if I stop and get off the bike for a few minutes, it dissipates. But it returns when I get back on within 15 min or so, depending on the climb.

I hate to give up on this thing if there is a simple tweak that might help.

Any suggestions, especially if you have experience with a Berthoud?

It might be simplest to relegate the Berthoud saddle to a commuter bike, where most rides would be under 20 miles each way, but if I could make this work, I would prefer to keep it on my main ride (a steel "all-road"/gravel-ish road bike).

ThermionicScott 

Same thing happens (or at least, did) to me. I assume some kind of asymmetry causes more pressure to be placed on the nerves/circulation on one side. Pointing the nose of the saddle slightly to the left moved that contact point slightly to the rear and almost completely eliminated the ache.

Polaris OBark

Thanks! I will try that immediately. I really appreciate this kind of advice.

So just to be clear, your ache was on the left side? Wouldn't pointing the nose to the left move the contact point forward?

ThermionicScott 

I'm watching the 4-year-old at the moment, will try to find a way to illustrate it in a bit...

Polaris OBark

No worries. I have pointed it to the left about 2° and will give it a try.

ThermionicScott 

Okay, I've had a few hours, but I'm still not sure I know a clear way to illustrate it, since it's such a subtle change. I figure the saddle is partly blocking circulation by chafing my inner thigh, spot marked in green. When you point the nose to the left, you rotate the whole saddle counterclockwise. That means the left sitbone hits the saddle a little further forward, giving that thigh a little more clearance.


I dunno, I'll keep working on my story. I just know this really helped me, starting at least 10 years and many thousands of miles ago.

Polaris OBark

I didn't get a chance to try it today, but it is ready to go. Thanks for posting the images. I didn't mean to distract you from something much more important. Enjoy their evanescent childhood while you can.

79pmooney

My routine for both saddles and handlebars is to go for rides carrying all the wrenches (usually for just bars or just seat). Stop and tweak as needed. For seats, I love the 2 bolt seatposts because they make it easy to do documented small changes that are easy to reverse exactly. I mark the location of the rails in the clamp and seat height with pieces of tape. Keep track of 1/8ths of turns of the front seat clamp bolt. (Stop, loosen rear bolt, tweak front bolt, re-tighten rear.)

Seat tilt, height and angle can all make a difference. I set my seat noses about a half cm to the left on all my bikes. Have the noses down but by different amounts.

I'm guessing your issue is an impinged either blood vessel or nerve. It may be that just a slight tweak will relieve it completely.

unterhausen

I have never ridden with either saddle, but I think my brooks pro was more like a Berthoud than a B17. Usually people ride with the nose of a B17 pointed up. A pro is meant to be ridden flat, and I expect a Berthoud is the same way.

I got indentations in my Brooks that revealed a leg length discrepancy. Which makes sense given the knee problems I have had. It's really not bad enough to do anything about. The saddle was never comfortable, got a ridge down the middle. So I stopped riding it. I have thought about re-forming it and trying again.

Polaris OBark

Just out of pure curiosity, what saddle works best for you?

I worry I don't have enough years left in my life to break in another leather saddle.

unterhausen

Leather saddles break in pretty quickly. After that they start breaking down.

I have Fizik Aliante saddles on all my bikes, even my fatbike. Lots of people say it's the saddle to go to if you are used to a B17. Same company too.

Polaris OBark

Yeah, maybe mine is just starting to break down. A more likely explanation is that I am.

The nose 2° rotation has at least made the ache symmetric. It still hurt on the 17-21% grade, but seemed to recover more quickly.

(I did try the Fizik Aliante saddle a few years ago, and couldn't tolerate it at all. Maybe it was all of the spurious punctuation.)

unterhausen

Actually, they changed the Aliante design about 5 years ago, and the newer ones don't work as well for me. Forgot about that. There is one that's more similar to the old design, I'm thinking it's the one for endurance.

Polaris OBark

I bought the carbon fiber 3D printed one, thinking that might be the ultimate answer. Thankfully I was extremely careful with the packaging and put electrical tape on the rails, so I was able to send it back.

My wife is about to get a hip replacement, so maybe this is all psycho-somatic.

Alan K

I have several Brooks seats (saddles as they like them to be called) for at least 3 decades. I do ride bicycles a fair bit (at least about 2,000 miles a year or more) so it wouldn’t be a wrong assumption that they are broken-in. So far none of my seats have stated to break down but I do periodically condition them with saddle wax (not using the shoe polish sized tiny pack for $15 possibly more now, but the one that is used by horse owners for their saddles - you can buy a quart of it for about the same price and it will outlast your children &#128521.

Alan K

To the original poster:
If you have not already tried this by now, you may want to try changing the position of your seat from horizontal (or whichever way you have it now) to tipping it forward - lowering the nose the smallest unit, one at a time, your adjustment permits. While climbing, your your posture tends to change slightly such that the nose may be pushing harder on the area affecting blood flow and nerves. The steeper the climb, the more pronounced the shift of forces. I think that you will find a suitable position where you will be able ride comfortably, as I did.

