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Stripped Zipp Rear 404 Hub HELP!

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Stripped Zipp Rear 404 Hub HELP!

Old 05-21-23, 02:06 PM
  #1  
richas
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Stripped Zipp Rear 404 Hub HELP!

I have a set of older Zipp Wheels on my older Giant Propel. The original wheels were damaged beyond repair in a race crash. The replacement Zipp rear wheel had a stripped ratchet ring which is terminal but I tried to fix it with some special Loctite permanent thread locker. This worked for quite a while, until today. I jumped on it hard and I felt it give so the hub is done.

Good used wheel are hard to find for this bike so ideally I would replace the hub. I have built wheels in the past so I just need to find a hub. You may have guessed that I don't have the budget for new $$$$ wheels.

Does anyone know what hub it is and if it is available? If not can I remove the hub and take measurements to find a suitable replacement?

Thank you

Rich





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Old 05-21-23, 02:18 PM
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All isn't lost if you can't find the identical hub.

ANY hub with the right number of holes* is fine, with the understanding that you'll also need to spring for new spokes.

*assumes equal number of holes in both flanges, otherwise you'll need to search linger for the right match.
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Old 05-21-23, 02:31 PM
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Contact Zipp/SRAM and see what they have. But, I doubt it will be cheap.

Zipp hubs show up on E-Bay from time to time, although I see a few of them that seem to be missing chunks.

I suppose the question is what you want to do with the freehub. Are you using 10s, 11s, XD, Campy, 12s, or something else? Future proof whatever you buy now.

I did a Rear wheel to front wheel conversion a while ago. The wheel worked reasonably well, although I'm not sure about a giant sail in the wind. 700c rear, 650c front. Anyway, the freehub is not needed when used on the front.



Anyway, you can probably swap hubs, but probably will also have to replace the spokes. I've bought a couple of Chinese hubs (Novatech?), and they seemed to have more bearing resistance than I liked. I haven't built them into a wheel yet, perhaps they loosen up. However, find a lightweight hub that spins freely with the right spoke count.
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Old 05-21-23, 02:34 PM
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why not just replace the freehub body itself? they are easily replaced... many are available for about $110... i'd contact Zipp to find the correct part number... then shop around...

AND,since Zipp hubs fail on occasion.. a bike Co-op may have a Freehub body in their stash...
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Old 05-21-23, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by maddog34
why not just replace the freehub body itself? they are easily replaced... many are available for about $110... i'd contact Zipp to find the correct part number... then shop around...

AND,since Zipp hubs fail on occasion.. a bike Co-op may have a Freehub body in their stash...
Zipp hubs use a hardened ratchet ring as part of the hub, and the pawls as part of the freehub. It sounds like the ratchet ring has failed, so simply replacing the freehub won't help.
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Old 05-21-23, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by CliffordK
Zipp hubs use a hardened ratchet ring as part of the hub, and the pawls as part of the freehub. It sounds like the ratchet ring has failed, so simply replacing the freehub won't help.
so it sounds like expensive isn't always "better".

i took "ratchet ring" to mean the Cassette Lock Ring... it seems the hub has a design flaw that lends itself to failures... bummer.

Note to self: continue to avoid SRAM products when possible.

Last edited by maddog34; 05-21-23 at 02:51 PM.
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Old 05-21-23, 02:55 PM
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Thank you all for the input, I appreciate it. I send a message to Zipp(SRAM) and will see what they say. In the meantime I might as well remove the hub and start taking some measurements. BTW it is a Shimano 11s setup.

Rich
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Old 05-21-23, 03:08 PM
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What about this?

https://wheelbuilder.com/white-indus...rear-road-hub/

(With new spokes)
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Old 05-21-23, 03:19 PM
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From the link you provided... "The selected product combination is currently unavailable."
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Old 05-21-23, 03:26 PM
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a review i found...White Industries T11


FWB Opinion

At around 255 grams, the T11 is one of the heaviest hubs in the review but also one of the most durable. Made in the U.S. the T11 has one of the highest static load capacities of any hub on the market. It has large bearings that spin smoothly, and an easy to use preload adjustment, though not my favorite preload design. It also has a nice outward position of the left bearing. At $273 it is a very reasonably priced rear hub. In some cases it seems almost over built, such as having 3 or 4 bearings in the freehub body. One thing that makes it heavier is also the thing I like most about it, that is that it is the only rear hub in the review to have a ti freehub body. This is great for riders running Shimano who are tired of the alloy bodies being grooved by cogs. The 6000 series alloy polishes better than most of the other hubs, so this is one of the most brilliant hubs in silver. It’s also now available in a wide range of colors. White industries is easy to get a hold of and customer service from them has been very. The T11 is the only hub in the test that uses steel for the rear axle making it very good for very large riders and daily use wheelsets.