Of course, there is no quick fix for overall soreness after a 50+ miles ride… a warm shower and good sleep helps and you are ready for another ride! 😉

Road Fan

I don't generally agree that leather saddles break in quickly, but that's really just a side note. So Polar, Thermionic, and I have had saddle pains focused on the sitbone of one of our two sides - for me it's usually right, but for Polar and Therm it seems to be pain on the left.

I usually first lower the saddle nose about 1/16" to reduce pressure in front of the sitbones a little, and then ride. If it doesn't help, raise it 1/16 back to "normal," and then raise it another 1/16. Ride it again, and see - this might make you slide your butt back a little. If none of this helps, adjust the saddle nose back down to "normal."

Then try loosening the seat post just a little and move the nose of the saddle to the right about 1/16", by hitting it gently with a few short strokes of a hammer buffered by a bit of bath towel. Rotating the nose to the right also rotates the wide part at the right in the backwards direction. In my opinion this adjustment reduces pressure of the saddle leather on the right-hand sit bone or the right-hand groin, also helping to reduce a possible pinch.

I've often found, as well, that a 1/16" adjustment might be too much, due to creating too much new pressure on the sit bone or the groin. YMMV.

RJfos

You really think they break in quickly? I was gifted a Brooks B17 last Christmas. I installed it on my touring bike with the intent to break it in on my trainer over the winter. Things seemed to be going well. I ended up nosing up the seat about 5 degrees to keep from sliding around on the saddle. Come spring when I had the bike on the road I started having inner thigh discomfort on rides over 30 miles. I figured I hadn’t broken it in yet. I’m relatively small at 145 lbs and 5’7”, so thought it might take longer to break it in. For longer multi day rides I have been switching out the saddles with my road bike, which I can ride on all day in complete comfort. If the B17 doesn’t break in soon or improve in comfort I’ll probably end up regifting. A shame, because it looks sweet on my touring bike.

Alan K

Brooks saddles do take longer time for break-in (and that is riding time, not just calendar based time). The saddle I used the most, started feeling comfortable after about 3-4,000 miles (about a year) and it still is after more than 15,000 miles (an approximate estimate). On the other hand, Selle Italia X felt comfortable much sooner so you may want to try that. They are sold in multiple versions, based on the maximum body weight. The medium weight version was suitable for me, and seeing your weight, it will be for you as well.

RJfos

I appreciate the input. I will probably give the B17 some more time but I'll definitely look into the Selle Italia X saddles. I'm actually more of a runner then a cyclist with about 1,500 miles per year in both disciplines. A lot more time in the running shoes than on the saddle. Thanks.

Alan K

Correction in name: Selle Anatomica X

Running/jogging didn’t work for me in my younger days. My knees would start hurting after a few miles. That’s when I started swimming. A combination of swimming and bicycling has proven quite satisfactory for me.

Whatever one chooses to do, ignoring pain is never a good idea… with sensible care, what nature has provided, we can make it last a century. 😉

Polaris OBark

Selle Anatomica saddles are great. My only gripe is the edge irritates my legs, but I am a little bit reluctant to cut the leather and mess it up.

I moved the Selle Anatomica offa the bika on the traina and put on an Ergon Gravel saddle to try it out. I only did about ten indoor miles, but I am having trouble walking tonight. I nosed it to the left a little after a few miles, and that helped a bit, but fundamentally, I am better off with the Selle Anatomica, Brooks or Berthoud. I think my sorry arse needs a leather saddle.

squirtdad

Bearing in mind that saddles are very individual, here are my experiences

Brooks B17 use it on my upright utility/commuter bike with nose slightly up. I don't like th B17 for long rides

Brooks Swift was my go to for road bike and longer rides for a long time....still have it on my cino miyata

I love the the Berthoud solour which has replaced the swift

I ride both the swift and Solour with the nose tilted ever so slightly down

both the swift and the solour are narrower than the B17 and neither are cut out (tried a b17 narrow with cutout and it did not wokr)

my experience is that a leather saddle shoud be comfortable first ride, if not it won't work you can't break it in to be comfortable

so saddle tilt and noted earlier or maybe a narrower saddle?

Polaris OBark

Is the Berthoud solour narrower than the Aspen?

I wonder if getting the cut-out was a mistake? I got it mainly because the Selle Anatomica has a similar one, and it seemed like a good idea. (I don't have pudendal nerve issues unless I ride a hideous gooshy gel saddle.)

I put the Aspen cutout back on my bike (again) about a year ago, and only recently it is starting to bother me, which makes me worry that it is more me than the saddle.

RJfos

I think you have a point with my B17 saddle width and if it's not initially comfortable I probably won't be able fix it by breaking it in. My pedaling is much more knees-in vs knees-out. My sit bones are fine, but my inner thighs have noticeable contact with the sides of the saddle on the down stroke. I'm okay for the first 20-25 miles, but thereafter the contact starts becoming noticeable and eventually painful. My road bike saddle is a non-leather narrow saddle (143mm width) that tapers quickly from back to front. There is no noticeable inner thigh contact with the saddle, thus I'm able to ride this saddle comfortably all day. I just recently swapped this saddle onto my touring bike for a multi-day 400 mile ride. No pain, including one day riding w/o padded shorts.