Ron’s perspective

The T11 is the same basic design as the H3, with changes being mostly cosmetic. It’s a very pretty hub and for an additional charge is now available in a wide range of colors. This is really a fine US made hub for riders who aren’t so focused on low weight. It’s strong, has a large bearing capacity, it looks nice, has a Ti freehub, and the price is good. The design is simple too, and it’s easy to service. One bonus of the collar-with-set-screw method of adjustment, is that it is near impossible to make the preload too high. I think it’s the only hub in this review that has a steel axle. It’s easy to build solid wheelsets with the T11 that are in the 1350-1500g range, which makes them lighter than comparable factory wheels that are much more expensive.
  • Manufacturer: White Industries
  • Model: T11
  • Drive Mechanism: 24t steel drive ring, 3 steel pawls
  • Weight: 255 gr
  • Available drillings: 20/24/28/32/36
  • Bearing material and other bearing notes: Stainless
  • Bearing size, hub shell left: 6902
  • Bearing size, hub shell right: 6902
  • Combined hub shell Static load: 868
  • Bearing size, freehub body: Campag Custom 15x24x10 double row x2
  • Combined freehub body Static load: 876
  • Axle diameter: 15mm
  • Freehub body material: Ti
  • Available colors: Black, blue, gold, pink, purple, red, silver.
  • Price in USD: $318
  • Flange diameters, L/R: 40.5/55
  • Center to flange: 36/17
  • Bracing angle: 7.4/3.5
  • Tension differential: 48%
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Old 05-21-23, 05:58 PM
  #11  
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Not saying it will fit or anything but the T11s are fantastic hubs, I have been running one for quite a while on my road bike and no issues really solid and decent but not crazy engagement but plenty for me and I am not a lightweight rider in the least.

In terms of SRAM maddog34 they actually make some great products, I have been using Zipp bars and stems for quite a while (probably in total 6 bars and 2 stems) and their single speed brake levers are fantastic (2 of those) and their TT levers were also nice as well as the Avid SD7s being some of the nicest low cost long pull levers out there. Having ridden some bikes with new SRAM brakes, I can say while I probably wouldn't own them only due to fluid usage they are really good brakes with little service needed on them. Their AXS stuff is quite nice as well and I would happily own that without hesitation especially as Shimano is slow to bring out anything. Plus my RockShox fork has been great though I wish I had gotten something with a bit more travel but that isn't a fault of SRAM.

I know in the past SRAM minus Zipp and RS would never have even been considered but honestly I think they are doing OK, I still bleed Shimano blue but SRAM has been pretty excellent in their offerings lately and while yes like many companies they do make stupid things like those hubs, it is not unique to them and there are plenty of garbage hubs out there for one reason or another.
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Old 05-21-23, 09:48 PM
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Thank you for all the input on the T11 hubs. It dawned on me to take a look at the old, wrecked, rear wheel (original Giant). It has the same spoke count (20), they are also straight pull, 2mm diameter, and the flange offsets appear to be the same. Perhaps I can reuse this hub! The flange diameters are different so new spokes would be needed. The Giant flanges are smaller so longer spokes would be needed.

In looking at this page for measuring straight pull flanges:

https://spokecalc.io/measuring-a-straight-pull-hub.php
It is not a simple task!

As a potential simpler method how about removing one spoke from the old Giant wheel and replacing it with one from the Zipp wheel. It will be too short but I can see what addition length is needed by measuring from the end of the spoke to where it should be in the nipple. Repeat for other flange. Would this work?

Thanks
Rich

Edit: It dawns on me that this won't work as the internal diameters of the wheels will be different. But perhaps there is still a way....

Last edited by richas; 05-21-23 at 09:54 PM.
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Old 05-23-23, 08:29 AM
  #13  
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I removed the old hub from the original Giant rear wheel. Unfortunately it has damage from the crash, the spoke anchor points are distorted.

I am not finding the White Ind. T11 20H rear hubs in stock anywhere. Does anyone know of a 20H/130QR/Shimano11s rear hub?

Edit: Found Circus Monkey (Inspiring) Hubs, cheap and available. That is all I can say at this point.
https://www.cycletaiwan.com/circus-m...-rear-hub.html

Thanks again for all the help.

Last edited by richas; 05-23-23 at 09:20 AM.
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Old 05-23-23, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by richas
I removed the old hub from the original Giant rear wheel. Unfortunately it has damage from the crash, the spoke anchor points are distorted.

I am not finding the White Ind. T11 20H rear hubs in stock anywhere. Does anyone know of a 20H/130QR/Shimano11s rear hub?

Edit: Found Circus Monkey (Inspiring) Hubs, cheap and available. That is all I can say at this point.
https://www.cycletaiwan.com/circus-m...-rear-hub.html

Thanks again for all the help.
Never heard of that company but I am not really a fan of soft metals for cassette free hub bodies and not sure I would go for an unknown company. However T11s seem to be available from WI and you could always reach out to them and confirm, Lynette who I have talked with on many occasions is super nice and super helpful. A known quantity and also shipping from the US so even with delays could come faster than something from Taiwan.
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Old 05-23-23, 01:22 PM
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https://www.bikehubstore.com/RAR12-p/rar12.htm

20h in Black, competitive weight, competitive price. Iíve used a few other Bitex hubs and Iíve always been pleased with the quality.
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